FJ80 vs FZJ80? (3 Viewers)

[SupraTuRD]

Hello Everyone,

I am brand new to this forum and am looking forward to purchasing a '95-'97 Land Cruiser in the near future. What are the differences between a FJ80 and a FZJ80?

Thanks in advance,

ak

 

[RavenTai]

welcome

give this a read

http://www.sleeoffroad.com/newbie/newbie100.htm

 

[SupraTuRD]

Thanks for the helpful link... however, there's no explanation of the differences between the FJ and FZJ. Wild guess, but does the 'Z' indicate the factory locking diffs?

 

[Rogue]

[quote author=SupraTuRD link=board=2;threadid=14725;start=msg138540#msg138540 date=1081897532]
Wild guess, but does the 'Z' indicate the factory locking diffs?
[/quote]

No. It signifies the change from the F series motor to the newer (and far greater) FZ series motor.

 

[PHAEDRUS]

supra,
the fj80 is a production year 91 and 92 only
the fzj 80 is 93-97. with the ifZe motor.
Dave

 

[erics_bruisers]

[quote author=Phaedrus link=board=2;threadid=14725;start=msg138544#msg138544 date=1081897657]
supra,
the fj80 is a production year 91 and 92 only
the fzj 80 is 93-97. with the ifZe motor.
Dave
[/quote]

... and the FJ lasts far longer, in some peoples' eyes --

** i'm officially a lifer -- bling, bling **

e

 

[SupraTuRD]

You guys rock! Thanks for the clarification. Does anyone have the factory engine output figures for the F and the FZ engines? Pros/cons of each series of engines?

 

[cruiserdan]

3FE: 155 hp @ 4400rpm. 220 lb-ft torque @ 3000 rpm.


1FZFE: 212 hp @ 4600 rpm. 275 lb-ft torque @ 4400rpm.

1FZFE supercharged: About 290 hp and about 375 lb-ft torque.

 

[SupraTuRD]

The Supercharger upgrade is definitely attractive. How much boost does the system provide? Do the stock components (head gasket, fuel management system, etc) hold up to the extra stress from the boost?

What material is the factory head gasket made of? I'm used to the 2JZ-GTE (4th gen supra) multi-layer steel stuff... assuming that the OE FZ gasket is composite...

 

[Pskhaat]

[quote author=SupraTuRD link=board=2;threadid=14725;start=msg138557#msg138557 date=1081899147]
Does anyone have the factory engine output figures for the F and the FZ engines? Pros/cons of each series of engines?
[/quote]

Top of my head, but the 3F-E is about 220 lbs-ft and the 1FZ-FE is 275 lbs-ft.

Pros of the 3F-E: It's dead reliable; it reaches torque apex earlier in the RPM range (read good for off-roading); it's compatible with easily obtained manual transmissions; the 3F-E was found in vehicles other than the 80 series; easy to work on; get some serious miles out of it; does not have a timing chain.

Pros of the 1FZ-FE: More torque, greater RPM range for greater HP; newer engine; smoother and quieter; can obtain factory supercharger.

Cons of the 3F-E: Less HP, and some consider it slow in an 80 series, it won't win any race; A $1 fix needs to be done to repair an ``oil hole'' eventually; mucho emissions equipment.

Cons of the 1FZ-FE: Harder to work on (subjective); need to fix ``Pesky Heater Hose'' eventually; generally has head gasket failure problems; can't easily obtain manual transmissions for it; has a timing chain.

The `Z' in the FZJ80 is for the 1FZ engine series where the `Z' means overhead cam. The 3F-E is not an overhead cam engine. Most people will swear to a 1FZ-FE as honestly the engine is more highway worthy. For longevity, and a great off-road vehicle at a fraction of the cost, the 3F-E is an old(er)-school, proven engine that just keeps going.

With that said, the factory lockers in the U.S. were only available on the FZJ80s, not on the FJ80s. It's also not terribly bad to add ARB lockers or some other lockers to either FZJ80s or FJ80s. Both came with full-time 4WD and both have the lockable center differential. One other pro of FJ80s is that they fit darn near every Toyota 15" or above wheel with the same tire range as the FZJ80, where the FZJ80s can only fit 16" wheels and upward opening more tire/wheel options to the 3F-E'd 80s.

 

[SupraTuRD]

If the FZ has common head gasket issues, a Supercharger doesn't seem like it's such a good idea... :-[

Can any FZ owners share their experiences with the headgasket issues?

On a different note, anyone have the bore/stroke dimensions of the F and FZ engines?

Thanks!

 

[Pskhaat]

Someone will have the exact figures, but I believe the 1FZ was the first overbored LandCruiser engine. The 3F-E is still an overstroked engine IIRC.

