I'm not offended - just sad at all the unlicensed users and how it's proliferated on off road boards thumbing their collective noses at such a simple license to get. Amateur Radio needs licensed users and licensed users understand where and why the licensing is needed and what a true HAM is willing to do in an emergency.
HAM NEWBIE
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We have established a long time ago, in many other threads that licenses are unnecessary and a total waste of time.
I really don't know why we always come back to this topic...
Some people made a mistake and took the test. Oh well. You made a mistake and have to live with it now. Every single supporter of HAM license is a dinosaur and fails to recognize the obsolete nature of the license.
Many decent people who simply don't want to bother with the old fart mentality will study the booklet and stay away from the frequencies where none of us have any business using. There is absolutely no harm in being a radio pirate. Of course you will always have rebels who are bent on braking the law in a really bad way and get a kick out of messing with other old farts still using the morse code on the dedicated frequencies.
As I said it many times before, HAM needs to move into the 21st century, deregulate itself and get rid of the stupid license requirement.
Having a license is not a guarantee one will not make mistakes or know how to properly operate a radio. It proves nothing and it guarantees nothing. All it does, it provides an overzealous HAM geek the tools to get the operator who actually made a mistake. "We all know who you are, got your call sign right here".
I seriously hope this will be the last thread on this subject. Licensed users vs pirates.
I really don't know why we always come back to this topic...
Some people made a mistake and took the test. Oh well. You made a mistake and have to live with it now. Every single supporter of HAM license is a dinosaur and fails to recognize the obsolete nature of the license.
Many decent people who simply don't want to bother with the old fart mentality will study the booklet and stay away from the frequencies where none of us have any business using. There is absolutely no harm in being a radio pirate. Of course you will always have rebels who are bent on braking the law in a really bad way and get a kick out of messing with other old farts still using the morse code on the dedicated frequencies.
As I said it many times before, HAM needs to move into the 21st century, deregulate itself and get rid of the stupid license requirement.
Having a license is not a guarantee one will not make mistakes or know how to properly operate a radio. It proves nothing and it guarantees nothing. All it does, it provides an overzealous HAM geek the tools to get the operator who actually made a mistake. "We all know who you are, got your call sign right here".
I seriously hope this will be the last thread on this subject. Licensed users vs pirates.
As a HAM Extra class I disagree with "the old fart" and deregulation. I have listened to the comms on CB and sometimes it seems like they have the professionalism as a brawl in a prison yard. ( Perhaps because there is no licensing requirement involved ) Amateur radio is worldwide and call signs are the vehicle to establish your maturity and ability to transmit and not be a bozo and interfering with the frequencies involved. HAM is widely used in tragedies like hurricane Katrina. Power was out and HAMs were able to help , and, do it in a disciplined , professional way. I cannot image those airwaves chock full of unlicensed , no call sign, etc..
"Any unauthorized radio transmission is illegal and can be considered as security threat. The license is used identify yourself. When you use HAM radio you need keep repeating your call sign often to new contact. It is like Car Number plate
Hence ITU and others are termed rules regulation for every band of radio transmitted by anyone. Additionally the HAM bands (including satellite) are free of cost at-least for that we can certainly follow their rules right?"
So, I will add this letter from the FCC concerning unlicensed broadcast.
Dear Mr. :
It has come to the attention of the Federal Communications Commission that
at multiple times in the last several months you have made radio
transmissions in the 2 meter amateur band, for which a license is
required. You have no such license.
Operation of radio transmitting equipment without a valid FCC
authorization is a violation of Section 301 of the Communications Act of
1934, as amended, and may subject the responsible parties to substantial
monetary forfeitures, in rem arrest action against the offending radio
equipment, and criminal sanctions including imprisonment. Because
unlicensed operation creates a danger of interference to important radio
communications services and may subject the operator to severe penalties,
this warning emphasizes the importance of complying strictly with these
legal requirements.
UNAUTHORIZED OPERATION OF THIS RADIO STATION MUST CEASE IMMEDIATELY.
You have ten (10) days from the date of receipt of this warning to respond
to this office. The response must contain a statement of the specific
action(s) taken to come into compliance with the Commission's rules and
should include a time line for completion of pending corrective action(s).
You are directed to support your response with a signed and dated
affidavit or declaration under penalty of perjury, verifying the truth and
accuracy of the information submitted in your response. Your response
should be sent to the following address: 1270 Fairfield Road, Gettysburg,
PA 17325 and should reference the listed case number.
