Diagnosing Timing Chain- I’m new to the 22re (1 Viewer)

Josey1972

SILVER Star
Joined
Oct 28, 2016
Messages
692
Location
Indiana
I’m new to the 22re and am trying to figure out an occasional timing chain rattle. Everything Ive been able to find about replacement is when it rattles at idle. I take that to mean all the time at idle which I am currently not experiencing.

My situation:

I get a very occasional 5-10 second rattle at start up. I fired up the truck 8 or so times yesterday and it did it on one of those start ups only. Is it the beginning of the full time idle rattle or something else? I have read that OEM Oil filters don‘t always hold the oil like they should. Maybe thats a possibility. I have yet to pull the valve cover and look at the guides but in this “occasionally happening” situation I don‘t know that I will be able to see anything.

The engine supposedly has 50k on it but I have no idea what that means and neither does the PO or the PO before him.

Any insight is appreciated.
 

KLF

Frame waxer
SILVER Star
Joined
Apr 5, 2003
Messages
9,143
Location
Southern NH
Sounds like you need a new chain tensioner. It does have a spring, but a lot of the force on the plunger is generated by the oil pressure. Eventually it gets tired. Might also think about getting a new oil pump. You have to take it off to get to the chain anyway.
 

Josey1972

SILVER Star
Joined
Oct 28, 2016
Messages
692
Location
Indiana
Sounds like you need a new chain tensioner. It does have a spring, but a lot of the force on the plunger is generated by the oil pressure. Eventually it gets tired. Might also think about getting a new oil pump. You have to take it off to get to the chain anyway.
Thank you. After doing more reading after the post I was asking myself the same question. Appreciated.
 
Joined
Jan 31, 2011
Messages
861
Location
Loomis, California
Pull your valve cover and look down there. Should see broken pieces of a guide or as KLF mentioned, a faulty tensioner. x2 on the oil pump. I’ve seen a case where someone didn’t know what they were doing and put the oil pump on with the hardware in the wrong orientation and basically punched through the chain cover into the chain and it produced this “occasional” noise as you describe. Regardless, plan on doing your chain. Yotashop has an OSK (Japanese) kit for $80 or so. Add on the metal guide for another $20. Rock Auto has Aisin oil pump for around $50 too. Good luck
 

Josey1972

SILVER Star
Joined
Oct 28, 2016
Messages
692
Location
Indiana
Pull your valve cover and look down there. Should see broken pieces of a guide or as KLF mentioned, a faulty tensioner. x2 on the oil pump. I’ve seen a case where someone didn’t know what they were doing and put the oil pump on with the hardware in the wrong orientation and basically punched through the chain cover into the chain and it produced this “occasional” noise as you describe. Regardless, plan on doing your chain. Yotashop has an OSK (Japanese) kit for $80 or so. Add on the metal guide for another $20. Rock Auto has Aisin oil pump for around $50 too. Good luck
Thanks for the input. Will do the whole shebang so I do t have to worry about it.
 

pappy

photosynthesizing
Moderator
Joined
Oct 7, 2003
Messages
11,229
Location
Too far north. Too far east.
My thoughts.

If you do not hear the rattle on cold starts it's not anything with your chain. Cold starts are more likely to not have oil pressure to push the tensioner right away.

If you hear it on warm starts only it could be something else. My truck does that, and I'm certain it's not chain. What do I think it is? Lean start/pinging caused by something in the fuel pressure regulator, VSV, or efi thermo sensor. On cold starts my truck starts perfect. Instant start, no "rattle." On warm starts it almost always has a little rattle to it. The fuel pressure regulator, thermo sensor, and VSV work together to increase fuel pressure on warm starts. I can't say definitively this is my problem, but since warm starts take a little more key, and I get a rattle for a few seconds, I'm fairly certain it's a lean start. I also get an occasional code which I seem to recall was the sensor.

I will echo KLF and Toast. Pull the rocker arm cover and look down the front of the engine. Look for broken bits. Look for groves in the timing cover where the chain would have made contact. But, like I said, if you don't hear it on cold starts, the chain is not your problem.
 

Josey1972

SILVER Star
Joined
Oct 28, 2016
Messages
692
Location
Indiana
My thoughts.

If you do not hear the rattle on cold starts it's not anything with your chain. Cold starts are more likely to not have oil pressure to push the tensioner right away.

If you hear it on warm starts only it could be something else. My truck does that, and I'm certain it's not chain. What do I think it is? Lean start/pinging caused by something in the fuel pressure regulator, VSV, or efi thermo sensor. On cold starts my truck starts perfect. Instant start, no "rattle." On warm starts it almost always has a little rattle to it. The fuel pressure regulator, thermo sensor, and VSV work together to increase fuel pressure on warm starts. I can't say definitively this is my problem, but since warm starts take a little more key, and I get a rattle for a few seconds, I'm fairly certain it's a lean start. I also get an occasional code which I seem to recall was the sensor.

I will echo KLF and Toast. Pull the rocker arm cover and look down the front of the engine. Look for broken bits. Look for groves in the timing cover where the chain would have made contact. But, like I said, if you don't hear it on cold starts, the chain is not your problem.
Thanks for the insight. Sounds like we have a similar symptom. I wonder if it would be worth making preemptive strikes on those parts if they aren’t to expensive.
 
Joined
Jan 17, 2005
Messages
5,629
Location
Southern Colorado
Since I ran into this - if you see grooves in the aluminum cover, but the guides are fine, then someone may have already replaced the guides in the past. Don't be fooled by grooves in the casting. My 22R/REs were noisy at startup for a few seconds simply because they didn't have oil pressure. No brand of oil filter (Toyota or otherwise) ever made a difference.
 

Josey1972

SILVER Star
Joined
Oct 28, 2016
Messages
692
Location
Indiana
Since I ran into this - if you see grooves in the aluminum cover, but the guides are fine, then someone may have already replaced the guides in the past. Don't be fooled by grooves in the casting. My 22R/REs were noisy at startup for a few seconds simply because they didn't have oil pressure. No brand of oil filter (Toyota or otherwise) ever made a difference.
Thanks for the input. I look at the guides and report back.
 

Josey1972

SILVER Star
Joined
Oct 28, 2016
Messages
692
Location
Indiana
Update: the guides were factory plastic so thats automatic change in my book. We opened it up and found the idler bearing was going bad. 100% explains the occasional rattle on start up. It is a 6204DU bearing. I ordered the NSK version.
 
Joined
Feb 4, 2021
Messages
13
Location
Hawaii
Make sure the guide is steel backed, at a minimum on the driver's side and not plastic. The steel backed guides lasts longer and when everything is installed, you have to tension the chain, most of the wear occurs on the driver's side. My original guide on the passenger side was hardly scratched after 156,000 miles. The driver's side broke and I had to remove the oil pan to get all the pieces. Good luck!
 

Josey1972

SILVER Star
Joined
Oct 28, 2016
Messages
692
Location
Indiana
Turns out the seat for the bearing in the tension was damaged, maybe on the last install and the bearing was able to move around in its seat a bit. Dang, new tensioners are salty.
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Top Bottom