Thinking about a diesel

[cruizerbuddy]

A few years back i picked up my first bj60 donor.
Just over 4 grand. Had everything i needed to do my diesel swap. Hella strong naturally aspirated 3b. 5 speed. Fuel tank. Throttle linkage. Steering lines. Clutch system. Fuel lines. Drivelines. On and on. One stop shopping yo.
Explain a better way to swap to a diesel on a budget.....

 

[deanfj40]

Ive been doing some research on the 12ht and found that they are becoming a lot tougher to find replacement parts. So thats not to big of a plus for me. Are there any newer more efficient diesel engines that fit into the 40? probably better mpg than 19. If im going to spend 3-4x as much on a diesel than the 2f for only 7mpg more doesnt seem like a good deal. (mpg is a concern since I do go on long road trips)

 

[cruizerbuddy]

i mean, a cummins 4bt is your next best bet really as the adapters and such are already available. have fun doing that on a budget lol! if you want to see increased fuel economy with your h42...well you'd be impressed with a h55f for your long trips. coupled with a 3b diesel that works proper and the low weight, you'll love it! i just saw another bj60 pop up on the other side of the border just today. 12ht too! driving condition to boot! CHEAP!

 

[deanfj40]

i mean, a cummins 4bt is your next best bet really as the adapters and such are already available. have fun doing that on a budget lol! if you want to see increased fuel economy with your h42...well you'd be impressed with a h55f for your long trips. coupled with a 3b diesel that works proper and the low weight, you'll love it! i just saw another bj60 pop up on the other side of the border just today. 12ht too! driving condition to boot! CHEAP!

so i take it that the bad gas millage is due to the stock 4 speed trany right?
also guessing from the prices of a diesel and all its parts i could be looking at around 6k right + a 5 speed? Im really eager to get this thing rolling I just dont want to put anything in thats going to make me feel like a slug going up hills on the highways
also what about a 4 cylinder turbo diesels?

 

[Vossie]

so i take it that the bad gas millage is due to the stock 4 speed trany right?
also guessing from the prices of a diesel and all its parts i could be looking at around 6k right + a 5 speed? Im really eager to get this thing rolling I just dont want to put anything in thats going to make me feel like a slug going up hills on the highways
also what about a 4 cylinder turbo diesels?

wait, your petrol is cheaper than diesel?? wow. for me thats insane. over here where i am diesel is the cheapest fuel.

the 4 speed box isnt the main cause of bad fuel economy. the only difference between the h42 and h55 is that the h55 has a 0.845 ratio final drive in its top gear, whereas the h42 has only 1. that means the difference between the 2 will only be apparent when in top gear and at speed. an h42 and an h55 with matching diffs and tyres and going along at 30mph will rev the engine at the same speed.

in my part of the world where pretty much all cruisers are diesel and where everyone wants a diesel, the accepted cruiser mpg is 7kms/L, or 16.5mpg. thats right across the board from the 1HZ 70 series to the 1HDT 100 series. the reason isnt just the engine. a cruiser is a big heavy car. its not and never was designed to be efficient. it was designed to go any where and to be unbreakable.

@cruizerbuddy has a great idea if you want MPG. the 3B is a great diesel motor, but it does lack the power of the 12HT. but it will give much more MPG. having said that, you will feel it going up hills. thats from my own experience. the 12HT on the other hand has more than enough power to move a 40, going up any kind of gradient. remember that the 3B is normally aspirated, so altitude will effect it. the 12HT, with its turbo, wont feel the effects of altitude the same way a normally aspirated engine will.

at the end of the day, you are the one who has to make the decision. its your 40 after all personally, i would go for a 12HT bc i have experienced a lot of engines in my 45's, 2F, 2H, 3B and 12HT. of all of them, hands down, the 12HT is by far the best. and spares, although are becoming rarer, will always be around. you just might have to look a bit harder

put i promise you this, drop a good 12HT properly into your 40 and you WONT be disappointed.

my $0.02

 

[cruizerbuddy]

with the 12ht 19mph isnt terrible but yeah it isn't great. with the 5 speed and the 12ht i would expect better. my 3b and 5 spd, 16 gallon tank. i'm averaging 575 kms per tank. the 5 speed is a huge upgrade over the beastly h42. plenty of power up hills and such, its different from a 2F is the 3b, but the 2 3b's i have are strong. i think the 12ht is a better set up all around, but not as easy to come by imho. it's all about the condition of the used motor. a poorly maintained 12ht with a turbo is just that. i suspect a percentage of people have put turbos on a 3b that really just needed an overhaul. the good thing about the donor method is having everything you'll need. until you break things. i love my 3b and 5speed, but i don't need to go fast. i want the fuel economy and this setup is far more economical than have been my 25 years running the 2F. i'm sure in a 40 series, running a 5 spd and solid running 12ht you'd see much better than 19 mpg's.