In an inquiry of this type we are required to notify you that under the
Privacy Act of 1974, 5 U.S.C. S: 552a(e)(3), the Commission's staff will
use all relevant information before it, including information you disclose
in your reply, to determine what, if any, enforcement action is warranted
in this matter.
You may contact me at 717-338-2577 should you wish to discuss this matter.
Sincerely,
Laura L. Smith
Special Counsel
Cc: Tampa Field Office
South Central Regional Director
47 U.S.C. S: 301.
Fines normally range from $7,500 to $10,000.
Your logic is disturbing. Why don't we get rid of drivers license's and license plates ass well.
"Any unauthorized radio transmission is illegal and can be considered as security threat. The license is used identify yourself. When you use HAM radio you need keep repeating your call sign often to new contact. It is like Car Number plate
Hence ITU and others are termed rules regulation for every band of radio transmitted by anyone. Additionally the HAM bands (including satellite) are free of cost at-least for that we can certainly follow their rules right?"
So, I will add this letter from the FCC concerning unlicensed broadcast.
Dear Mr. :
It has come to the attention of the Federal Communications Commission that
at multiple times in the last several months you have made radio
transmissions in the 2 meter amateur band, for which a license is
required. You have no such license.
Operation of radio transmitting equipment without a valid FCC
authorization is a violation of Section 301 of the Communications Act of
1934, as amended, and may subject the responsible parties to substantial
monetary forfeitures, in rem arrest action against the offending radio
equipment, and criminal sanctions including imprisonment. Because
unlicensed operation creates a danger of interference to important radio
communications services and may subject the operator to severe penalties,
this warning emphasizes the importance of complying strictly with these
legal requirements.
UNAUTHORIZED OPERATION OF THIS RADIO STATION MUST CEASE IMMEDIATELY.
You have ten (10) days from the date of receipt of this warning to respond
to this office. The response must contain a statement of the specific
action(s) taken to come into compliance with the Commission's rules and
should include a time line for completion of pending corrective action(s).
You are directed to support your response with a signed and dated
affidavit or declaration under penalty of perjury, verifying the truth and
accuracy of the information submitted in your response. Your response
should be sent to the following address: 1270 Fairfield Road, Gettysburg,
PA 17325 and should reference the listed case number.
In an inquiry of this type we are required to notify you that under the
Privacy Act of 1974, 5 U.S.C. S: 552a(e)(3), the Commission's staff will
use all relevant information before it, including information you disclose
in your reply, to determine what, if any, enforcement action is warranted
in this matter.
You may contact me at 717-338-2577 should you wish to discuss this matter.
Sincerely,
Laura L. Smith
Special Counsel
Cc: Tampa Field Office
South Central Regional Director
47 U.S.C. S: 301.
Fines normally range from $7,500 to $10,000.
Your logic is disturbing. Why don't we get rid of drivers license's and license plates ass well.
Laura L. Smith 
If we have undocumented immigration, I don't see a problem with being an undocumented HAM operator.
It will only take a little more time till HAM radio will be deregulated. CB went through that stupid license phase too. The more undocumented HAM operators, the better. This will force a much needed change in this field.
Anyway. I've said it many times before and I will not change anything. Arguing here is useless and pointless. Over and Out!
We DO have undocumented immigration and look what is happening now. It is finally being enforced. HAM radio has to much of a structure in emergency and worldwide , professional communications to allow those frequencies to be free to anyone. If you need to communicate license free , then use a CB or family radio.
You seem to think that discussing things is arguing ? I am presenting the worldwide system of Amateur Radio and the rules and regulations.
If some people use HAM on a 4X4 trail unlicensed /may not get caught right away but trying to actually communicate without a valid call sign will eventually get you. In fact , perhaps the FCC could focus on popular trails and monitor them for abuse. I know where I live they eventually focused on some campgrounds and people were caught and they got caught.
Simply stated, HAM radio is easy to get licensed and it is much easier than years ago because equipment has allowed for the user to not have to know as much technically. Sounds like you are afraid of the test ?
You believe it will be deregulated and I do not. Lets follow up in five years for a check.
