Budget 4bd1t -> '94 FZJ80 Build (1 Viewer)

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Joined
Dec 23, 2013
Threads
36
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437
Location
Vancouver, WA
Finally time to start my build thread. I’ve benefited greatly from reading others’ journeys on the diesel swap road and will try and document mine to help other future swappers. However, my documentation will not compare to wheelingnoob’s, Fromage, Dougal, longbow, jtaylor, 69rambler, doug720, and the many other’s whose posts have got me on this track. If you are starting your research I highly recommend reading their builds (and others I’m sure I’ve forgotten at the moment)…its amazing what you can find and the builds these folks have done are top notch.


So what’s the goal of my swap? Better MPG’s, plain and simple. I know it may not pencil out, but I just can’t handle the 10 mpg’s of my cruiser. I bought the truck as a family adventure wagon that could haul 8 people fun places…but at 10 mpg’s it’d be better to drive two vehicles instead of this one…just not near as fun. So here goes a diesel swap. I’m shooting to break 20 mpg’s if possible without breaking the bank. I think I should get close (to both probably ;)).


Why the 4bd1t? I’m impressed by its fuel economy, availability of parts, and after reading wheelingnoob’s posts I think I could rebuild it if I had to. This is my first diesel and I’ve always avoided them because of the mystique and legendary added service expense…but sounds like a moderately skilled home mechanic, that is careful, can do a lot with these engines. A Toyota would have been nice, but out of my price range. If I could have found a 4d34 Mitsubishi affordably I would gladly have gone that route as well. However, I landed a complete, driving 1986 NPR at an attractive price and have taken the plunge.


What’s different about my swap? I’m doing the same swap others have done and are doing in the FJ80…so I’ve been wondering how I can contribute to the tribal knowledge so to speak. There are two things that I think will make my swap different (not better for sure…and hopefully not too much worse). I figure I’d lead with these differences so hopefully you can see the reasoning (or lack there of) behind some of my swap decisions. The first goal I’m shooting for is I’d like to have the truck off the road for as short a time as possible. In my dreams I’d like it to be five days from pulling the engine to first, ghetto no-exhaust, almost no instrument drive around the block. I’m hesitant to even mention this as I know its overly ambitious, but I think it sets the tone for where I’m headed. I work in education so I have summers off and can devote full time to this project once it starts. IF I make this goal it will only be because of the work of many others on this board documenting all their learning so I can (hopefully) have most the parts I need on hand to keep the process rolling.


The second thing that’s different about this swap is related to the first. Since I’m trying to get the truck back on the road as fast as possible I’m not going to make a ton of changes to the engine, turbo, etc. I am going to add an intercooler and different turbo as part of the swap, but am undecided on whether that happens right off or whether I swap the motor in as is (since I know it runs ok) without changing anything. (I have a running list of questions that I’ll post up in another post that I’d love to get some expert feedback on…and this is one of them). I also plan to get AC working on the truck, but my engine didn’t have AC on it and that will also wait until after the swap is done…though hopefully not too long. I will also be putting in a used trans without rebuilding it. I know this is different than many peoples’ approach, but I want to get everything in and test it out before upgrading etc. If I have to go back and rebuild things at a later date I’m fine with that.


So there’s my intro to the swap. I’m shooting for starting around mid-June and am hoping to be back on the road by the beginning of July. I’ll post up the details of the parts I’m using in the next post.
 
I owe a great debt to wheelingnoob for his write up. If you haven’t read his, please stop reading mine and go read his first. His work is incredible and his documentation is top notch. Here is the parts list I’ve got so far (I’ll add notes below for those interested). I’m going to go ahead and put prices on here not to be tacky, but so people can get at least one data point for what this has cost. A note about this…I enjoy the hunt. I love junk yards and I love finding good deals. I’ve also been blessed by some really great people giving me really great deals on some of these parts. All that to say…I think all these prices are on the low end of what’s achievable…


Isuzu 4bd1t engine ($800 with manifold and bellhousing after selling trans and hulk to wrecker)

