How difficult is a 2F rebuild? (1 Viewer)

[jestlurnin]

I know that’s a relative question….

I’m not totally sure I trust my skills to do this but I really have a hankering to tackle a rebuild. I have 2 sitting on engine stands in the garage including the original one out of my 45.

I’ve pulled 4 or 5 2F’s outa 40’s, 60’s and 45’s as well as putting them in. All with the trans attached. I’d say the most technical thing I’ve done is a front axle rebuild. Never changed a clutch or rebuilt a transfer case etc.

I know there is some pretty serious expense involved with sourcing parts and machining and probably some new tools so if this is a skill that should not be tackled by a novice I’d like to know up front.

All opinions welcome!

 

[hobbes]

This is one of many good threads you can thumb through.

How NOT to restore the FJ40

An FJ40 Cruiser has taken up long term residence in the shop. The truck in question is a Feb.1978 FJ40 showing 52K miles. Might be 152K? The current owner bought it from a professional restoration shop out of WA state. There is a note that accompanies the truck detailing the excellent...

forum.ih8mud.com

 

[jestlurnin]

@hobbes ive read through that thread. Didn’t scare me away. Wondering if I should be scared away…

 

[hobbes]

Never done it myself. I’ve read here the 2F factory manual is a good source. So if you read thru that and nothing scares you, I don’t see why not. You probably have decent machine shops near you for the stuff that needs that. (I do not.)

I’m sure those that have done it will chime in….

 

[avicenna110]

I’m in the same boat, pulled the engine out, separated the tranny before pulling it out. I got the gasket kit from Toyota but unsure how deep I wanna go. At the very least I’ll change all the gaskets, the ones I can get to. I’ve rebuilt a motorcycle engine before and that had a lot of details and I couldn’t have done it without the manual. As suggested above I plan to read the FSM before I dive in too deep.

 

[jestlurnin]

Great suggestion on thumbing through the FSM. Have not done that in years.

 

[Pighead]

I done one. About 16 years ago.
Had a very good machine shop, they ordered very good parts for me. Everything came to me in boxes and i assembled with the Engine manual.
I had assembled a few 1600 VW engines, this was my first straight 6. I simply followed along in the book, occasionally bought a new socket, triple and quintuple checked everything i did. It was heavy but not complicated. If you know which end of a screwdriver to hold, you can do it too.
Still running that engine today.

 

[GreaseMonkey]

I was stuck for over a year trying to answer that same question. Looking at engine rebuild "kits" and reading everything I could here on MUD, including that thread mentioned above. One thing finally sunk in to me and allowed me to move forward: I didn't have to replace EVERYTHING. So, finally, I got some snap gauges and a micrometer and started measuring stuff. Every spec on the cylinders, crankshaft, and connecting rods were withing tolerance according to the FSM. According to guidance from MUD I measured the cylinders in several places at the top, middle, and bottom and jotted them all down in a notebook. I did end up replacing the camshaft (Melling from the local autoparts store), all 12 valves, and both of the timings gears. Other than that, it was the usual stuff: New main bearings, rod bearings, cam bearings, rings, freeze plugs, and gaskets. I bought the special tool for the cam bearings, it made the job easy. I sent the lifters to Delta Cams for a regrind, very reasonable and good job. I did this all inside a 10'x10' Arrow shed . The only thing I had machined was the flywheel. The only other thing I wished I had a shop do was press the timing gear onto the CAM, I very nearly messed up that new cam. But it turned out all right. I also did the "Oil Galley Plug" fix while I was at it, just search for that here. And I used the new Torx screws on the timing cover backing plate, part# 90149-10001. Oh, I forgot to mention cleaning, cleaning, and more cleaning! Overall I would say just keep reading MUD until you are confident; you will find tips in places you weren't looking for them, so read a lot of the build threads. Also follow along with the 2F FSM, and have the Haynes one on standby as well. And I would say, just do one thing at a time, little milestones like getting the crankshaft back in will feel like an accomplishment (especially after it spent a year hanging out in your kitchen ) Hope that helps, and good luck!

 

[snaggletto]

If you are not in a time crunch then for sure, give it a shot. There is plenty of help on here to guide you if you get stuck.

 

[hobbes]

There’s a YouTube channel where @40FOX is doing a shed 2F rebuild if you haven’t seen it. It’s confidence inspiring. I wish there was a definitive 2F rebuild set of videos that some of the old guard put together with all the tips and tricks.

40 Channel on YouTube

Hi all, I love reading about all the 40 series builds on this forum and the support that everyone give along the way. :clap: I am also documenting my build on YouTube, Covering all parts of my strip down and repairs along the way, (Lot's of RUST:frown:) please feel to check it out and support...

forum.ih8mud.com

 

[avicenna110]

There’s a YouTube channel where @40FOX is doing a shed 2F rebuild if you haven’t seen it. It’s confidence inspiring. I wish there was a definitive 2F rebuild set of videos that some of the old guard put together with all the tips and tricks.

40 Channel on YouTube

Hi all, I love reading about all the 40 series builds on this forum and the support that everyone give along the way. :clap: I am also documenting my build on YouTube, Covering all parts of my strip down and repairs along the way, (Lot's of RUST:frown:) please feel to check it out and support...

forum.ih8mud.com

His videos are great! I watched the entire first series and picked up a lot of good tips.

