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- #41
Wow brought back from the dead... that was from over 10 years ago. =]
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chucking in my 2 cents....
I have a 3FE and love it.
I would like to own a later model for the sake of the lockers..but have toyed with swapping in the later model axles because I love the 3FE and the old bus transmission.
I have been through this truck a LOT...ask CDan, he bought his slee stuff with what I ordered from him.
So, issues I know of:
- if your intake is dirty, old, cracked, or stiff rubber, you will have poor performance.
- if your belts are not OEM and properly tensioned you will have loud rides and poor performance.
- Fix the EFI relay with 10 gauge wire before it gets hot out. I still need to. Keep relays in the glovebox if you choose to wait.
- The center diff clunks a lot, keep tire pressures front and rear equal, grease your shafts (hehe) and your U-joints frequently and it minimizes it. If you leave 5 pounds difference front to rear in the tires, it will sound HORRIBLE.
- No lockers, so plan on putting an Aussie locker in the rear and an ARB up front or swapping in later model 80 axles with e-lockers (yummy).
- Oil plug in the side of the engine....fix it when you can, watch your oil until you fix it. HUGE issues if you miss it, no issues if it never happens
- Modify the exhaust to 2.5" and DO NOT screw with the intake. Stock is plenty, and you will get performance with just exhaust. Trust me, I have tried it all.
The cons are minor to me. Torque rocks at low speed, I get great performance at high speeds, take off, etc. I run 32s on stock gears. The later models are better on the road, but the return on investment is marginal given the higher prices. 3FEs are bulletproof.
If you plan on just buzzing around town and wheeling, get an FJ80.
If you plan on road tripping or commuting on the highway, get an FZJ80.
Dedicated wheeler? FJ80, hands down.
Other people will tell you that the full float rear end, disk brakes all around, and whopping 50 more horsepower are important. I will tell you it isn't. Then they will tell you they wheel the s*** out of their 80s way harder than I do and blah blah blah. I've wheeled my 80 throughout Mexico, Canada, and the U.S. I don't rock crawl it. I don't mud bog it. But I've wheeled it fairly hard. I've never NEEDED locked axles. Others will tell you that it is a necessity. That is up to you.
I only will own 91-92 FJ80s. Period. The motors, trannies, and lack of electrical are bombproof. The 93-97 are great rigs. I don't like the motor. I think it has inherent flaws to it. (HG, wiring harness, specifically). Others will say those things are blown out of proportion but if I'm buying a used rig that I have no idea about the quality of the previous ownership I sure would like to not have to worry about if the previous owner overheated it and blew the head gasket.
If there was no appreciable difference Toyota would not have spent the money on R&D and re-tooling for the FZJ. Don't think too hard about this. It seems so many members here are very worried about the s*** that can and eventually will go wrong with an old truck. If something worries me that much I don't allow it into my world. Shallow pockets and lack of mechanical aptitude are not favorable attributes of a guy who wants into this hobby.I've been lurking long enough, time to shop. Is the difference between rear axles that big of a deal? Drums and 15" wheels vs disc and full floating with 16"? This is something new to me I wasn't aware of.
Thanks!
...and sorry (not sorry) to bring back a 12 year old thread...
Sam
Also, how many miles is too many miles when looking to buy?
I second that. I feel the same way.I have 235k on my 3FE FJ80. I get about 12 mpg.
The 1FZ was a fine motor. And is a great motor if maintained. The guys that have 250k plus on their 1FZ motors have been anal retentive with maintenance. Even still the aluminum head expands at a different coefficient than the iron block. To me, it's a flawed design. Which may be why it existed in NA for only 4 years and they have redesigned the head gasket 2 (maybe more, someone else can chime in that knows better) times since it first came out.
The 3FE is indestructible. It is essentially the same motor design that Toyota had for 35 years with minor changes. I have run questionable gasoline (I hesitate to even call it that) in my 3FE without it skipping a beat. I've seen guys, in dire circumstances run paint thinner in it to get them to the next gas station (true story). Yes, it sounds like the offspring of a sewing machine and a John Deere but she runs.
As for going wherever the LR2 can go, well, the LR2 is a fine vehicle but it is nowhere near as capable as a stock 80 series. Period. He will have to worry about getting to where you are going.
My 3FE won't win any sprints but she'll win marathons. Life isn't about the destination, it's about the journey.
For the record, I have not always meticulously maintained my 3FE. I've kept it clean and rust free in the Midwest but I have not always changed the oil as recommended, I ran my last set of plugs at least 6-7 years. She hasn't been babied. She's been used and abused. And she gets driven every day. Wherever I want to go, she goes. Without hesitation.
If there was no appreciable difference Toyota would not have spent the money on R&D and re-tooling for the FZJ. Don't think too hard about this. It seems so many members here are very worried about the s*** that can and eventually will go wrong with an old truck. If something worries me that much I don't allow it into my world. Shallow pockets and lack of mechanical aptitude are not favorable attributes of a guy who wants into this hobby.
I have 235k on my 3FE FJ80. I get about 12 mpg.
