Residential outside 2 post lift?

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I’m wanting to pour a concrete slab (properly rated), and put in a 2 post lift (properly installed), on my property. Due to my land and where I want it, it would not be closed in, but I plan on a 12’ open carport placed over. This would be a standalone slab and would later add a driveway to it with a closed in shop for tools and roller doors on each side to drive through.

Looking for non industrial examples and ideas/insight from who have done similar. Also looking for the sizes people have done this with, I think I can get 14’x24’ but not sure if that’s too small.

Use case are larger SUVs (Land Cruiser) Thank you!
 
Not sure if you're asking about slab designs or lifts? It all depends on your ground conditions but 6" of 4000 psi concrete with something like 12x12 inches of thickened edge would be fine for most 10k or 12k 2 post lifts. I would use a minimum of 2 #4 rebar 6" apart in the thickened edge (with tied together, bent corners) and welded wire mesh in the overall slab. Depending on finish desired on the slab you could add fibermesh which will help with cracking. You will want 4 to 6" of #57 stone under the slab and if you are intending to eventually enclose the slab and possibly add heating or air then you will want a poly barrier between the stone and slab.

Soil condition/preparation is paramount though. You need well compacted ground with no organic material. So if you have to excavate and backfill will a sand/clay backfill material then do so.

There is no need for most lifts to add any additional thickness or rebar where the posts are going if you have 6" of 4000 psi concrete. Make sure to cover the slab and moisture cure for a minimum of 14 days - and preferably longer.
 
Not sure if you're asking about slab designs or lifts? It all depends on your ground conditions but 6" of 4000 psi concrete with something like 12x12 inches of thickened edge would be fine for most 10k or 12k 2 post lifts. I would use a minimum of 2 #4 rebar 6" apart in the thickened edge (with tied together, bent corners) and welded wire mesh in the overall slab. Depending on finish desired on the slab you could add fibermesh which will help with cracking. You will want 4 to 6" of #57 stone under the slab and if you are intending to eventually enclose the slab and possibly add heating or air then you will want a poly barrier between the stone and slab.

Soil condition/preparation is paramount though. You need well compacted ground with no organic material. So if you have to excavate and backfill will a sand/clay backfill material then do so.

There is no need for most lifts to add any additional thickness or rebar where the posts are going if you have 6" of 4000 psi concrete. Make sure to cover the slab and moisture cure for a minimum of 14 days - and preferably longer.
Appreciate the advice.

I guess I didn’t word it well, but I’m looking for recommendations on lifts and other considerations (110v or 220v?) and examples. Also wondering if 16x24 is fine for an fj80 or if I could get away with smaller or needed bigger.

Also, looking for pictures of setups. Thanks!
 
Do rea up on the lift articles in the workshop and other stuff forum. Lots of good musings over there.

I'll get all kinds of flame for this, but IMHO, if you aren't concerned about space, a four post, drive on lift might serve you better than a two post, asymmetrical lift. Nolen will tell you I'm dead wrong, as will a couple of other notables here, but big trucks can't fall off four post drive on lifts, and if you work alone, that's something to consider.

Also, the lift only needs to be supported below the posts, regardless of how many there are. The floor around those piers, and they have to be sized properly to carry the post load, is there for you to walk on, nothing more – unless you live on the west coast, a 4,000–psi concrete floor will cost you as much as the building, and won't be required. It is out there, due to seismic codes.
 
The floor around those piers, and they have to be sized properly to carry the post load, is there for you to walk on, nothing more – unless you live on the west coast, a 4,000–psi concrete floor will cost you as much as the building, and won't be required. It is out there, due to seismic codes.
I really don't understand this part of your post. 4000 psi concrete cost something like $10 more per yd than $3000 psi so when you figure in the labor to form and place it is inconsequential. Yes, you don't need 4000 psi but you're penny wise and pound foolish to go with anything less. And what does "It is out there due to seismic codes" mean? We don't have any seismic codes in Alabama that I'm aware of. And if we do it wouldn't change my opinion.
 
