TLCA name change what the heck? (3 Viewers)

[Big Daddy]

I totally agree . Keep the name the same.
If the current B.O.D put as much effort in other areas as this topic TLCA could be better off. But they seem to get off on some thing that doesn't even come close to what's on hand. Leave the name alone and try to figure out how to keep those that leaving in large amounts.

 

[rmirandayopo]

Why the name should be changed?
I’m proud of being a member of TLCA, even that I occasionally join them for trips, I like the Trail Adventures Magazine, as it is, just for Land Cruisers. That is the rig that I own, so that is the material that I’m interested to read about.
We should change the rules to allow other Toyotas on their events? Could be…
FJ Cruisers, Tacomas, Tundras, any other, could be part it, but will be not longer exclusively for Land Cruisers…
Can you share the Broken Birfield Bar tale with any other guy who doesn’t own a Land Cruiser?
I like the diversity concept, and that is why I belong to several clubs, all type of vehicles… but I support TLCA with my subscription and showing up in their events.

 

[SteveLCetc]

Some of the posts I have read seem to reflect even amplify a sentiment that any member other than a owner of a LC is somewhat of a second classs citizen in this association. I find such an underlying vein of desention very disturbing. A well known figure once stated "A house divided against itself can not stand" and likewise the TLCA can not stand any similar division. Be that a division of by-law, by contentiousness or elitest member ideal.

It is mindsets such as these that will turn this association from a world class 4x4 community into another divided and splintered old car club.

Tim Stine

Quite true, and why I think a change to "Toyota and Land Cruiser Association" or something similar is something to be considered, and not just dismissed out of some sort of misplaced vanity.

 

[AJAEbj42]

So I have to ask, as I am not a member of other car clubs, but what do the MG or Triumph clubs do about 'cars becoming rarer and rarer'. Do they branch out and start accepting Datsun Fairlady's? If not, are their numbers decreasing?

It might be worth a little research to find out what other clubs are doing. I doubt they change their names, but you never know.

 

[twoyotas]

an outsiders viewpoint: I have known about the TLCA for many years, but never joined, as my LC was not running, I had no money for fixing it, and I assumed that as member, one should have a running LC to be an active member. Other priorities kept me from spending money on my LC, let alone join any club, or association, in which I would have to give money for something I could not really take part in. When I bought my Tacoma, in 1996, I found the Toyota Tacoma Off Road Association on the web. There were no dues, it was more of an email group. I kept up with reading emails, but as with before, money was tight, and I could not take my truck to the level others were, as it was, and still is, my daily driver. Somewhere along the line, the NorCal TTORA fell apart, and I did not see the TTORA name for a long time. When it returned, it had become the Toyota Territory Off Road Association.
Back to the point, now that I am actively rebuilding my FJ40, I have a new interest in joining the TLCA. I searched the web for local 4wd clubs, to get to know other 4 wheelers, keep up my motivation for the project, lend my time to volunterr activities (such as FOTR work parties), and eventually hit the trails with other enthusiasts. I found a club in my own town, that was part of CA4WD, and started to go to their meetings. I liked the folks in the club (4WD Cliffhangers of Vacaville), learned that they had been around for forty years, liked what they were about, and joined the club. I was still interested in the TLCA, but it seemed pretty far away. After going to the PMC swap meet in Petaluma, my interest was renewed, and I searched the web for something about the PMC. This search led me to the TLCA website, where I found that there was a chapter of the TLCA based right in my town (Toyotas Rock), although I had never even heard their name, even when I did a websearch for 4WD clubs in Solano County, and Vacaville. When I did find a description, it said they are a club of LC owners, other Toyota 4WD owners, and even 4WD vehicles of other makes and models (even Heeps!) I have not joined yet, as it would be another annual fee, for what was beginning to sound like just another 4WD club, and I am already in a 4WD club (ironically one that was originally exclusive to Heep owners).
After doing much research on 'Mud, I have decided that when I have some extra scratch, I will be joining TLCA through a 'Mud link, in the hopes that "Mud will benefit in someway by using their links.
I find it ironic that the TLCA was founded because Bob Garret found that the Heep clubs all turned up their noses at his "foreign jeep," and snubbed him for it. On that basis, I believe it would be hypocritical not to welcome any Toyota 4WD into the TLCA, although I would not, if in charge, allow non-Toyotas into a Toyota club. There are enough all inclusive 4WD groups and clubs, nowadays. I am pretty sure that if I owned a Heep, I would not even be interested in joining a Toyota club. Reading the TLCA history on their website, it sounds like there was LC snobbery before, (excluding members from runs because they didnt have a specific type of Cruiser? Ridiculous!) and it caused a fair amount of trouble in the association. It is one thing to host an FJ55 run, it is another to tell a member he is not welcome because he is in an FJ60, or, for that matter, a Truck, Tacoma, or FJC! Again a Toyota group founded because they were not welcome elsewhere should not snub someone because they drive a Toyota Truck, 4Runner, Tacoma, FJC, or even a Sequoia (not sure about Highlanders, or Rav4s, as they are more like cars, but if they were willing to take it through a trail....).