Isuzu 4bd2 exhaust manifold

Isuzu/Jatco Automatic trans bellhousing

Oil Filter relocation block (machined myself following wheelingnoob’s plan…$10)

TD04HL-18T turbo ($140)

Toyota A440 from a ’91 FJ80 ($300 w/ shifter, flexplate and TC)

Torque converter stalled down by local converter shop (won’t happen until adapter is done…quoted $200)

Machined adapter plate (in process…see open source adapter thread…no cost estimate)

FJ80 power steering hoses ($12 at pick-n-pull)

FJ80 Cruise control actuator/throttle cable ($20 at pick-n-pull)

Late model NPR intercooler ($100)

FJ60 Radiator ($50 plus rebuild)

Dakota Digital Tach sensor and module (still need to order…$120ish)

Generic Intercooler piping (still need to order…$100ish for cheap stuff…suggestions welcome)

Isuzu exhaust brake (donor vehicle)

Stainless exhaust flex coupler (free wrecking yard find)

Isuzu fuel pump and fuel filters (donor truck)

2” bump stop extensions (trying to keep my 2.5” OME lift…TBD $50)

EGT and Boost Gauges (to be bought still…suggestions?...I’m thinking glowshift 3-1 $200)


And the list goes on…if you have things that are glaringly missing PLEASE feel free to give me a heads up. I know there are tons of fittings and hardware I still need to get…


Engine:

I bought a 1986 NPR with the 4bd1t and a manual 5 speed trans. The truck had 163k miles on it when it was parked reportedly due to a bad alternator. I bought it from a guy that worked for the company that owned it and had done maintenance on it for about the last 10k miles and he seemed confident this was the problem. I was able to drive it around before buying it and started right up with minimal haze and seemed surprisingly quiet and peppy. The truck was just a cab and chassis and I only drove it up to 45ish. But it was fun J


My engine has some oddities about it as it is a pretty early model. First it has the IHI turbo on it with a horizontal mount manifold. These turbos are not the T3 bolt pattern and there aren’t very many good options that bolt up without some adapting. The later 4bd2 used an angled manifold turbo mount that is T3 and thus I also have acquired a 4bd2t exhaust manifold to use when I upgrade the turbo.


It is also timed at 14 degrees advanced according to the id plate and has a boost compensator on it. I plan to keep the Isuzu cable actuators for shut off and boost compensation. The engine also lacks an AC pump. It appears it has some mounts that can be used for one low on the driver’s side, but I’m afraid those won’t work once its in the truck.


Turbo:

Dougal is the man when it comes to turbos on the 4bd1t. If you haven’t checked out his posts on 4btswaps.com and you are at all interested in turbos and diesels, you owe it to yourself to read his stuff over there. I knew nothing about turbo mapping a few months ago, but really enjoyed learning the little bit that I know now. All evidence seems to point to the MHI TD04-19T being pretty awesome on these trucks. This is the turbo wheelingnoob is putting on his. Very cool. The td04 is a pretty common turbo on Saabs, Volvos, subaru’s, hyundai’s etc. It comes in a myriad of different sizes. The Saab and Volvo setups seem easiest to swap and the volvo’s are pretty common around here. The trick is the –XX part in the part number which designates compressor configuration. After reading mounds of info I found out that late ‘90’s Volvos use several versions of these turbos and that in fact the V70R model in 98-99 used a td04-18t and I believe in 2000 used the td04-19t. I lucked out and was able to find a good turbo from a ’99 V70R at LKQ for $140 bucks J Its close in size to the 19t and seems to map decently to the 4bd1t so I’m going with it.


Trans:

I looked at using compushift on my A442, but the cost was just too prohibitive for me. I am going to stall down the torque converter on my A440 and run it. The trans was reported to drive fine (I picked it up from another cruiser diesel swap) so I plan to just run it as is until the valve body mods wheelingnoob and others are testing become publicly available.


Radiator/Intercooler:

I picked up an FJ60 radiator following wheelingnoob’s lead and then got an NPR radiator that fits around it perfectly. I’ll have to trim a few tabs off the radiator, but it shouldn’t require any changes to the intercooler. I’m hoping it all goes together as slick as I think it will.


