PTO wont winch in while in LOW Gear (1 Viewer)

[Dell80srs]

Hi Im dell from Borneo...

I have a 80 series with manual transmission and I recently encountered a problem where I am unable to winch in the PTO while in L4. The PTO works in Neutral position but somehow now it dosent work in L4. I have used this PTO before in L4 and it worked perfectly.

 

[greentruck]

I suspect you think it worked in 4 Low before, but it didn't.

Most PTO winches only operate in Neutral position on the transfer case, with the gearshift on the transmission providing different line speeds. So you can either winch or drive, but not both at the same time. Here's a link to a video that shows a 60 series with a PTO winch, which I'm pretty sure operates the same as in an 80 series.

 

[Dell80srs]

ill check it out again and see the out come. Thanks for the info.

 

[greentruck]

ill check it out again and see the out come. Thanks for the info.

It's a lot of sticks to keep track of, especially if you were in a dicey situation. Obviously, you can shift the transfer case into Low after disengaging the PTO pretty quickly and that may be what happened previously. I'm getting to the age where I know better than to always trust my memory, so I could see me misremembering something like this.

One thing about putting a winch with a cable out in forward gear, whether manual or auto like North American spec 80 series, is you stand the chance of running over the cable. That stands the chance of damaging the winch, truck or both. The way PTO winches are set-up, you can't move the truck without disengaging the winch first. When using en electric winch, then it's very tempting to use the transmission to help because it is readily available. Only with great care and keep an eye on the cable. Going in reverse with cable out can also have its share of issues. I just got in the habit of letting either the truck or the winch do its thing as a matter of safety.

I haven't crawled under specifically to check, but it's my understanding most/all of the US-spec 80 series don't even have the access cover on the transfer case that is removed to install the PTO winch drive. There's just a blank spot in the casting where that should be. Thus very limited experience in the 80 community here with them. I've not done any PTO winching myself, just watched others do it. They are what you want if you need to use a winch regularly, lots less wear and tear and more reliability and speed than electric.

 

[Bear s]

My PTO winch works perfectly while in Low, it's a FZJ 80 with automatic gearbox.

 

[Tapage]

My PTO winch works perfectly while in Low, it's a FZJ 80 with automatic gearbox.

that's interesting .. I was under the impression that as posted above you can only use them with your t-case in neutral ..

 

[Dell80srs]

My pTO is all air controlled...so maybe there is a possibility the eletric to air control could have a problem...

 

[greentruck]

Never say never with a LandCruiser. It's a world vehicle and the factory has quite a menu of options to choose from -- even if those of us in North America don't anymore.

It's possible Bear's truck just works that way. All my experience with PTO winches has been watching trucks with manual transmissions and they all seem set up the same way, at least the video refreshing old memories seems to all match, which is why I went looking for it before I answered. Maybe this is how Mr. T sets up PTO winches with auto transmissions in the rest of the world?

What happened here in the US, I suspect, is they sold very few of them here over the years. Them factory winches ain't cheap, plus electric winches seem to be favored by Americans in general. Then the Warn 8274 is practically an honorary PTO winch. So when the 80 was on the drawing board, someone made the decision to delete PTO capability for the transfer cases headed to this market. I bet it saved some money at the factory and 99.8% of first buyers were none the wiser. Now when the hardcore freaks who end up with these trucks get bummed over the fact that "no can do" it just doesn't register on the radar in Japan. I bet they don't sell too many Aisin PTO winches for the 200 series either.

On the otherhand, maybe the interlock has been defeated in Bear's truck? I tend to think Mr. T wouldn't sell them able to drive and winch at the same time, probably because some lawyer said not to. And you have to keep in mind that just because you can use a tool a certain way, doesn't mean it's a good idea. I won't belabor the cautions I noted above.

Then again, maybe someone swapped a manual truck T-case into an auto truck and it just works that way now?

I suspect we need to get a PTO winch guru to get to the bottom of this one. That's not me

 

[greentruck]

My pTO is all air controlled...so maybe there is a possibility the eletric to air control could have a problem...

Yeah,l that's interesting. Not sure that's an Aisin or not, but never heard of an air controlled Aisin. Is it just that cylinder to engage the clutch that's air controlled or does it do something else? It could be the truck 's set-up is a one-off thing by a previous owner?

 

[ozwallaby]

The movie (post 2) is showing the winch cable being tightened on the spool.... he is not actually winching to get out of a bog or whatever, that's the reason he puts the transfer in neutral.... he wants there to be an "artificial' load on the winch rope to neaten/tighten the wraps on the spool.... there is no physical/mechanical reason, as far as I know, that stops the transfer from being engaged (high or low range) while the winch is working.... So you can have the wheels driving while the winch is working as well..... I am talking about the 60 series here (as in the movie) NOT the 80 series...

 

[Dell80srs]

I bought this car last year...been in and out of the Jungle a few times and there was only 1 occasion where I had to use the PTO and shift into L4 and it worked like a charm. The car has lockers on both axles and the PTO is controlled by air...the air supply is from the air compressor. The system is quite complicated to be honest. I see my friends running PTO's with manual levers without a problem....

 

[Pin_Head]

I am not familiar with the PTOs on 80 series trucks, but on other Toyota products, they are driven directly by a gear on the transmission output shaft, so it doesn't matter whether the transfer case is in low, high or neutral, they are always ready to pull if you want. Your choice.

I can't see how the 80 series would be any different.

 

[greentruck]

Well, just reporting what I've observed. Maybe it's the case that many people describing the basics share the concerns I mentioned I learned by using electric winches, where it's all too easy to use both and run into issues, and prefer to show how to use the winch safely and leave it at that.

I don't mean to imply that it's only unsafe to combine the two, winching and power to the wheels, but it's something to be done with care and only when absolutely necessary. Most stucks are under dicey conditions and like any problem solving exercise, fussing with only one factor at a time is usually a more reliable means of escaping safely and minimizing the chance of property damage and human injury.

For the OP,
Sounds like a rather complex system, which is neat until you have to troubleshoot what's wrong. For an air-driven system, the first thing I'd check before analyzing further is the air supply. Presumably, some gauges are involved? If so, the readings on them may suggest whether the system supply is working. The next thing is whether there is an air dryer involved. I'd think they'd be a necessity under tropical conditions. Often they need to be drained at intervals if their isn't an automatic means of doing so. Some use cartridges that need to be serviced at relatively long intervals. Air tanks often have spring-loaded drain valves and these might be stuck open. My experience is all heavy truck, so not sure what you might have on a LandCruiser.

If there seems to be plenty of air to work things, next thing would be to check for air leaks. Should be able to hear them in most cases, but if one was sheared off or or a line pinched shut it could be a lot less obvious if the truck is running. Track them starting from the compressor to the air tank and onward for basic integrity.

The cylinder that engages the winch clutch in the pic is another place to check that it's getting air and working properly. Could it or the clutch lever arm be rusted up or otherwise obstructed? Are there similar air controls linked into the transfer case or PTO drive?