That being said, I would not even think about changing the name, it is classic and timeless, just like a 'Cruiser. I would think that trying to involve other Toyotas is fine, and should be done. After all, the TLCA was grown by including clubs from all over. It seems to me that they have lost many potential members by alienating them (more irony) because they don't have Land Cruisers. If there are FJC, Tacoma, and Truck clubs, that are not part of TLCA, it is only the fault of the TLCA.

If the name were changed, I would lose interest in joining, a it would then be just another 4WD club, and I already belong to one, which includes members with Willys (the only real Jeep in my mind) CJs, TJs, XJs, JKs, old school Cherokees, Toyota Trucks, FJ40s, my Tacoma, and one FJC. There was even an International at one time. Just my nickles worth....

 

[Green Lantern]

Leave the dam name alone.

If you want to expand TLCA, simply focus on helping our chapters. The independent members of TLCA are basically magazine subscribers. At every event, folks identify themselves with their CHAPTER, not TLCA.

So... help the chapters and you help TLCA.
Happy Trails! N

 

[Lake Rat]

WOW!! I think the name should stay the same. I believe that the 4 Runners, '80's FJC's etc. are all direct desendants of the Land Cruiser. If it weren't for the Land Cruiser, quite possibly the other vehicles wouldn't have come to production and have the following that they do. Although I only own
'40's , I enjoy wheelin' with the other brethern of the Toyata vehicle as well. Their build up are just as nice and the owners of these vehicles seem to fit right in. Hey! we're all Land Cruiser's to a point...there's some Land (obstacles)...let's Cruise it!!! Every Toyota 4wd vehicle I see around my area, I talk to them about our club and association, however, most of these folks seem to be "Mall" type folks an not really intrested in taking their vehicle off road (basically a status symbol, kinda like most, not all people that have Hummers). Most are surpised that there is an association and local club. But I think as long as we get the word out every chance we get, maybe the word will get out that we accept all of these vehicles. It may also come down to a mind set with the different owners also. My .02

 

[timmer]

what do the MG or Triumph clubs do about 'cars becoming rarer and rarer'. Do they branch out and start accepting Datsun Fairlady's? If not, are their numbers decreasing?

Like I said divided and splintered old car club

 

[SteveLCetc]

The question is not "do you want to change the name" nor is it "is there a stigma associated with not owning a Land Cruiser in a club called the Toyota Land Cruiser Association" because individual preferences are not the issue, and we all know there is a stigma attached by some people who view other Toyota 4x4's as somewhat inferior and "not worthy" of full acceptance, thereby decreasing the popularity of the organization.

The question is whether or not changing the name will help the organization sufficiently to make it worth it. Of course it will help in terms of quantity of members, but what is the prediction of that quantity? Would simply inserting the word "and" in the middle be optimal?

 

[canucksafari]

The question is whether or not changing the name will help the organization sufficiently to make it worth it. Of course it will help in terms of quantity of members, but what is the prediction of that quantity? Would simply inserting the word "and" in the middle be optimal?

I hate to say it that the Nissan Patrol/Safari has more in common with a Land Cruiser than a 4Runner (design and shared parts). Myself and probably everyone else would not want to see "and Nissan Patrol" added. I own two Nissan Patrols and one day will own an old school Cruiser. I am a member of the local TLCA chapter here and when I do own a Cruiser I will join the TLCA. I hate it when people mess with a good thing just to get more buyers (aka members). Just take a look at the newer Prados compared to the first generation Prados if you want proof. Stick with the KISS principle and the TLCA won't endager itself from being watered down and everyone will know what is the focus of the organization.

At the same time, being open to other Toyota 4x4 owners for membership is a great thing. It educates them about Cruisers and hopefully motivates them to aquire one when they are able. IMO, that will do a lot more for keeping the TLCA viable than changing the name to be more inclusive/confusing.

 

[kim]

I hate to say it that the Nissan Patrol/Safari has more in common with a Land Cruiser than a 4Runner (design and shared parts). Myself and probably everyone else would not want to see "and Nissan Patrol" added. I own two Nissan Patrols and one day will own an old school Cruiser. I am a member of the local TLCA chapter here and when I do own a Cruiser I will join the TLCA. I hate it when people mess with a good thing just to get more buyers (aka members). Just take a look at the newer Prados compared to the first generation Prados if you want proof. Stick with the KISS principle and the TLCA won't endager itself from being watered down and everyone will know what is the focus of the organization.

At the same time, being open to other Toyota 4x4 owners for membership is a great thing. It educates them about Cruisers and hopefully motivates them to aquire one when they are able. IMO, that will do a lot more for keeping the TLCA viable than changing the name to be more inclusive/confusing.