The OP failed to say very much specifically about what he wanted and nothing about where he is, which matters.

Most concrete sold in the south, which has no seismic requirements for high strength concrete, is 2,500psi. Some mix plants sell 3k psi as the low rated mixes, because of special construction in their areas, which require higher strength mixes, so it makes more sense for them to plan those recipes. Doing so saves them time in planning and QC, which saves them money in the long run. And they simply pass the upcharge onto their customers, who they care very little for anyway.

3-4k psi mix cost is twice that for 2.5k , although not much different between the two higher rated mixes. You get no extra value for a higher rated mix, just higher cost, unless your specific load requirements necessitate it.

The west coast has unique seismic codes due to geological instability west of the mountains. That's why they also have registered SEs, which don't exist east of the mountains, excepting Chicago (which thinks it's all of Illinois, in that regard). That includes Alaska, as well.

Yes, you should use higher strength concrete in foundation piers, but placing a thick floor with high strength concrete rather than constructing foundation piers isn't engineering, it's guesswork. And wrong. Yes, GCs probably do it often, and it's still wrong, because it's wasteful and doesn't take into consideration the particular load bearing requirements of the floor loading. Placing an outdoor pad can be done on cut soil, if it's sound, and the pad would not need to be thicker than the average load on it required it to be. And, if it was in the south, where we don't have to worry about frost heave, it'd be fine.

Yes, common practice is to remove soil and replace it with compacted fill and baselayer, but that's just practice, not gospel. It's done because engineers are lazy, when they're not pressed for time, and lawyers are everywhere. If I wanted to make absolutely certain any site, not a particular site, but a generic site (which doesn't exist except on paper) would support a generic floor design, I'd specify exactly what I just described. If I had a good client who had a good owner's engineer representing his interests, I wouldn't be allowed to get away with it. I'd have to provide calculations based on actual soil samples from his site and tailor the design to match those characteristics and I'd have to back up my design recommendations with a cost analysis. I know all of this: I used to do it for a living.

I had no intention on writing a diatribe when I sat down, but we've been over this before and it's late and I've too many things on my mind at present and my hands were on autopilot.
 
The OP failed to say very much specifically about what he wanted and nothing about where he is, which matters.

Most concrete sold in the south, which has no seismic requirements for high strength concrete, is 2,500psi. Some mix plants sell 3k psi as the low rated mixes, because of special construction in their areas, which require higher strength mixes, so it makes more sense for them to plan those recipes. Doing so saves them time in planning and QC, which saves them money in the long run. And they simply pass the upcharge onto their customers, who they care very little for anyway.

3-4k psi mix cost is twice that for 2.5k , although not much different between the two higher rated mixes. You get no extra value for a higher rated mix, just higher cost, unless your specific load requirements necessitate it.

The west coast has unique seismic codes due to geological instability west of the mountains. That's why they also have registered SEs, which don't exist east of the mountains, excepting Chicago (which thinks it's all of Illinois, in that regard). That includes Alaska, as well.

Yes, you should use higher strength concrete in foundation piers, but placing a thick floor with high strength concrete rather than constructing foundation piers isn't engineering, it's guesswork. And wrong. Yes, GCs probably do it often, and it's still wrong, because it's wasteful and doesn't take into consideration the particular load bearing requirements of the floor loading. Placing an outdoor pad can be done on cut soil, if it's sound, and the pad would not need to be thicker than the average load on it required it to be. And, if it was in the south, where we don't have to worry about frost heave, it'd be fine.

Yes, common practice is to remove soil and replace it with compacted fill and baselayer, but that's just practice, not gospel. It's done because engineers are lazy, when they're not pressed for time, and lawyers are everywhere. If I wanted to make absolutely certain any site, not a particular site, but a generic site (which doesn't exist except on paper) would support a generic floor design, I'd specify exactly what I just described. If I had a good client who had a good owner's engineer representing his interests, I wouldn't be allowed to get away with it. I'd have to provide calculations based on actual soil samples from his site and tailor the design to match those characteristics and I'd have to back up my design recommendations with a cost analysis. I know all of this: I used to do it for a living.