The 1FZ was a fine motor. And is a great motor if maintained. The guys that have 250k plus on their 1FZ motors have been anal retentive with maintenance. Even still the aluminum head expands at a different coefficient than the iron block. To me, it's a flawed design. Which may be why it existed in NA for only 4 years and they have redesigned the head gasket 2 (maybe more, someone else can chime in that knows better) times since it first came out.
The 3FE is indestructible. It is essentially the same motor design that Toyota had for 35 years with minor changes. I have run questionable gasoline (I hesitate to even call it that) in my 3FE without it skipping a beat. I've seen guys, in dire circumstances run paint thinner in it to get them to the next gas station (true story). Yes, it sounds like the offspring of a sewing machine and a John Deere but she runs.
As for going wherever the LR2 can go, well, the LR2 is a fine vehicle but it is nowhere near as capable as a stock 80 series. Period. He will have to worry about getting to where you are going.
My 3FE won't win any sprints but she'll win marathons. Life isn't about the destination, it's about the journey.
For the record, I have not always meticulously maintained my 3FE. I've kept it clean and rust free in the Midwest but I have not always changed the oil as recommended, I ran my last set of plugs at least 6-7 years. She hasn't been babied. She's been used and abused. And she gets driven every day. Wherever I want to go, she goes. Without hesitation.
No ill will intended. Did you read snakeeater98's recent post where he surpassed 400k miles with his 97? He has never removed the head. It's not like the 1fz was the first of only a few engines that featured an aluminum head on an iron block. And it's not like the 1FZ is the only engine that had HG problems during that era. All manufacturers struggled especially when asbestos could no longer be used in gasket manufacturing. When I was shopping, I called Slee for advice. The only advice he would give is to buy the newest, lowest mileage 80 I could find/afford because both engines work hard due to being downshifted and run at high RPM in order to access what power it does have. 155hp or even 212hp in a truck that can weigh in at 6500 plus for a lot of us when loaded is just plane inadequate and bordering on unsafe. obviously the 3fe will struggle the most.You don't know me or anyone else's mechanical aptitude or wallet depth....that said, I post and ask in an attempt at starting with a pile of crap in the first place...no one wants to buy a vehicle unknowingly needing thousands of dollars worth of repair first thing....and no one wants to buy an inferior product if they can help it.
Your statement about Toyota not spending R&D money on appreciable differences....really? It's like saying, "That guy must be guilty because a cop arrested him." Name one manufacture that hasn't "updated" to a worse model inadvertently. Granted, Toyota is one of the best in the business at avoiding this, but they aren't immune by a stretch.
Again, I'm in for the long haul...just want to be sure what I buy fits the bill...and I'm a patient shopper. Have to be. There aren't many of these on the market and for good reason. I do appreciate your input though.
No ill will intended. Did you read snakeeater98's recent post where he surpassed 400k miles with his 97? He has never removed the head. It's not like the 1fz was the first of only a few engines that featured an aluminum head on an iron block. And it's not like the 1FZ is the only engine that had HG problems during that era. All manufacturers struggled especially when asbestos could no longer be used in gasket manufacturing. When I was shopping, I called Slee for advice. The only advice he would give is to buy the newest, lowest mileage 80 I could find/afford because both engines work hard due to being downshifted and run at high RPM in order to access what power it does have. 155hp or even 212hp in a truck that can weigh in at 6500 plus for a lot of us when loaded is just plane inadequate and bordering on unsafe. obviously the 3fe will struggle the most.
[quote author=DanKunz link=board=2;threadid=14725;start=msg142075#msg142075 date=1082462421]
- Oil plug in the side of the engine....fix it when you can, watch your oil until you fix it. HUGE issues if you miss it, no issues if it never happens
I'm sure you mean cometic, not cosmetic.
FYI California has the highest prices. My opinion is thAt ARB air lockers are superior to factory elockers. I have had both and the ARB's actuate instantly, there is no need to anticipate the need to lock up. Some guys will complain that ARB's are always having some issue like air leaks and such. I have dealt with air leaks but it's not a constant issue.Thanks for this! BTW...is there any way of bulletproofing this area of the engine? You know...like the 6.0 Ford Superduty guys figured out a way to update/upgrade those engines so they don't have headgasket issues, etc....anything for these?
I'm thinking the FZJ is the way to go...96 and 97 only...which will limit me obviously...though I can look for Lexus LX450s as well right? Looks like a trip to SoCal might be in order for looking. Locked or not I'm not that concerned with. Obviously with is a bonus...but seems guys are perfectly happy with ARB/Aussie units too if needed, and having installed in the aftermarket?
I'm trying to find one sub 200K miles...seems the best route to go...same time, I really do not want to plunk 12-18K on one either...would like to keep it under $8K if possibly, knowing full well it will need maintenance, upgrades, repairs, etc....and hell...maybe one day when funds are good and the rig is running right, I'll look for a factory S/C.
Thanks for this! BTW...is there any way of bulletproofing this area of the engine? You know...like the 6.0 Ford Superduty guys figured out a way to update/upgrade those engines so they don't have headgasket issues, etc....anything for these?