 

[Vossie]

with the 12ht 19mph isnt terrible but yeah it isn't great. with the 5 speed and the 12ht i would expect better. my 3b and 5 spd, 16 gallon tank. i'm averaging 575 kms per tank. the 5 speed is a huge upgrade over the beastly h42. plenty of power up hills and such, its different from a 2F is the 3b, but the 2 3b's i have are strong. i think the 12ht is a better set up all around, but not as easy to come by imho. it's all about the condition of the used motor. a poorly maintained 12ht with a turbo is just that. i suspect a percentage of people have put turbos on a 3b that really just needed an overhaul. the good thing about the donor method is having everything you'll need. until you break things. i love my 3b and 5speed, but i don't need to go fast. i want the fuel economy and this setup is far more economical than have been my 25 years running the 2F. i'm sure in a 40 series, running a 5 spd and solid running 12ht you'd see much better than 19 mpg's.

ja, i will be putting a H55 in very shortly. expecting to go from 8 to maybe 8.5kms/L. but 80% of my driving is in town. most of my driving is between 40 and 70kph. so i dont really feel the lack of the 5th gear just yet. but i havnt done any road trips yet because i dont have the h55 yet. i know on the open road it will make a big difference, ive heard as much as 10kms/L on the open road with a 12HT and H55.

i do love the 3B. it reminds me a lot of the 3L in my dads hilux. die hard, bullet proof and slow that engine has over 570,000kms on it and its still going strong

 

[cruizerbuddy]

i love how slow it is! but you're right, the 5 spd gains are only at speed.

 

[roscoFJ73]

The 12HT is a great engine, but it has a lot of parts that are difficult to source. Even more so if you are not in a country where they were sold new.
I think the 1HZ offers the best bang for the buck when everything is taken into consideration.

 

[Vossie]

The 12HT is a great engine, but it has a lot of parts that are difficult to source. Even more so if you are not in a country where they were sold new.
I think the 1HZ offers the best bang for the buck when everything is taken into consideration.

i love the 1HZ. but here where i am a BAD one will set you back $5000 US. a good one in the region of 7k and a mint one is pretty much $9k. its crazy how popular and sought after they are here, and hence, how mad people are when it comes to pricing them

my 12HT cost me $4K. and it came with an h55 for that price. although not the h55 i need. oh well

 

[tatat]

Just my opinion. for the price you will put in a diesel engine, put a 2f cheap engine if you can source it easily and spend the money on gas. I dont think you want to use it as a dd?

 

[Vossie]

Just my opinion. for the price you will put in a diesel engine, put a 2f cheap engine if you can source it easily and spend the money on gas. I dont think you want to use it as a dd?

i had a 2F. ran great. loved it. but i just couldnt afford to run it as my DD

 

[Delancy]

Just my opinion. for the price you will put in a diesel engine, put a 2f cheap engine if you can source it easily and spend the money on gas. I dont think you want to use it as a dd?

Put an we'll built 2F in it and the chit eatin' grins will cause painful cramps, as it outruns any other I've ever driven.

If going to the trouble of any diesel with an H55F/BF1A in a 40, which is a lot of work, in and of itself, 1HZ wins hand down, if for no other reason than it can still be purchased new and is on par with the intellect of the vintage 40.

I had a 1HZ in my '78 for a little while, and it was a nice feeling...

 

[Vossie]

Put an we'll built 2F in it and the chit eatin' grins will cause painful cramps, as it outruns any other I've ever driven.

If going to the trouble of any diesel with an H55F/BF1A in a 40, which is a lot of work, in and of itself, 1HZ wins hand down, if for no other reason than it can still be purchased new and is on par with the intellect of the vintage 40.

I had a 1HZ in my '78 for a little while, and it was a nice feeling...

View attachment 1398672

man, how much did a brand new 1HZ cost? i f i might ask

 

[mudgudgeon]

Put an we'll built 2F in it and the chit eatin' grins will cause painful cramps, as it outruns any other I've ever driven.

If going to the trouble of any diesel with an H55F/BF1A in a 40, which is a lot of work, in and of itself, 1HZ wins hand down, if for no other reason than it can still be purchased new and is on par with the intellect of the vintage 40.

