power windows--ARGH!

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N

NickV

Joined
Sep 10, 2010
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1
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Please tell me Im not losing my mind! I have an 89 4runner with power windows. Heres the deal, I just dug this thing out of the ground at my mothers farm and replaced a couple of tires, timing belt, plugs, wires, cap rotor, fuel filter, thermostat, and fuel pump and now its tip-top (aside from a little rust). Once I got it running I went around and checked out all the electricals, power locks work, drivers power window goes down but not up, wired in reverse the motor works, and passenger side works only from the passenger switch (fine with me). So we drive it home from Missouri to Florida. I begin working out the bugs and first thing I do is take out the drivers power window switch, clean all the black crud off the contacts with alcohol and add some Noalox compound to the points. Stick it back in and the drivers side works beautifully. It Briefly it operated the passenger side window, then :doh: it quits. I go to the other side and lo and behold no worky either from the pass side where it had worked before.

In the process of cleaning the switch, I may have screwed up the button that locks out the other windows from operating, so I bypassed that button with some solder over the points (hmm, unless completing that ckt is what locks the window, Ill have to check that out). But heres where it gets nasty, I removed the pass window motor and plugged it in on the driver side and it works as advertised. I checked continuity on every single wire in the system, and it all checked out. I checked for Voltage at the pass motor two prong "cannon plug" through the switch, and that all seems to be working properly (11.7 up and down). I even took the pass switch and plugged it in on the driver side and that worked too...so Im really at a loss here. I also cant seem to find any websites that have 1st Gen 4runner parts. I have been working on this for 2 days now, and am aboot to lose it! :bang:

Can I just cut the driver side switch out of the passenger side ckt? Or am I missing something here? The Chilton Schematic is OK, but it had a couple things wrong, wondering if any of you had issues like this. Physics say this should be working, but it is not...I think I will dick with that lock button some more until maybe I hear back from one of you guys.

Thanks
 
Ewwwww..... In the FAQ thread at the top of this section, there are links to some Factory Service Manuals. They well have the diagrams you want. I hate electric gremlins for sure!!! My best advice is to take a few days off from working on it, and start again with a fresh point of view.

Welcome to Mud!!!! :flipoff2: Glad to have you!!! :cheers:
 
thanks Fan. Im just going to put the SOB back together...Im wondering if the window motor is case ground, and Im just not grounding it well enough. If not, I will just deal with only having driver window for now. I need to open the garage back up for my GF's car to park. Perhaps its just the case ground, and me fiddling with the window lock switch has fixed it, but since its not grounded I cant test it and all this stress is just meaningless, lol. Ill look at those schematics in FAQ. Thanks for the welcome.

Oh, and also, I was wondering if maybe anyone on here has heard of a quick release mod for the removable top? Seems pretty time consuming the Manufacturers way, and Im not really in the market for a soft top yet....
 
The case does not need to be ground. You have two woes going into it.flip the switch one way and one wire is positive while the other is ground. Flip the switch the other way and it reverse the wires.
 
Welp, I have made a discovery. When I plug a jumper from one of the two wires going into the motor and clip the other one to any ground on the truck, it works in that direction, and vice versa. So, whats happening is, when the wire not being used for power at the time is off it is not completing the ground ckt, Its not happening inside the motor b/c Im using the wires that come out of the motor to test it this way. In the schematics, there is only one ground and that comes off the driver side master switch, and it is obviously working fine because driver side works, and I tested it as well. *driver side master sw button for passenger window still not working....

All signs are pointing to case ground (sorry mike c), I just cant imagine what else it could be. I would just hate to get the damn thing all put back together and find out Im wrong, but thats no problem because I have ruled out the motor and the linkage, and Im down to a wiring prob if case ground isnt the problem.

Lol, thanks for letting me bounce all this off your forum, I think sometimes just typing out my findings helps me sort it out!

Its Miller time...:beer:
 
best of luck to you, it's those little conveniences that are the biggest PITA to deal with.
 
Maybe this diagram will make things more clear?
window wiring.gif
 
well, you were right, its not case ground. Im going to print your pic and take that out with me. See what I can rig...thanks. If not, Im calling this off for a couple days like Fan said. Its just frustrating as hell that something so simple could be kicking my ass like this, hahaha. I fix aircraft for a living for christ sake. If this doesnt work, Im re wiring the whole thing. Im also thinking that the ground provided through the master sw could be compromised somehow. Not sure where that would have happened tho, its a pretty simple switch assy. Wish I had another one to test it with. They are allowing voltage through as they should...this is a ground problem. cant be in the motor, it works on the other window, I was thinking a rectifier prob, but that would be in the motor as well, Bugger!

Thanks for the diag...
 
There isnt a ground wire going to the pass side switch, never was. There are 5 wires going to the pass side switch. 1) 12V, 2) down pwr to motor 3) Up pwr to the motor, 4) connecting wire to master window sw (dn) 5) connecting wire to master window sw (up). Then off the master switch is a ground that comes from the door control relay and to the chassis. Also, there is only one 12V power that comes from the door control rly that branches into 2 before the master window panel which feeds both switches.

Another weird thing I noticed when I was just checking continuity again; checking the 2 wires that run from master sw to pass sw THROUGH the pass switch (one at a time), Im getting continuity at all times no matter the position the switch is in. So thats telling me that its skipping the motor and going straight to ground somewhere, Path of least resistance right. But if I cut those wires, then there will be no path to ground at all.
 
Time to break down the window wiring in the FSM.

Since I swap my half doors on frequently I needed to be able to disconnect my power windows quickly and easily. I ended up moving all of the switches under the radio, and now only have 2 wires going to each window.

Here are where I put my switches, drivers window, rear window, passenger window.

IMAG0079.jpg
 
yea, I think Im going to do something similar to what you have here. It will be alot cheaper and easier than trying to find replacement switches...and even still not being 100% on what the problem is. Just wire it up myself so I know its right! HAhahaha.

Thanks
 
Welcome to power window switches on first gen trucks / 4runners! I like the idea of running wires to the center console and bypassing the switches in the door. I have tried extensive tests with different switches, cleaning the contacts, etc. Generally I've found it's not a problem with the wiring or grounds or the motors, it's the rocker part of the switches. The damn things are made of plastic and are screwed together, my original switch crumbled where the screws attach. For now I have removed the rocker part of the switch and just press on the brass contact strip inside the housing, both windows go up and down (including the passenger window :eek:) just fine.

Roger Brown has an extensive (EXTENSIVE) write up on power window switches, plus all kinds of other Toyota stuff on his website. Here's a link CLICK HERE to the article.

Oh and according to cruiserdan, the original switches, in all colors, have been discontinued for a while.

12voltguy, are you listening? He does make a winch switch panel that takes the place of the ashtray.
 
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