There is also JNH classic channel, he has an early FJ40 with an F engine, he does some engine work as well and makes it look very easy.

 

[Pitter Patter]

Mize Adventures YouTube channel has a pretty cool series on a ‘performance’ 2F rebuild. It’s entertaining and definitely worth a watch.

I’m also planning on a rebuild next summer. Everything looks easy if you’re a pay attention to directions and details person. I don’t have a fancy shop but I’m going to tackle it.

Based on research, I have to second GreaseMonkey, it’s all about what you want out of it. Parts are crazy expensive and these are durable engines so it isn’t necessary to do everything. Point being, I just priced out everything you can get from Toyota (assuming you can trust the availability of their online parts catalogue). Add that to the cost of all the missing bits from other high quality suppliers. Parts alone are over $5k. It seems artificially high but it adds up. O/S pistons and rings are over $1,200. Valves? Seated? Guides? Cam and lifters? Bearings? Head and connecting rod bolts? Then you have machining expenses and I’ve been quoted as much as $4k for everything including magnafluxing, shot peening, decking, boring, balancing, etc. So if you want to go way overkill you could build a $10k 2F even doing your own tear down and reassembly.

Or you could just replace worn rings and bearings and call it good! Good luck! Looking forward to hearing what you decide and how it turns out.

 

[rkymtnflyfisher]

Do it!

Get the FSM for the 2F, there are some good info all over Mud.

I rebuilt my 2F a few years ago, the first engine I've ever worked on. Take your time, read, put it together. I used all OEM parts.

For a carbed engine it runs pretty dang good, I can run 75mph on flats, I get a solid 12-13 mpg from it.

It is as basic as an engine could be.

Do it.

The very least you'll gain a ton of knowledge that you didn't have before. Not to mention you'll understand how to troubleshoot things by simply understanding how everything operates in the entire system.

 

[1MOA]

Do it I would suggest joining your local TLCA club and hang out for a while and get to know who the real "gear heads" in the club are and ask if they would be willing to help out. If it is anything like my local club you will not be disappointed.
I will say don't show up and first meeting ask who wants to rebuild my engine but take your time gather your parts and tools and use the club for the knowledge...and still get the FSM

 

[jestlurnin]

@GreaseMonkey inspiring! Why the heck not I guess.

@snaggletto zero time crunch. So I guess l, why the heck not!

@hobbes thanks for pointing out @40FOX youtube channel. I’ve searched a bit for 2F rebuild videos on YouTube but at first glance 40FOX’s is pretty informational and I had not found it.

@avicenna110 i have seen those videos and he makes it look very easy!

@Pighead the fact that you rebuilt and are still running the engine 16 years later is very inspiring! So I guess, why the heck not!

@Pitter Patter are you talking about the mize adventure videos on YouTube where he rebuilds a 2F for a 60? If so I’ve watched those and they were extremely helpful and informative.

@rkymtnflyfisher sounds like our mechanical skills/experience may be in the same ballpark. So I guess, why the heck not!

Collectively you guys have convinced me this would be a fun and informative project to take on. I have the time. I have the space. I can make the finances available. And with you guys and this forum I figure it’s probably doable!

Should be a fun adventure.

 

[JDNs78FJ40]

I want to do this same thing! I figure I tore everything else apart during my restoration and put it back together so I should be able to rebuild a 2F.

 

[airon23]

And I used the new Torx screws on the timing cover backing plate, part# 90149-10001.

This...^

Do it!

Get the FSM for the 2F, there are some good info all over Mud.

I rebuilt my 2F a few years ago, the first engine I've ever worked on. Take your time, read, put it together. I used all OEM parts.

For a carbed engine it runs pretty dang good, I can run 75mph on flats, I get a solid 12-13 mpg from it.

It is as basic as an engine could be.

Do it.

The very least you'll gain a ton of knowledge that you didn't have before. Not to mention you'll understand how to troubleshoot things by simply understanding how everything operates in the entire system.

And this...^

I haven't rebuilt the engine, but as far as I went I probably could have and should have. I did reseal it and tore it pretty much all the way down. I would consider myself a pretty novice mechanic with some common sense. So I feel like if I can do it then pretty much anyone can. I don't know everything about engines, but the FSM and this forum are great resources which I'm sure you already know.

 

[sogncab]

If I weren't doing a R2.8 swap, I'd probably be rebuilding my 2F myself. I'd be hunting for some more performance, and would want everything balanced well.

Just my opinion, but I think efi is a no brainer on these. Better running, should help with efficiency, and be cleaner with less fail points than all of the ancient emissions contraptions.

I've only rebuilt one car engine, but tons of motorcycle, ATV, and snowmobile engines. A good machinist is critical to success.

With the internet, it's highly unlikely you'll discover a new problem. Somebody out there has a solution.

 

[zerotreedelta]

They're pretty straightforward engines, especially if you have the time to do it slow and methodically. I've rebuilt a number of smaller engines, but never tore into an auto one all the way - the FSM covers things well, and Mud' fills in the gaps on common gotchas. Depending on year, tracking down bits like pistons/rings/bearings can be a bit of a challenge, but it's all manageable.

Slow and steady wins the race. But that's kind of like the 2F itself...

 

[jestlurnin]

Are all Yota 2F engine manuals the same? These are the two I have. Both are from my work on 60’s. The engine I’m looking to rebuild is a 76’ I believe. Will these work for my application?