I had a 1HZ in my '78 for a little while, and it was a nice feeling...

View attachment 1398672

You're sposed to put it in the other end!

 

[tatat]

Here I drove diesel cars all my life. low power and great torque. When I drive my fj 55 it is just the same, 4rth gear at 40 km/h . I think it is really close to an old generation diesel engine . Exept the noise of the inline 6 that I love and how quiet it is when down with the RPM.
You will have nothing more with a diesel except the gas mileage.

 

[doug720]

Another option is to consider an Isuzu 4BD1/2. These are 4 cylinder factory turbo charged + intercooled on the 4BD2. They are much more civilized engines compared to the 4BT Cummins. Very quiet with little vibration.

These are good diesel engines that were sold in the US, and have really good parts availability here - any GM or Isuzu dealer and aftermarket parts. They use liners and have were designed to push around 15k pound box trucks - flat nose Isuzu NPR's, so pushing a 6000k pound LC is easy.

I have had a 4BD2 in my 60 for over 6 years with an H55. It has PS, AC, has averaged about 19 mpg over 50k miles, and will pull the grapevine loaded at 70 mph with the AC on. They fit well and work well in a LC.

I did the swap myself in 3 weeks, and after I sold off the 2f and other spare parts, I had well under $2000.00 into the swap.

There are many of these swaps on mud, in 40's, 60/62's and 80's.

I love mine, and you are welcome to take a look in person if wanted as I live near LAX. Below is the link to my swap.

Just another option.

 

[Delancy]

i f i might ask

A metric chit tonne for the shortblock and head, but, considering the overall scope of the very length project it's going in.....priceless.

You're sposed to put it in the other end!

There'd be no easier conversion, period.

Idle solenoid to fuel cut, power to starter, alternator circuit and you're done with wiring. (Unless glowing required, but timed relay could work).

By process of deduction (which is usually flawed) think the frame mounts may even work (if not they're readily available) so 7X rear cross, H55F/BF1A.

my fj 55 it is just the same, 4rth gear at 40 km/h .

5th at 190km/h and there's still pedal left....which wouldn't be remotely 'safe', relatively speaking, in the tightest 40 and much more 'fun' to drive than a hopped up, turbo'd 1HZ.

That said, the 1HZ is still the most logical 'cruiser' engine, in my opinion.

 

[Vossie]

A metric chit tonne for the shortblock and head, but, considering the overall scope of the very length project it's going in.....priceless.



There'd be no easier conversion, period.

Idle solenoid to fuel cut, power to starter, alternator circuit and you're done with wiring. (Unless glowing required, but timed relay could work).

By process of deduction (which is usually flawed) think the frame mounts may even work (if not they're readily available) so 7X rear cross, H55F/BF1A.



5th at 190km/h and there's still pedal left....which wouldn't be remotely 'safe', relatively speaking, in the tightest 40 and much more 'fun' to drive than a hopped up, turbo'd 1HZ.

That said, the 1HZ is still the most logical 'cruiser' engine, in my opinion.

dont get me wrong, i idolize the 1HZ as the BEST naturally aspirated engine toyota has EVER made. and yes, i would agree, it would be very very hard to beat it for an all round logical cruiser engine. my parents had 2 cruisers when i was a kid, both 1HZ's. one went up to 700,000kms and then sold, the other to 1,200,000kms .

but i am in the camp that wouldnt turbo it, with it being an indirect injection diesel and all. not saying it cant be done or that it will blow up, as i know plenty plus people who have 1hZ-T's and they are great. just saying that personally, i wouldnt do it.

what i do like about the 12HT is on paper, it has a bit more horse power than the 1HZ, 134bhp to 129bhp. it also has more torque, 315nm to the 1HZ's 285nm. and, its a 4L vs a 4.2L. so it uses a little less fuel to do it. on all the cruisers i have ever driven and been around with 1HZ's, and theres been a lot, the average fuel consumption was 7-7.5kms/L. on my 12HT, im getting between 8 and 8.5kms/L.

look, all im saying, is that i ADORE the 1HZ. it is still right up there as my favorite engine of all time. it just now has to share its place with a 12HT is all

 

[ozcrusier]

My 12ht is getting great fuel consumption not sure on the figures but my old 1hdt in a heavy 80 wagon was costing around $240 return for the big smoke and my hj75 cost $140 from the same return trip. The fairly overdrive 22 speed h55 helps as the engine is at 1900 rpm at 70 mph with the 211 diffs. I had any choice of toyota engine from the 1vd down.