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Yep, like I wrote, my 7yr old and 9yr old at the time got their technician license. Cost ~$20 for lifetime renewals (free every 10 yrs). They learned some essential skills and appreciation for some basic radio tech and the older one is now starting into his 3rd year college engineering degree. Younger one starts his first year in a few weeks. A big chunk of that ~$20 goes to the VEC (the volunteers that administer the test) which of course then goes back into the HAM community in various ways. Do you think that the government is putting up the repeaters that many of us are utilizing??
The test is easy and for the cost of a pizza you are licensed and meet some radio folk during your test. Maybe a new hobby or at least an appreciation for folk that install/maintain the repeater structure and a chance to go to meetups to test equipment or discuss aspects of how it 'all works'. Possibly join some of the volunteer emergency network to help provide communication during times of disaster.
Anyhow, the point is that getting licensed is NOT about paying the man a few dollars, it is to educate oneself and become part of a technical group of people that are happy to help you anytime.
Funny how some of the folk that come to this subforum to ask information are getting technical help from licensed people, but want to use the information to then remain unlicensed and still without the basic information they would learn from the test. So, are you going to then be able to help others with the technical aspects of choosing a rig, antenna, hookup etc or only be able to tell them that there's no point in getting the license?
Poor code of ethics and/or a fear of failing a test that a 7yr/9yr can study and pass... Pitiful!
cheers,
george.
The test is easy and for the cost of a pizza you are licensed and meet some radio folk during your test. Maybe a new hobby or at least an appreciation for folk that install/maintain the repeater structure and a chance to go to meetups to test equipment or discuss aspects of how it 'all works'. Possibly join some of the volunteer emergency network to help provide communication during times of disaster.
Anyhow, the point is that getting licensed is NOT about paying the man a few dollars, it is to educate oneself and become part of a technical group of people that are happy to help you anytime.
Funny how some of the folk that come to this subforum to ask information are getting technical help from licensed people, but want to use the information to then remain unlicensed and still without the basic information they would learn from the test. So, are you going to then be able to help others with the technical aspects of choosing a rig, antenna, hookup etc or only be able to tell them that there's no point in getting the license?
Poor code of ethics and/or a fear of failing a test that a 7yr/9yr can study and pass... Pitiful!
cheers,
george.
Reverse psychology does not work on me.
Youtube on the other hand works.
Reading the idiotic test questions works too.
Wanting to part of a community of old farts checking the state of their reception and exchanging call sigs? Hell NO!
You are the second one perpetuating the stupid notion about failing the test.
What would be the difference in operating a radio without a license and operating one after I failed the test? None! Find some other logic.
Dragging on a conversation without a point. I will never get a license, just like I will never be a TLC member. There is no test in becoming a TLC member. Still not afraid of the the TLC mafia.
Old people cannot get over their stupid old ways of doing things in this world. They cling on to them till they die, without knowing why. Just because someone told them to do so.
And no, I'm still not going to broadcast music over 2m band after I write this response. Not me. Still not going to curse, or interfere with someone's conversation, or stumble over a Morse code transmission and ask how the weather is over there. Not me. Still not going to ask the air traffic control what time the pizza will arrive at my door either. Not me. Still not going to participate in any emergency drill for an emergency which will never ever happen... at least in my area since there were none ever.
60's, 70's and 80's HAM operators need another passion. You don't need a HAM radio to order adult diapers, you can do that online.
Youtube on the other hand works.
Reading the idiotic test questions works too.
Wanting to part of a community of old farts checking the state of their reception and exchanging call sigs? Hell NO!
You are the second one perpetuating the stupid notion about failing the test.
What would be the difference in operating a radio without a license and operating one after I failed the test? None! Find some other logic.
Dragging on a conversation without a point. I will never get a license, just like I will never be a TLC member. There is no test in becoming a TLC member. Still not afraid of the the TLC mafia.
Old people cannot get over their stupid old ways of doing things in this world. They cling on to them till they die, without knowing why. Just because someone told them to do so.
And no, I'm still not going to broadcast music over 2m band after I write this response. Not me. Still not going to curse, or interfere with someone's conversation, or stumble over a Morse code transmission and ask how the weather is over there. Not me. Still not going to ask the air traffic control what time the pizza will arrive at my door either. Not me. Still not going to participate in any emergency drill for an emergency which will never ever happen... at least in my area since there were none ever.
60's, 70's and 80's HAM operators need another passion. You don't need a HAM radio to order adult diapers, you can do that online.
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- Sunnyvale, CA
- Website
- www.george4wd.taskled.com
Well, I can see that you have made your decision here and it has helped me understand your view.
