Header options for 2F in 2016

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82cruiser

82cruiser

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Joined
Sep 29, 2005
Threads
243
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1,958
Location
Boston, MA
Hi all,

My Downey header finally bit the dust after 20 years of service. Great product...thanks Jim.

Now looking for a replacement and there aren't many options. Looks like MAF and JT Outfitters are the only ones available. I'd like a Marks header but they're not avail...left Mark a message inquiring.

Couple questions for you:
- Are there any performance differences between MAF vs JT header?
- Is the JT header a decent product? At $239...it's tempting.
- Any other good options out there?

Thanks for your help!

:beer:
 
I'm presently building a custom "Slick Fit" type Header for a Landcruiser, not done yet, don't know if I'll build more like it. When I get mine done it will be fully retrofitted with EGR system and I will sell it with smog decal- - -stay tuned.
 
If you saw my recent posts in the announcements section, you'd know I'm further behind on doing headers than ever. Sorry.
 
Not directly related to your issue but might shed some light on which header is better performance wise. I was watching a YouTube video about motor testing and the guys had a tricked out 400 with yada, yada, yada specs on it. Someone had asked what difference it would make to power production across the RPM band if they "dented" a couple of header pipes to clear steering parts. They took a 3lb mini sledge and dented the crap out of two of the tubes then did a dyno run comparing it to one before. It actually GAINED HP! Finding that interesting, they proceeded to dent another tube then ran a test. Same thing, no difference but no gain that time. They repeated this test until every single tube had multiple DEEP dents and looked like it would not flow squat. Only then did the HP/torque drop by some totally insignificant amount.
I found the link:

So buy which ever set meets your needs as I don't think you will notice a performance difference between the two. Now as far as build quality I cannot help you there...
 
Coolerman said:
Not directly related to your issue but might shed some light on which header is better performance wise. I was watching a YouTube video about motor testing and the guys had a tricked out 400 with yada, yada, yada specs on it. Someone had asked what difference it would make to power production across the RPM band if they "dented" a couple of header pipes to clear steering parts. They took a 3lb mini sledge and dented the crap out of two of the tubes then did a dyno run comparing it to one before. It actually GAINED HP! Finding that interesting, they proceeded to dent another tube then ran a test. Same thing, no difference but no gain that time. They repeated this test until every single tube had multiple DEEP dents and looked like it would not flow squat. Only then did the HP/torque drop by some totally insignificant amount.

So buy which ever set meets your needs as I don't think you will notice a performance difference between the two. Now as far as build quality I cannot help you there...
Click to expand...

I suspect that the dents in the tubes restricts flow somewhat, which raises the pressure of the exhaust. When the exhaust moves past the dents, the exhaust accelerates, lowering the pressure. My guess is that is affecting the scavenging effect to help draw exhaust out of other cylinders providing a net gain in horsepower.

I wonder how many headers are modeled and simulated with CAD/CAM in order to optimize the performance characteristics?
 
Hay Randy how ya been ?

I just went thru this on mine... I have went thru several headers in the time you went thru one LOL

What ever you get ... Get it ceramic coated

I went with the sor header as I found one that a mudder was getting rid of that wouldn't fit his 3fe? That was a complete system header to tailpipe

Header is SS and I had it ceramic coated :)

Interested in seeing Jims
 
We never tested a Header with dented tube(s), but we did test the Downey 6 cylinder Landcruiser Header at a 10 h.p. gain, then another 2-plus h.p. gain with a 2 1/2" exhaust system behind the Header, soooo lesser restriction did give a gain on the Landcruiser. On the other hand, with our Toyota Pickup 4 cylinder Headers we had to bring the 2 1/2" diameter exhaust system down to a 2" diameter pipe at 30" behind the Header collector in order to maintain the h.p. gain, soooo restriction was necessary.
 
JT header here. Had some issues with the weld fitment on the flanges, but were repaired in-house. Had the header flanges flattened with the intake before install-once the flanges got equal, the thing bolted up easily. Been on the rig for 4 yrs now with no issues(other than the occassional rust pits that pop up(sanding and VHT paint takes care of that)
Pics won't upload-sorry
 
Thanks for all the input and ideas, very helpful. Now considering going back to stock or maybe a 3fe exhaust manifold...if the benefits over stock are worth it.

