SO, if i weld my oun driveshaft
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Maybe you should practice on your Tie rod ends some more first... 
I just made my own rear driveshaft last week out of a beatup stock 3psd shaft and a length of 2.5" schedule 40 pipe. Got a stick of pipe from $30 from the local scrap yard.
1) Cut welds like for a cut n turn. Remove tube.
2) Fit pipe. Spot weld. Spin on homemade jig. True by sight, then with a dial indicator.
3) stitch weld to prevent warping.
4) done.
My pipe was somewhat pitted so I couldn't effectively use a dial indicator. Trued it by sight, welded it up and have been running it. 70mph with no noticeable driveshaft vibes. I set up a jig on my workbench with a third member and a large hunk of steel with a notch cut in it. Schedule 40 is over .2" thick. It worked so well I may pull my .25" square tube shaft and make another shaft this way, using the square tube as a spare for front and rear.
(hard to feel much over the 37" Irocks on beadlocks).
It is noticeably smoother than my old trail-beaten twisted driveshaft was on its last trip home from the trail.
Reference this Pirate thread: 2 1/2" Sch. 40 Pipe Drivelines Made Easy - Pirate4x4.Com Bulletin Board
I just made my own rear driveshaft last week out of a beatup stock 3psd shaft and a length of 2.5" schedule 40 pipe. Got a stick of pipe from $30 from the local scrap yard.
1) Cut welds like for a cut n turn. Remove tube.
2) Fit pipe. Spot weld. Spin on homemade jig. True by sight, then with a dial indicator.
3) stitch weld to prevent warping.
4) done.
My pipe was somewhat pitted so I couldn't effectively use a dial indicator. Trued it by sight, welded it up and have been running it. 70mph with no noticeable driveshaft vibes. I set up a jig on my workbench with a third member and a large hunk of steel with a notch cut in it. Schedule 40 is over .2" thick. It worked so well I may pull my .25" square tube shaft and make another shaft this way, using the square tube as a spare for front and rear.
(hard to feel much over the 37" Irocks on beadlocks).
It is noticeably smoother than my old trail-beaten twisted driveshaft was on its last trip home from the trail.
Reference this Pirate thread: 2 1/2" Sch. 40 Pipe Drivelines Made Easy - Pirate4x4.Com Bulletin Board
I guess if it does not rattle your teeth out at speed Jim, you should be good to go....
You will know if you need to have it "professionally welded" when the welds fail on the trail.....BTDT. I paid a STUPID amount of money to have a "special Toyota" driveshaft welded up by the driveline shop that used to use, only to have it tear right at the weld.
That was the last shaft that they assembled for me....
I have welded my drive shafts myself since repairing that one, (other than my rear High Angle 1350 CV) and many other for people, both in camp (remember that Texas?
) and at the shop....seem to still be going strong.
Get the yokes in phase and burn it together.
You will know if you need to have it "professionally welded" when the welds fail on the trail.....BTDT. I paid a STUPID amount of money to have a "special Toyota" driveshaft welded up by the driveline shop that used to use, only to have it tear right at the weld.
That was the last shaft that they assembled for me....I have welded my drive shafts myself since repairing that one, (other than my rear High Angle 1350 CV) and many other for people, both in camp (remember that Texas?
) and at the shop....seem to still be going strong.Get the yokes in phase and burn it together.
Sounds pretty cool, especially if you can get it straight and "square" like youre talking about.....
Using pipe for a drive shaft tho.....hmmmmm. Most metal experts would argue that pipe should never be used. Tubing is the stuff of choice...but if it works
Using pipe for a drive shaft tho.....hmmmmm. Most metal experts would argue that pipe should never be used. Tubing is the stuff of choice...but if it works
no vibes call it good, diy no problem
.... and it doesn't vibrate,
do you still get it balanced??....
Well I certainly wouldn't because the only thing you'd gain is a lighter wallet.
PS. I don't have a single balancing weight on any of my wheel rims for the same reason.