Good points have been made for a license, I guess you can't see past your own opinion and I'm glad youtube provides all the info that you need to learn. I guess those youtube videos (HAM specific) were not created by old fart hams.
Their passion is what keeps the ham bands alive - you obviously have no idea the work involved in keeping those precious pieces of the RF spectrum open and available (including the equipment that operates on those bands). More than a few companies would love to get those bands assigned to commercial use and they (and the HAM equipment) would be gone. The old farts installing/maintaining the repeater network should definitely find a new passion. You don't seem to get it that those bands are NOT a right, they are there because of those old fart Ham operators. You obviously have no respect for them or their work and the minimal test/requirement to get a license but are happy to use what they have won and continue to work to keep and justify your stand by belittling their work. Way to go.
cheers,
george.
Good points have been made for a license, I guess you can't see past your own opinion and I'm glad youtube provides all the info that you need to learn. I guess those youtube videos (HAM specific) were not created by old fart hams.
Their passion is what keeps the ham bands alive - you obviously have no idea the work involved in keeping those precious pieces of the RF spectrum open and available (including the equipment that operates on those bands). More than a few companies would love to get those bands assigned to commercial use and they (and the HAM equipment) would be gone. The old farts installing/maintaining the repeater network should definitely find a new passion. You don't seem to get it that those bands are NOT a right, they are there because of those old fart Ham operators. You obviously have no respect for them or their work and the minimal test/requirement to get a license but are happy to use what they have won and continue to work to keep and justify your stand by belittling their work. Way to go.
cheers,
george.
George_TLC hit it on the head. The greedy commercial types are attacking the frequency bands used by HAM operators (and you too Dragos 80) on a daily basis. Once they get those frequencies they are gone forever since there is no more room on the frequency spectrum to allocate for other use. Digital may make some room but not enough IMHO.
As a licensed operator and member of ARRL (American Radio Relay League) I try to donate time and funds to help offset the commercial pressure being applied to our wimpy congress critters to steal the band width. In reading your posts I wonder why you have so much anger directed toward legal operators and the rules to keep the spectrum clear and operating properly. We are not your enemy Dragos 80 and not all of us are old farts if I may use your simile.
As a licensed operator and member of ARRL (American Radio Relay League) I try to donate time and funds to help offset the commercial pressure being applied to our wimpy congress critters to steal the band width. In reading your posts I wonder why you have so much anger directed toward legal operators and the rules to keep the spectrum clear and operating properly. We are not your enemy Dragos 80 and not all of us are old farts if I may use your simile.
Congratulations 1969FJ on your Extra license. I am a General Class and took the Extra exam but left my brain at home when I took the test. Will try it again sometime soon. Have been doing a lot or reading on antenna design but it makes my head hurt 
You are correct that the ARRL and all members are wonderful in keeping HAM alive and well. The digital world is integrating fast BUT , when you get down to it , we still need our basic communication.
The FCC was created for the RF spectrum to be regulated , just as we have roads with traffic signals and lanes. According to some on here, if licensing has no meaning , just deregulate. Imagine the chaos ? The same was true with radio in the beginning. ( Did you know when Titanic was sending morse code messages, there were others interrupting and the outcome was a mis mash of the original signal. Why, because the FCC was not in charge yet.)
As far as ARRL members being "old farts", I consider that a compliment. What it shows is the generation growing up on digital I phones without any basic understanding of even what makes them work, is jealous. I do not blame them. I am very happy I grew up with electron tubes and know digital from the start. Makes for an incredible learning experience.
Sounds like some on here are green with envy ? Just remember, do not TEXT while driving, or you may never grow to be an "old fart".
The FCC was created for the RF spectrum to be regulated , just as we have roads with traffic signals and lanes. According to some on here, if licensing has no meaning , just deregulate. Imagine the chaos ? The same was true with radio in the beginning. ( Did you know when Titanic was sending morse code messages, there were others interrupting and the outcome was a mis mash of the original signal. Why, because the FCC was not in charge yet.)
As far as ARRL members being "old farts", I consider that a compliment. What it shows is the generation growing up on digital I phones without any basic understanding of even what makes them work, is jealous. I do not blame them. I am very happy I grew up with electron tubes and know digital from the start. Makes for an incredible learning experience.
Sounds like some on here are green with envy ? Just remember, do not TEXT while driving, or you may never grow to be an "old fart".