 

[PHAEDRUS]

supra,
for the info on hg failures look up grey sludge in the search engine, also look for one of our members changing his out as pm and others changing it out as had to. FWIW the 96+ models were more susceptible to hg failure if memory serves. If you want to go fast or tow anything heavier than 1k then the 3FE is not for you. if you want a tractor of a motor and dont mind going a bit slower the 80s can be had for 4-7k that gives you a lot of left over $$ for arb over a locked fzj.
as far as the ability fo the hg to handle the charger I think the consensus is that it is not an issue. the hg weems to be whimsical in its attack on people but almost always with any compromise in the cooling system it seems to be more of an issue.
So it depends on what you want. speed or ease of workingon the motor and extra $$ 3fj40 is pretty much spot on but I thought I would add my .02
Dave

 

[semlin]

I own a locked 93 but my brother owns a 91 and having driven both I think the 3FE is not bad at all for power in stock form and is really under-rated. He paid a little more than half what I paid for mine. Given current prices, a good condition 3FE powered 80 is a much better bang for your buck if you plan to keep the vehicle fairly stock and can live without the lockers (which are amazing). If you plan on adding big tires and heavy armour, then the newer motor will compensate for all that extra weight.

 

[Pskhaat]

[quote author=SupraTuRD link=board=2;threadid=14725;start=msg138596#msg138596 date=1081902070]
On a different note, anyone have the bore/stroke dimensions of the F and FZ engines?
[/quote]

http://www.birfield.com/~ramullen/FAQ/TEXT/05-04.html

 

[ginericLC]

I own both a FJ80 and a FZJ80. The FZ is far superior. About the only negative I agree with is the 16" wheels being sort of a hassle for tires and tires are bit more expensive.

With an FJ you get underpowered 3FE, still has a computer and a lot of electronics that aren't real friendly for trailside repairs. Also don't forget the pesky fuel relay that can leave you high and dry if you don't fix it. Currently there are no real engine hop ups available. Drum rear brakes and a semi floating rear end. I'm not so against the semi floater but the drums suck on this heavy of vehicle and when you go big it only gets heavier. No lockers available in US from the factory. Consider that adding lockers alone will add $1700 in parts to your purchase price and you still have install and drum brakes. Oil side plug issues on the 3FE.

The 1FZ upgrades you to a more powerful motor with slightly better fuel economy (comparing stock to stock) with towing ability. Also available supercharger. Rear disc brakes except on some rare (93/94s) and the fullfloater rear axles. ABS on those with rear discs. Locker availability and in the used market place this is basically a free option. I think the Head gasket problem is overrated and may be due to poor maintainence rather than an actual flaw (mixing antifreeze and getting the sludge). My 1FZ has 187k on it and runs like a top. The computer may be more complicated on the 1FZ and gets a little more complicated as they moved to the computer controlled tranny in 95-97 models. But typically I've heard little complaints about either. The one thing I don't like about most early FZJs and some of the mid year ones is the quality of the leather. Basically, it isn't quality at all. Some of the 97s had nicer leather and the Lexus versions (at least 97) have nicer leather than at least the earlier FZJ80s (93-94).

I love both of my Cruisers but if I had it to do over I would have tried to be more patient and found FZJs with lockers. It is hard because in Idaho we don't have a huge selection.

 

[Steve C]

For around town street driving, there is a night and day difference. Off road, unless in mud, I don't see how it would make any difference.

I test drove a couple of fj80's when I bought my '96 LC. My impression is that I had the engine at full throttle about half the time. Fzj, however, is adequately powered. As far as the supercharger is concerned, it is my opinion that the fzj chassis, using the strait axles and having lots and lots of unsprung weight (although well controlled) has about all the power it needs. it just dosn't handle like a sports car.

My recomendation: drive at least 5-10, and see what you prefer. If I wanted an 80 trail rig, I would tend to save the ca$h.

Best wishes, and enjoy the search.

All just my opinion.

 

[cruiserdan]

[quote author=Steve C link=board=2;threadid=14725;start=msg139849#msg139849 date=1082068126] As far as the supercharger is concerned, it is my opinion that the fzj chassis, using the strait axles and having lots and lots of unsprung weight (although well controlled) has about all the power it needs. it just dosn't handle like a sports car.
[/quote]

I guess you haven't towed much with it or added a thousand lbs of armor and trail gear.

 

[Steve C]

That is correct, I have hauled no armor lately.

 

[Lars]

[quote author=ginericfj80 link=board=2;threadid=14725;start=msg139794#msg139794 date=1082061023]
I think the Head gasket problem is overrated. [/quote]



Yeah...... we are all worried for no reason whatsoever


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