65swb45 said:
If you saw my recent posts in the announcements section, you'd know I'm further behind on doing headers than ever. Sorry.
Click to expand...

Mark - did not see your update in the announcement section, but good to know. Thanks.

Coolerman said:
Not directly related to your issue but might shed some light on which header is better performance wise. I was watching a YouTube video about motor testing and the guys had a tricked out 400 with yada, yada, yada specs on it. Someone had asked what difference it would make to power production across the RPM band if they "dented" a couple of header pipes to clear steering parts. They took a 3lb mini sledge and dented the crap out of two of the tubes then did a dyno run comparing it to one before. It actually GAINED HP! Finding that interesting, they proceeded to dent another tube then ran a test. Same thing, no difference but no gain that time. They repeated this test until every single tube had multiple DEEP dents and looked like it would not flow squat. Only then did the HP/torque drop by some totally insignificant amount.
Click to expand...

Well, taking a hammer to my headers hadn't crossed my mind! Sounds fun though.

JohnnyC said:
Hay Randy how ya been ?
I just went thru this on mine... I have went thru several headers in the time you went thru one LOL
What ever you get ... Get it ceramic coated
I went with the sor header as I found one that a mudder was getting rid of that wouldn't fit his 3fe? That was a complete system header to tailpipe
Header is SS and I had it ceramic coated :)
Interested in seeing Jims
Click to expand...

Hey JohnnyC. good my friend! Hope you are as well.
The SOR header looks pretty sweet. How's the performance compared to stock? What did you have on there prior?

SouthBostonFJ40 said:
Hey Randy...why a header and not stock?
Click to expand...

Hey Alex - considering that now. I'm interested in seeing what Jim comes up with which might take a while. Researching what I'll need to convert back to stock from my Downey header and looking for parts needed.

Godwin said:
Mounting up a 3FE exhaust manifold is another option. There's a couple of threads out there on how to do it.
Click to expand...

Interesting suggestion and researching now. Ideally, I get this back on the road asap so I can wheel this fall. Reading through this thread and that thread now. How tough are 3fe exhaust manifolds to find?

sggoat said:
JT header here. Had some issues with the weld fitment on the flanges, but were repaired in-house. Had the header flanges flattened with the intake before install-once the flanges got equal, the thing bolted up easily. Been on the rig for 4 yrs now with no issues(other than the occassional rust pits that pop up(sanding and VHT paint takes care of that)
Pics won't upload-sorry
Click to expand...

Thanks for the JT feedback.
 
I have always had header... 1st was sor two piece ... Then MAF ... Then MAF ... Then a used header... Now sor again

Headers and NYS last about 5 years

Think that's it :)
 
I snapped a few pics of the new prototype Header I'm working on, it's a slick fit style, funnels from 1.5" up to 2.5" at collector. Header not done yet, have no idea if there will be any interest??
$_0-4.webp
$_0-2.webp
$_0-1.webp
 
Exhaust systems are pretty tricky - restriction is really not necessary , but flow velocity is critical if you want hp gains . Use too large of a primary or collector and the pipes become useless , too small you get higher velocities but restrict volume too far . Mark's tri-y design is a pretty good , nearly spot-on design and balance of performance over the common crappy 6-1 style available . Using exhaust pulses from one cylinder to help extract the next cylinder isn't easy and few ever totally pull it off . Long tube styles are the king of total power output but really must be dead-on tuned to the engine . This tri-y works excellent , hopefully Mark can move forward with them soon for a re-release ....

Sarge
 
Weber Sarge said:
Exhaust systems are pretty tricky - restriction is really not necessary , but flow velocity is critical if you want hp gains . Use too large of a primary or collector and the pipes become useless , too small you get higher velocities but restrict volume too far . Mark's tri-y design is a pretty good , nearly spot-on design and balance of performance over the common crappy 6-1 style available . Using exhaust pulses from one cylinder to help extract the next cylinder isn't easy and few ever totally pull it off . Long tube styles are the king of total power output but really must be dead-on tuned to the engine . This tri-y works excellent , hopefully Mark can move forward with them soon for a re-release ....

Sarge
Click to expand...

Now I don't even have a warehouse to store them in any more. Of course if you guys would buy some of my other stuff, it would be easier to make room.:idea:
 
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