WB8LBZ
SILVER Star
As an "Old Fart" I am hoping Noah will get his license. I have done a lot of wheeling by myself and a ham rig could be helpful if my vehicle gets disabled on the trail. While I haven't talked to Malaysia I have connected to Indonesia, Hong Kong and The Philippines. I got licensed in 1972 and the stuff out there now is just great.
I don't mind being blamed for having stupid old ways of doing things. Its the people before me that had those stupid old ways I still follow since it has put me in the lap of luxury I have gotten used to.
Larry in El Paso
I don't mind being blamed for having stupid old ways of doing things. Its the people before me that had those stupid old ways I still follow since it has put me in the lap of luxury I have gotten used to.
Larry in El Paso
X2 Larry. I built my first DX rig using the old Heathkit stuff. It was a blast and I learned a lot and then ent on and built a Heathkit color television that I took to college and then gave to my brother when I went into Army flight school and then on to Vietnam for 24 months. That TV was still working up until the stations went digital.
Cruiserdrew
On the way there
You know, Dragos, you deserve to be on my ignore list. You are now one of 2. You don't get it. Ham radio is a privilege and you are ready to just abuse whatever you can. That's wrong. Get your license and call sign. It isn't about "old fart mentality", it's about a body of knowledge you should master. It sounds like you are insecure about remembering this body of knowledge. Too bad. Because it's easy. Get your s*** together bro.
Congratulations 1969FJ on your Extra license. I am a General Class and took the Extra exam but left my brain at home when I took the test. Will try it again sometime soon. Have been doing a lot or reading on antenna design but it makes my head hurt
Thanks, RF / Antenna theory is intuitive to me. I love it. I also carry a General Radiotelephone Operator License with Radar endorsement commercial license. ( I was a Fire Control Technician in the Navy and I believe the FCC pretty much copied the Radar questions from the Navy OR visa - versa.)
Helipilot, that General class pretty much gives you most of the spectrum. Hope to see you Pass the extra someday.
I also see you were familiar with Heathkit ? They were a wonderful outfit with many types of kits. AND, you do learn a lot. You know there are digital to analog converters for the type of tuner you had on that Heathkit. It is amazing as that TV is historic.
I believe it was someone in Vietnam who was working with radio and put the Slinky Antenna on the map. Since reading this I have created a Slinky Antenna , and it works. SWR is not as good as other ideas, but certainly is usable.
I believe that TV is stored in my Mom's barn (she's 92 years old) with all the other antiques she has collected. Will have to check next time I am there. Never heard of the Slinky antenna as I was busy dodging bullets since everybody shot at helicopters. I will read up on it though.
What is TLC?
Probably meant TLCA but it's not important to him to acknowledge what that organization does either to promote our trucks or protecting our eroding off road rights from similar attitudes to courtesy and trail maintenance as he's displayed toward a HAM license.
I'm gonna think that he means TLC:
But, I digress.
I will never become a AAA member. There is no test in becoming a AAA member. Still not afraid of the AAA mafia.
I will never become a BSA member. There is no test in becoming a BSA member. Still not afraid of the BSA mafia.
I will never become a MENSA member. There is... Ah, fxxx.
Seriously, won't become a TLC(?) member because there's no test but won't take a HAM test to become a HAM member (license holder)? Am I getting that right? There's gotta be a corner piece of the puzzle that I'm just not finding in his posts. I guess our Traffic Land, USA school system let down another child who found his way here.
OR...maybe the guy just doesn't have the $15 test fee?
But, I digress.
I will never become a AAA member. There is no test in becoming a AAA member. Still not afraid of the AAA mafia.
I will never become a BSA member. There is no test in becoming a BSA member. Still not afraid of the BSA mafia.
I will never become a MENSA member. There is... Ah, fxxx.
Seriously, won't become a TLC(?) member because there's no test but won't take a HAM test to become a HAM member (license holder)? Am I getting that right? There's gotta be a corner piece of the puzzle that I'm just not finding in his posts. I guess our Traffic Land, USA school system let down another child who found his way here.
OR...maybe the guy just doesn't have the $15 test fee?
This statement enlightens us more to his thought process than any other comment of his that I can recall. I say we shouldn't tell him that nobody wants undocumented immigration because of the strain it puts on the system that some old farts created, or that we don't 'have' "undocumented immigration"; we have only legal and illegal immigration. Let's not tell him that.