I know tyre fitters usually balance wheels for free but I'd have to pay for it because I always fit my own tyres now. (Getting given a new BFG tyre with a serious split on the inside wall -- that I didn't discover till after all warrenty obligations had expired -- led me to this.) In fact, as I get older I find I'm in great danger of becoming seriously paranoid. (I know I can share these innermost secrets here because I'm amongst the similarly-afflicted.)
Jim-
Dude you're an awesome welder.....HOWEVER:
If the DS isn't 100% properly balanced, you're going to shorten the life of your output shaft bearing and your pinion bearing.....
Spend the $$ on the shaft at a pro shop.....rather than replace bearings on the trail!
Good to see ya today!
Dude you're an awesome welder.....HOWEVER:
If the DS isn't 100% properly balanced, you're going to shorten the life of your output shaft bearing and your pinion bearing.....
Spend the $$ on the shaft at a pro shop.....rather than replace bearings on the trail!
Good to see ya today!
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I guess if it does not rattle your teeth out at speed Jim, you should be good to go....
You will know if you need to have it "professionally welded" when the welds fail on the trail.....BTDT. I paid a STUPID amount of money to have a "special Toyota" driveshaft welded up by the driveline shop that used to use, only to have it tear right at the weld.
I have welded my drive shafts myself since repairing that one, (other than my rear High Angle 1350 CV) and many other for people, both in camp (remember that Texas?
Get the yokes in phase and burn it together.
when i had my 60 shafts done, both front and rear. it cost me close to 300 bones to retube and balance.
was that 2much?
I don’t know man....
Drive shaft stuff is so inconsistent from one place or region in the country to the next.......and usually, as soon as you mention the word Toyota to these people, the price increases exponentially.
I guess considering what I have paid for similar work it is not that crazy, but you know that there are places/shops that would have done the same work for less than half that.
Pretty sure Degnol has a drive shaft guy.....and he does not live in MN. and come to think of it, Texican has told me he knows a guy that builds drive shafts for less than other shops...
It is just like everything else Jim....Look around and you may find someone good hidden someplace...
Drive shaft stuff is so inconsistent from one place or region in the country to the next.......and usually, as soon as you mention the word Toyota to these people, the price increases exponentially.
I guess considering what I have paid for similar work it is not that crazy, but you know that there are places/shops that would have done the same work for less than half that.
Pretty sure Degnol has a drive shaft guy.....and he does not live in MN.
and come to think of it, Texican has told me he knows a guy that builds drive shafts for less than other shops...It is just like everything else Jim....Look around and you may find someone good hidden someplace...
Here's my mathmagician work....someone check me here!
This arithmetic is based on a generic 35" tire and 4.10:1 gearing ratio.
Circumfrence of a 35" tire is: 109.96 inches (diameter * 3.1415)
Tire revs / mile figured by: (5280ft x 12) / 109.96" = 576.2 Revs / Mile
For every 4.1 revolutions of the driveshaft, the tire does one....so:
Driveshaft is having to spin 2362.42 times for every mile traveled with a 35" tire covering 109.96 inches each revolution.
Figured here: 576.2 x 4.1 = 2362.42
Tire RPM x Gear Ratio in = Driveshaft RPMile
Lets say you covered that mile in a minute (@ 60mph)....not too hard to do with 35's. That means the driveshaft is spinning @ 2362.42 RPM!
I don't think you'd want your driveshaft to be spinning that fast and not be 100% balanced and true.
Just a little heads-up. You don't want it self-destructing underneath your truck and go thru the floorboard at 60mph.....which I've had happen- personally!
This arithmetic is based on a generic 35" tire and 4.10:1 gearing ratio.
Circumfrence of a 35" tire is: 109.96 inches (diameter * 3.1415)
Tire revs / mile figured by: (5280ft x 12) / 109.96" = 576.2 Revs / Mile
For every 4.1 revolutions of the driveshaft, the tire does one....so:
Driveshaft is having to spin 2362.42 times for every mile traveled with a 35" tire covering 109.96 inches each revolution.