We had a little bit of a kerfuffle in our local chapter about having members who didn't own LandCruisers and particularly those who didn't own Toyota 4WD's. Our club was near unanimous in it's vote that we would not be exclusively LandCruisers and we would allow, based on a vote, members who didn't drive Toyota 4WD's. We would, however, maintain the LandCruiser focus as the core ideal. I think we have a Jeep or two, one Patrol and one early Bronco out of a club of 40 or so.

This whole issue is divisive with strong opinions all around. In my opinion, the Board of the TLCA would be wrong not to explore ways to remain viable and keep providing members with something of value. I didn't like the idea of changing the name because of the history of the association, that was until I read the proposed Toyota and LandCruiser Association. I think it should be considered.

After all, we can still say "Who's your Daddy?".

 

[canucksafari]

After all, we can still say "Who's your Daddy?".

I am pretty sure the Nissan Patrol can say his was a Land Cruiser. The AK was first built by Toyota in 1941 and the 4W60 was 1951. Man, vehicles had babies early way back then.

 

[Hottrod81]

All of you with sand in you panties and self centeredness around landcruisers only reaffirms to me that I won't renew my membership next year. It has nothing to do with the name change but has to do with the attitude of not wanting TLCA to evolve and become a better organization.

 

[canucksafari]

All of you with sand in you panties and self centeredness around landcruisers only reaffirms to me that I won't renew my membership next year. It has nothing to do with the name change but has to do with the attitude of not wanting TLCA to evolve and become a better organization.

It's just a discussion ...how about explaining rather than accusing?

 

[Hottrod81]

It's just a discussion ...how about explaining rather than accusing?

I guess you haven't read the whole thread. Stuff that is discussed by the BOD should stay there. But since the OP opened a can of worms, let's talk about how TLCA wants to create their own forum and leave MUD. That's right, during a time when they stuggle to maintain viability, they want to spend more money on software that MUD lets them use for free.

 

[canucksafari]

I guess you haven't read the whole thread. Stuff that is discussed by the BOD should stay there. But since the OP opened a can of worms, let's talk about how TLCA wants to create their own forum and leave MUD. That's right, during a time when they stuggle to maintain viability, they want to spend more money on software that MUD lets them use for free.

Intersting, sounds like a whole new thread to be started by someone.

Stuff discussed by BODs generally should not be secret. When boards have to do a lot of work "in camera", it is usually a sign that something is wrong, especially in a public organization.

And yes, I have read the whole thread. But I would like to know why you said this "All of you with sand in you panties and self centeredness around landcruisers". I'd also like to know how changing the name will help the TLCA to become a better organization.

There is no need to have the discussion degenerate into name calling if we don't agree with someone's ideas.

 

[toy4xfun]

I hate to say it that the Nissan Patrol/Safari has more in common with a Land Cruiser than a 4Runner (design and shared parts). Myself and probably everyone else would not want to see "and Nissan Patrol" added. I own two Nissan Patrols and one day will own an old school Cruiser. I am a member of the local TLCA chapter here and when I do own a Cruiser I will join the TLCA. I hate it when people mess with a good thing just to get more buyers (aka members). Just take a look at the newer Prados compared to the first generation Prados if you want proof. Stick with the KISS principle and the TLCA won't endager itself from being watered down and everyone will know what is the focus of the organization.

At the same time, being open to other Toyota 4x4 owners for membership is a great thing. It educates them about Cruisers and hopefully motivates them to aquire one when they are able. IMO, that will do a lot more for keeping the TLCA viable than changing the name to be more inclusive/confusing.

i can tell you that Nissan patrol does not share the most important thing with a 4runner, that would be Toyota.

 

[toy4xfun]

look the board is going to have many discussions about things and if every one of them came to light way before they make a decision to vote, it will cause more people to leave, that said those that are members of the tlca should have a right to express their opinions before any vote that could make or break the tlca.

 

[66fj40x2]

Leave the dam name alone.

If you want to expand TLCA, simply focus on helping our chapters. The independent members of TLCA are basically magazine subscribers. At every event, folks identify themselves with their CHAPTER, not TLCA.

So... help the chapters and you help TLCA.
Happy Trails! N[/QUOTE
x2

If there was this much energy put into other business and topics at hand .......... there may not be so many topics at hand.......

 

[wardfoto]

Nick, Mike, and anybody else that cares to know:
Working on taking care of the chapters and members is my top priority as new MSVP. The limited edition badges are one example of this. A cool little piece of the club, only a few will get them, and then they are gone. It gets the members excited, puts some money in our coffers to do more to help the chapters, and more to restock our store with the merch people want to buy. In addition, we have a couple of surprise announcements coming up, that will be in direct support of events. It's a small step, but we are trying to head down the right path.
It's my number one goal, and I hope folks will stay around long enough to see if it works.
We are (since everybody thinks it's cool to throw business out to the general forums before it's ready to be presented...) forming a committee to discuss the pros and cons of name change. This thread will be an excellent place to look for point-counterpoint, and help us make a list. the committee is NOT to recommend a name change, or not to recommend a name change, but rather why it might be good, and why it might be bad.
When we have done the homework, we'll get the info out to you guys.
A