Truck:

This whole mess is going into a 1994 FZJ80 with 163k miles on it. Factory lockers and 2.5” OME lift with a winch bumper I built recently. I also snagged a dual batter box at pick-n-pull from an FJ80 and will be adding a second battery with the diesel conversion. If anyone is looking for a 1FZE let me know…
 
And now for my running list of questions that I'd love people to weigh in on:

1) Do the dowel pins in crankshafts/flywheels/flexplates serve only alignment purposes or are they intended to transmit a torque load? I'm used to dowel pins being for alignment, but the flexplate from the A440 has a dowel pin hole in it. It doesn't appear to be balanced or counter weighted so why is it there? The only explanation I can come up with is that the dowel pin must transmit some torque load? I'd like to not use this dowel pin in my adapter (the isuzu bolt pattern conflicts with it) and am locating the flexplate off its center bore. Anyways, basic question is do the dowels on cranks/flywheels need to transfer torque or just serve as alignment features?

2) How structural do you think the outer flange/ring gear on a flexplate is? Clearly it adds rigidity to the flexplate, but do you need it? In stock applications it has to be there to carry the ring gear, but in my adapted location I'd like to cut down the A440 flexplate for easier bolt access...I'd do this on a lathe to keep it round and true, but am worried it might effect the structural rigidity of what already seems like a flimsy part. It doesn't seem like its loaded by the torque converter in a manner that cutting it off makes a difference, but maybe it does. I plan to model it in FEA to find out, but was curious what you all think. Any examples of flexplates that are stamped steel without a ring gear flange would be awesome.

3) I need to get my alternator rebuilt on the 4bd1t. I understand that when you get an alternator rebuilt you can often have a 'W' tach signal added on a diesel. Has anyone got this to work with the FZJ80 tach yet? I'd like to go this route instead of dakota digital if possible, but don't want it to be a big hassle either. I think I read somewhere that the FZJ80 tach looks for three pulses per rev...is that right?

4) Anyone routed exhaust of the engine compartment on the driver's side above the frame rail? The stock gas exhaust on my 80 goes out the PS above the frame rail and I think I want to do the same on the driver's side...but we'll have to see how things look once its all in.

5) Aside from having to redo intercooler piping and exhaust, anyone see a reason not to stick the motor in with the non-intercooled turbo? Or should I just bite the bullet and do it all at once? I like the idea of putting things I knew were working when I took them out back in without messing with them. Should make trouble shooting easier. Then once I have it running at baseline I can start modifying things for better performance. Thoughts?

I'm sure many more to come, but these are the ones I'm thinking about at the moment.
 
yehaw! 3 more weeks of prep time. I'll be watching your thread closely.
 
I think I've settled on cutting off the ring gear on the flex plate. I realized that it is bolted to the torque converter which will certainly add as much rigidity as the outer lip and ring gear offered. This will make it possible to get the torque converter bolts in I believe.


...via IH8MUD app
 
Give me till the end of this coming weekend before you cut the ring off. I may have an easier work around.

Glad to see the thread started and happy I was able to lay some ground work for your swap.


...via IH8MUD app
 
Awesome! I have enough other machining tasks to keep me busy I suppose ;) I got the flywheel to flexplate puck turned on the lathe last weekend. Fits the flywheel, flexplate, and torque converter pilots just how I like it. Happy to send you any measurements if that'd be helpful, but I suspect you are far past where I am. This Friday I need to get the bolt patterns drilled/tapped in it and that piece will be done. I ended up using Acralloy from Pacific Machine. Its a 41XX product that is pre-heat treated, but still machined really well. Here are the specs: http://www.pmtsco.com/acralloy-h-cpo.php.

I'm headed over to look at your intercooler piping route now...getting ready to order up my piping kit. Anything I should watch out for?
 
Tips for the intercooler pipes is remember how much the engine will rock and try and keep that in consideration when laying out the piping. It would also be a good idea to have the A/C compressor on when you are making the intercooler pipes. Also use some high quality multi hump silicone couplers to absorb some of the vibrations. I basically had everything else bolted to my engine and engine bay before I made the pipes.