Figured here: 576.2 x 4.1 = 2362.42
Tire RPM x Gear Ratio in = Driveshaft RPMile
Lets say you covered that mile in a minute (@ 60mph)....not too hard to do with 35's. That means the driveshaft is spinning @ 2362.42 RPM!
I don't think you'd want your driveshaft to be spinning that fast and not be 100% balanced and true.
Just a little heads-up. You don't want it self-destructing underneath your truck and go thru the floorboard at 60mph.....which I've had happen- personally!
Just thought I'd throw this in here for those running 31" tires.
31” tire is 97.38Inches in Circumfrence
(5280 * 12 ) / 97.38 = 650.64 Tire Rotations / Mile
4.1 : 1 gearing = 650.65 x 4.1 = 2667.62 Rotations / Mile
Meaning your driveshaft is spinning @ 2667 RPM at 60mph!
Take good care of the u-joints
31” tire is 97.38Inches in Circumfrence
(5280 * 12 ) / 97.38 = 650.64 Tire Rotations / Mile
4.1 : 1 gearing = 650.65 x 4.1 = 2667.62 Rotations / Mile
Meaning your driveshaft is spinning @ 2667 RPM at 60mph!
Take good care of the u-joints
Quote: "Trued it by sight, welded it up and have been running it. 70mph with no noticeable driveshaft vibes. I set up a jig on my workbench with a third member and a large hunk of steel with a notch cut in it."
You must have some damn good eyes!!
This thread got me thinking
@ 70 miles / hour....in a Land Cruiser with an output drive ratio of 1:1 (no overdrive).....your driveshaft/engine is spinning at 3112.28 RPM! Not too shabby for an eye-sight balance job I must say!
You must have some damn good eyes!!
This thread got me thinking
@ 70 miles / hour....in a Land Cruiser with an output drive ratio of 1:1 (no overdrive).....your driveshaft/engine is spinning at 3112.28 RPM! Not too shabby for an eye-sight balance job I must say!
But on the other hand - The diameter of the driveshaft is very small in comparison to that of a tyre. And so, despite the shaft spinning faster, the centrifugal force produced by out-of-balance-mass would tend to be less. (There are always multiple arguments available in support of any point of view.)
And how can bearings be damaged by forces that are so small they are incapable of being noticed (in the form of vibrations)?
And if 2badfj's shaft had been welded and balanced by a "professional" - Would it have been done better or worse? (I can't rate his workmanship any more than he can rate mine.)
In New Zealand, lawyers handling conveyancing (buying and selling properties) lead the general public to believe that they make the process safer (than doing it yourself). But then they delegate the work to lowly paid "office assistants" and it becomes a good money-earner for them. I think there are parallels here.
(But saying all this doesn't mean I'd make a steering rod in the way 2badfj mentions in his other post!
)
And how can bearings be damaged by forces that are so small they are incapable of being noticed (in the form of vibrations)?
And if 2badfj's shaft had been welded and balanced by a "professional" - Would it have been done better or worse? (I can't rate his workmanship any more than he can rate mine.)
In New Zealand, lawyers handling conveyancing (buying and selling properties) lead the general public to believe that they make the process safer (than doing it yourself). But then they delegate the work to lowly paid "office assistants" and it becomes a good money-earner for them. I think there are parallels here.
(But saying all this doesn't mean I'd make a steering rod in the way 2badfj mentions in his other post!
)
Having made dozens of driveshafts with v-blocks, DOM and a lathe and welder I offer this logic.
Buy a fancy expensive driveshaft, put it in and it doesn't vibrate or cause other issues. It must be good, you paid a "professional" to build it.
Build a cheap fancy driveshaft in your shop, put it in and it doesn't vibrate or cause other issues. Why would you question it? Because it didn't cost enough?
I paid for a few nice shafts and broke them all. I built a few bad shafts and broke them all. Then I went and watched a professional. Now I build fine shafts with the same techniques and find that attention to detail is necessary but it can be done just fine at home. I had a couple of mine checked at the "professional shop" and they came out just fine.
