Ineos Grenadier (1 Viewer)

[thatcabledude]

Although on another note, in my opinion, this is exactly the dream 4x4 I would have. BMW has an extremely reliable inline 6 gasser, and the ZF auto gearbox is super fast and super good and robust. It’s been proven in several high horsepower cars as a good transmission. You are supposed to be able to hose out the floors too, and the buttons are solid and not some weird touch screen thing. Apparently the seats are manual, which is something I love. Automatic seats seem like something that exists for no reason. It’s slower, heavier, and less reliable than manual seats. The look is also amazing, and it has double solid axles, which is very rare in the USA. It may take a few years for the kinks to work out, but it has the potential to be one of the most reliable trucks in America, especially with the land cruiser leaving.

You sound like you went to their salesman seminar over the long weekend.

 

[Pura Vida]

Ineos is a pretty big and rich company. They have some pretty major sponsors, including the title sponsor for the sub 2 hour marathon, and a major sponsor for the Mercedes AMG F1 team. Here it appears they are trying to work with Hyundai to make hydrogen cells or something. I think this is gonna try to be a mainstream vehicle eventually, and it could work if they use effective marketing. I can see it starting out expensive, then becoming a little more affordable. Or maybe they only begin with selling high trim models, and make low trims later on

 

[300blk]

I’m actually curious how they won the lawsuit when Land Rover accused them of copying the Defender design, but Mahindra lost when FCA accused them of copying their design.

 

[Pura Vida]

I’m actually curious how they won the lawsuit when Land Rover accused them of copying the Defender design, but Mahindra lost when FCA accused them of copying their design.

Probably when they pointed out a square isn’t a unique design

 

[hobbes]

I just cannot see these selling for $50k unless they are taking a big loss. They don't have the economy of scale of a large manufacturer so the cost of the every single R&D has to be absorbed by this model. I'll be surprised if they can get it under $75k. That the entire powertrain (engine, trans, xfer, axles) is contracted out from other sources does help though. Those were mostly off the shelf things.

 

[Pura Vida]

I just cannot see these selling for $50k unless they are taking a big loss. They don't have the economy of scale of a large manufacturer so the cost of the every single R&D has to be absorbed by this model. I'll be surprised if they can get it under $75k. That the entire powertrain (engine, trans, xfer, axles) is contracted out from other sources does help though. Those were mostly off the shelf things.

It’s supposed to be relatively simple and easy to fix. I agree it will be hard to make it affordable, but it’s not gonna be a G wagon. Think more of like a 70. Still expensive and rugged but not as much as it could be. I don’t see it going over 80k, especially when they said 40k base price. I know that’s still extremely expensive but you have to remember: this thing won’t have power seats. Stuff like that will keep the price manageable I think. 50k seems like a realistic goal, but I wouldn’t be surprised if it goes above

 

[hobbes]

Isn't a 70 series more like $70k US? And those have been using the same tooling for a couple decades. You can get a stripped down 4Runner for under $40k US. Dunno...

Even with off the shelf stuff, I'm sure it'll take a couple years to iron out the bugs...

 

[Pura Vida]

Isn't a 70 series more like $70k US? And those have been using the same tooling for a couple decades. You can get a stripped down 4Runner for under $40k US. Dunno...

Even with off the shelf stuff, I'm sure it'll take a couple years to iron out the bugs...

Yea the 70 is still extremely expensive, but like I said earlier, not as much as the G wagon. I think they are trying to fill the void of the defender as an expedition vehicle instead of a weekend off roader. Since Ineos is a chemical company and not a car manufacturer, there will 100% be bugs, and I would not recommend anyone buy the first model year, but at the same time, it’s almost revolutionary for the US market. The last time we got something similar was the defender for a brief period in the 90s, and the rest of the off-roaders have either been trucks out of Detroit, or IFS mall crawlers. I wouldn’t compare this to a 4Runner, I would compare it more to the bronco and wrangler if I had to be honest. It’s kind of rivaling high trim wranglers and Broncos. Both very capable vehicles.

 

[hobbes]

I didn't mean to compare capabilities. I was just pulling the price out of a stripped down SUV that a major manufacturer supplies for a "this is as cheap as it gets". But that's just being lazy on my part.

Still not convinced they'll get this into the NA market (crash testing, EPA commissars, dealer network, etc).

 

[Pura Vida]

Found a third party hands on look. I’m looking foreword to Doug Demuro’s take on it though. He has really good and really insightful videos with a lot of knowledge in them.

 

[Bryanseye]

I didn't mean to compare capabilities. I was just pulling the price out of a stripped down SUV that a major manufacturer supplies for a "this is as cheap as it gets". But that's just being lazy on my part.

Still not convinced they'll get this into the NA market (crash testing, EPA commissars, dealer network, etc).

And insurance.

 

[roscoFJ73]

I’m actually curious how they won the lawsuit when Land Rover accused them of copying the Defender design, but Mahindra lost when FCA accused them of copying their design.

Probably when they pointed out a square isn’t a unique design

This is what happened. The court asked LR to identify what Ineos were copying and the court decided that 4wds are generally shaped like that because of necessity. It really only shares a Defender's dimensions approximately and the longer you look at the Ineos, the less it looks like a Defender
The FCA vs Mahindra decision was later overturned by Mahindra on appeal.

 

[retrofive]

Every time I read this thread title I think of.....

 

[TWILLY]

Found a third party hands on look. I’m looking foreword to Doug Demuro’s take on it though. He has really good and really insightful videos with a lot of knowledge in them.

This says 45K pounds -- low $60s U.S.D.

 

[hobbes]

Wonder if then you got to add on that stupid chicken tax, or if the second row seats get them out of it. If they got to add it, that then gets you to $75k.

 

[Pura Vida]

Wonder if then you got to add on that stupid chicken tax, or if the second row seats get them out of it. If they got to add it, that then gets you to $75k.

Pretty sure chicken tax is only for light trucks with beds. They could get away with calling it an SUV and not a truck

 

[MrMikeyG]

When I watched the "exterior reveal" video, all I could think of was a more modern defender 110. I like it.

https://static.wixstatic.com/media/b743d4_77c4e551fe3242a697a2c747954db5c0~mv2.jpg/v1/fill/w_1000,h_714,al_c,q_85/HTHQmjoSjk7aIt8pv0AaW55DpjK91bYDdlljPccUiguOCYg4QEms9hL07sXOgBWiuOIcvmP9y0foQWKdZIQwLw%3D%3D.jpg

 

[Pura Vida]

Although it’s still British so beware of electrical stuff hehe

 

[roscoFJ73]

Legend has it Americans wont ride in it unless it has extra large cup holders. So they are going to design a new interior for them

 

[mloudy]

Legend has it Americans wont ride in it unless it has extra large cup holders. So they are going to design a new interior for them

If offered the option of a set of cup holders or a fire extinguisher I think most Americans would take the cup holders.