I had no intention on writing a diatribe when I sat down, but we've been over this before and it's late and I've too many things on my mind at present and my hands were on autopilot.
Yes I’m in FL. and I didn’t specify because I will just follow the manufacturer requirements of whichever lift I choose (properly installed disclaimer in my op) lol
 
Most concrete sold in the south, which has no seismic requirements for high strength concrete, is 2,500psi.

3-4k psi mix cost is twice that for 2.5k , although not much different between the two higher rated mixes. You get no extra value for a higher rated mix, just higher cost, unless your specific load requirements necessitate it.
I'm sorry but I there is no way that 4000 psi is 2x the price of 2500. Not sure anyone sells anything less than 3000 here anyway but this is typical of the spread that I have encountered on two major pours in the last 3 years (20+ yards and 10 yards).

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My $10 per yard spread between 3000 and 4000 was consistent over those two pours and the second pour was fibermesh which IIRC cost $8 per yard more. When you throw in the cost of site prep, forming and labor that's insignificant.
 
Yes I’m in FL. and I didn’t specify because I will just follow the manufacturer requirements of whichever lift I choose (properly installed disclaimer in my op) lol
You'll find that every manufacturer specifies a pier size and concrete strength for it for each given size of lift. Depending where you are in Florida, there may be additional wind strength requirements that you should consider. An opinion from a qualified civil engineer who specializes in structural design won't cost you very much, and will save you money in the long run. For instance, you'd think that a location near the coast (and the code specifies 50 miles as "near") would be safe if you placed a structure on the back side of a building away from the prevailing winds. Counterintuitvely, this is where the wind pressure is the second highest, due to pressure differential.

An asymmetrical list might not be any problem no matter the location, but a four post, drive–on lift, if left raised above grade might. These are the questions you should put to your engineer.
 
There's a guy down the road from me that has a 2-post lift outside next to his low-ceiling garage. He keeps covers over the lift posts when he's not using it. It must be a huge PITA to have to make 1000 trips back and forth to fetch tools and parts, plus here in NH he only gets to use it about 6 months of the year, and when it's not raining. I see you are in Florida, so at least you get 12 months of use, but I hear it does rain down there occasionally.

I have the 7000-lb rated Quickjack, and I love it. I made custom lifting blocks for it, and it lifts the Cruiser great, very stable and safe. Even with a mild BP-51 lift, it raises it enough to put the wheel hubs at a comfortable position. The jacks are heavy, but I found a better set of wheels for them that make moving them easier. I put the pump on an old castered printer stand to make it easier to move around. My garage floor is very smooth and I have 11' ceilings.

Rather than fight about what concrete and how thick, just contact the lift manufacturer, see went they recommend. They will do all the engineering for you.
 
There's a guy down the road from me that has a 2-post lift outside next to his low-ceiling garage. He keeps covers over the lift posts when he's not using it. It must be a huge PITA to have to make 1000 trips back and forth to fetch tools and parts, plus here in NH he only gets to use it about 6 months of the year, and when it's not raining. I see you are in Florida, so at least you get 12 months of use, but I hear it does rain down there occasionally.

I have the 7000-lb rated Quickjack, and I love it. I made custom lifting blocks for it, and it lifts the Cruiser great, very stable and safe. Even with a mild BP-51 lift, it raises it enough to put the wheel hubs at a comfortable position. The jacks are heavy, but I found a better set of wheels for them that make moving them easier. I put the pump on an old castered printer stand to make it easier to move around. My garage floor is very smooth and I have 11' ceilings.