Buy a fancy expensive driveshaft, put it in and it doesn't vibrate or cause other issues. It must be good, you paid a "professional" to build it.
Build a cheap fancy driveshaft in your shop, put it in and it doesn't vibrate or cause other issues. Why would you question it? Because it didn't cost enough?
I paid for a few nice shafts and broke them all. I built a few bad shafts and broke them all. Then I went and watched a professional. Now I build fine shafts with the same techniques and find that attention to detail is necessary but it can be done just fine at home. I had a couple of mine checked at the "professional shop" and they came out just fine.
Cruiserdrew
On the way there
You might consider getting the rear one welded and balanced professionally. I have no doubt you can weld it yourself, but getting it square and exactly in phase is easier with the jigs they use to build shafts. The front shaft probably does not matter, does not need to be balanced, and it a good DIY candidate.
Fortunately, we have a very good local place who does not mind Toyota stuff and whose charges are very reasonable. They use DOM for the shafts and will upsize the tube thickness for about $10 extra.
To clarify, technique involved making jigs which is not difficult. Truing with a lathe is also not difficult with measuring instruments. I guess now that I think about it I had more tools then the normal DIYer. I guess I would fall in to the professional side of building myself.
i just paid 155 to have my rear shaft lengthened, i thought it was i bit high but then again its not my field of expertise so no idea of the going prices.
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Maybe you should practice on your Tie rod ends some more first...
I just made my own rear driveshaft last week out of a beatup stock 3psd shaft and a length of 2.5" schedule 40 pipe. Got a stick of pipe from $30 from the local scrap yard.
1) Cut welds like for a cut n turn. Remove tube.
2) Fit pipe. Spot weld. Spin on homemade jig. True by sight, then with a dial indicator.
3) stitch weld to prevent warping.
4) done.
My pipe was somewhat pitted so I couldn't effectively use a dial indicator. Trued it by sight, welded it up and have been running it. 70mph with no noticeable driveshaft vibes. I set up a jig on my workbench with a third member and a large hunk of steel with a notch cut in it. Schedule 40 is over .2" thick. It worked so well I may pull my .25" square tube shaft and make another shaft this way, using the square tube as a spare for front and rear.
(hard to feel much over the 37" Irocks on beadlocks).
It is noticeably smoother than my old trail-beaten twisted driveshaft was on its last trip home from the trail.
Reference this Pirate thread: 2 1/2" Sch. 40 Pipe Drivelines Made Easy - Pirate4x4.Com Bulletin Board
Post up a picture of te jig you made. I would liek to make one myself.
I made my own front drive shaft with some scheduled pipe for the front. Cut the old shaft at the welds and welded in my own pipe. Works great and twice as thick and strong as the stock shaft. If I can figure out how to make a jig, I'll do my rear.
Look at the link in the text you quoted above. That is a serious jig.
The one I jury rigged was just a third member, held in place by my vice on a workbench, and a piece of 2x5 rectangle tube with a notch cut in the end for the shaft to ride in.
You can get good results just tacking the shaft, and bolting it into the truck, spinning and truing by eye or with a dial indicator.
The one I jury rigged was just a third member, held in place by my vice on a workbench, and a piece of 2x5 rectangle tube with a notch cut in the end for the shaft to ride in.
You can get good results just tacking the shaft, and bolting it into the truck, spinning and truing by eye or with a dial indicator.
i always say to my self, "if i have to ask how to do something, allow some one else to do it that knows what they are doing."
i paid $80 bucks to have a toyota driveshaft extended 5"
just shop around local driveshaft shops, find some good customer testimonials and a good price. The guys i use, work on 3-5 ton trucks all day, i think i would trust their welds any day over a ma and pop shop.
i paid $80 bucks to have a toyota driveshaft extended 5"
just shop around local driveshaft shops, find some good customer testimonials and a good price. The guys i use, work on 3-5 ton trucks all day, i think i would trust their welds any day over a ma and pop shop.