One last thing make the pipes to eliminate as many couplers as possible each one can be a potential boost leak. I have a total of 4 on mine. High quality T bolt clamps seem to work the best.


...via IH8MUD app
 
This is sweet!! I really hope you get this going soon, I have gotten so busy at work I feel bad not working forward on the project... Let me know what if there is anything you need, I'll do what I can.

I like the sounds of your material for the flex plate adapter. If you don't mind post up what dimensions, or a model and we can compile them together in one assembly.

Matt
 
what turbo flange does the td04-19 fit?

I found some sources that say t3 but most post 90 saabs are t25, pre 90's got t3 flanges.

I'm currently looking for a quicker spooling turbo upgrade for my 4bd2t powered fj40 but i can't justify the price tag for an hx30. It's terrible when a turbo will cost you as much as you spent on the motor.
 
what turbo flange does the td04-19 fit?

I found some sources that say t3 but most post 90 saabs are t25, pre 90's got t3 flanges.

I'm currently looking for a quicker spooling turbo upgrade for my 4bd2t powered fj40 but i can't justify the price tag for an hx30. It's terrible when a turbo will cost you as much as you spent on the motor.

I'm not sure I know the answer to that. My turbo is off a Volvo and is only the -18t. It appears that it will fit the 4bd2t manifold I have once I open up the mounting holes on the turbo a bit. Mine has the 3" turbine exit that I think only came on the V70R...which is making it difficult to fab a downpipe...so the Saab might be a better route.
 
I'm working on finalizing my adapter dimensions and test fitting everything this weekend. Hoping to do the final machine work next week so I can start on the swap the week after.

A couple pics for the curious...

I started with a blank 1"x15"x15" plate of 6061 Aluminum
photo2.jpg

Test fitting the torque converter to flywheel adapter:
photo1.jpg

Just a few chips being made...
photo3.jpg
 
I'm behind on some pics...

Here's the motor pulled from the NPR.

photo.JPG


A440F from a '91 FJ80 that is getting a cummins with a manual trans:

IMG_2720.jpeg


Turbo from the '99 V70R:

photo (1).JPG
 
by t3/t4/t25 turbo flange i mean the flange that bolts the turbo to the manifold.

i wasn't sure if you used an adapter to mount the turbo but as you're describing i guess you are modifying the mounting holes to fit which is interesting, id love to see pics of the manifold and manifold mounting flange of the turbo before you bolt the two together.
 
by t3/t4/t25 turbo flange i mean the flange that bolts the turbo to the manifold.

i wasn't sure if you used an adapter to mount the turbo but as you're describing i guess you are modifying the mounting holes to fit which is interesting, id love to see pics of the manifold and manifold mounting flange of the turbo before you bolt the two together.


Its all covered in my build thread, pictures and all. Basically the bolt holes on the Volvo flange needs to be opened from 8mm to 10mm IIRC. Then the step on the Volvo flange needs to be machined off. Thats it.


...via IH8MUD app
 
Looking good andy, making fast progress on that adapter. Converter bolted on highlights how little room there is for that assembly.

Good luck! Looks good so far.


...via IH8MUD app
 
Looking good andy, making fast progress on that adapter. Converter bolted on highlights how little room there is for that assembly.

Good luck! Looks good so far.


...via IH8MUD app

Thanks! Yeah...ring gear definitely needs to come off unless you come up with a miracle solution. I think with the ring gear cut off though it should actually be fairly straight forward to get the torque converter bolted up. I think I found a few of the points where you had to grind on the bellhousing too. It clears just barely at the moment with no grinding, but I'm gonna give it a bit more space I think.

Hey on your down pipe, did you make a flange to connect to the turbo or ? I can't remember. I think I might need to make one for mine...
 
thanks for the info, i'll look into how to machine the step off of the turbo flange.
 
Hey on your down pipe, did you make a flange to connect to the turbo or ? I can't remember. I think I might need to make one for mine...

I actually found a guy in California that makes flanges for all the Volvo downpipes. Its in my thread I believe. Mild flange was $20 shipped.



...via IH8MUD app
 

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