Rather than fight about what concrete and how thick, just contact the lift manufacturer, see went they recommend. They will do all the engineering for you.
Glad you mentioned the quickjack. I did want to know if the 7k capacity is fine for the top end of an 80 build, and if the 4ft lift height is actually any better than just a jack and stands
 
I have a Rotary SPOA10. It was installed on an existing 6" thick slab. Here are the recommended concrete minimum thicknesses and PSI for 3 different Hilti anchor types. This is a cut and paste from the Rotary installation manual for their SPOA7 through SPOA10 lifts. I looked at several different lift manufacturers and they all had similar foundation requirements except for Mohawk which is a two post lift design without an overhead tie assembly. IIRC it required quite a bit more concrete than the others.

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If your anchors don't torque to the minimum specified then you are supposed to bust out the concrete and repour per the following:

1790527146513.webp


Are you planning on leaving this outdoors forever with a shop adjacent or are you eventually going to incorporate the lift into a future shop build? Sounds like the former which is too bad. Most of these lifts really belong indoors.
 
Glad you mentioned the quickjack. I did want to know if the 7k capacity is fine for the top end of an 80 build, and if the 4ft lift height is actually any better than just a jack and stands
It doesn't lift 4', it's only about 18-20". Gets the tires about 4-5" off the floor at the highest.

These things are very overbuilt.
 
It doesn't lift 4', it's only about 18-20". Gets the tires about 4-5" off the floor at the highest.

These things are very overbuilt.
ah I was thinking of max jack. Is quickjack worth it for doing what my Jack stands and Jack do? Or is it just ease of use and slightly time saving / safer.
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ah I was thinking of max jack. Is quickjack worth it for doing what my Jack stands and Jack do? Or is it just ease of use and slightly time saving / safer.

It depends on what you're doing.

If you're just working on one wheel, then the jack and a stand is faster and fine.

When I do an oil change on any of my vehicles, it's up on the Quickjack, so I can also do a 5-tire rotation, check all the brakes, plus grease all the shafts. I can easily slide under the truck on my creeper.

Same would apply if you're doing knuckles or pulling a diff.

Edit: probably doesn't apply in your case, but when I had my Miata, the Quickjack made oil changes so much easier. No way you're getting under that car without lifting it up, and it is not easy to put in stands, very limited jacking points.

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I have a Rotary SPOA10. It was installed on an existing 6" thick slab. Here are the recommended concrete minimum thicknesses and PSI for 3 different Hilti anchor types. This is a cut and paste from the Rotary installation manual for their SPOA7 through SPOA10 lifts. I looked at several different lift manufacturers and they all had similar foundation requirements except for Mohawk which is a two post lift design without an overhead tie assembly. IIRC it required quite a bit more concrete than the others.

View attachment 4220226

If your anchors don't torque to the minimum specified then you are supposed to bust out the concrete and repour per the following:

View attachment 4220229

Are you planning on leaving this outdoors forever with a shop adjacent or are you eventually going to incorporate the lift into a future shop build? Sounds like the former which is too bad. Most of these lifts really belong indoors.
I intend on closing it in as a shop as money/time allows.
 
I intend on closing it in as a shop as money/time allows.
Then you definitely should pour the slab as large as you intend to make the shop and you should incorporate perimeter footings.

So why do you feel compelled to spend the money on a slab and a lift first instead of a slab and a building shell - or at least a slab and a roof that you can wall in at some point? Just curious.
 
Then you definitely should pour the slab as large as you intend to make the shop and you should incorporate perimeter footings.

So why do you feel compelled to spend the money on a slab and a lift first instead of a slab and a building shell - or at least a slab and a roof that you can wall in at some point? Just curious.
So my property and situation is weird. I have the space and capability to do this where I live, but I am limited to a 16x24 or longer but not any wider area. And even then the driveway leading up to this area will be a 12ft space in between my house and my neighbors fence. the shop will.be built starting after where I clear my house. So I will either have to have the lift set off center or have to turn a little each time to center up

That being said, my plan is to pour the slab first (quoted 2.5k), have a carport delivered and installed (3k quoted), then have the lift installed (quoted 3k for the apluslift 10k)

Then as money comes in I will close it in myself or have the carport company close it in for me and outfit it as a small shop with this for inspiration (same size) but with a workbench at front and tool chests in rear

IMG_9859.webp
 
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