Sick 2F ... Head Gasket? (1 Viewer)

[jasharp]

60 has been running terrible. Initially thought fuel issue, did a few other things, today I checked compression.

1 - 85 (100 wet)
2 - 50
3 - ZERO
4 - ZERO
5 - 65
6 - 70

I didn't bother to do the rest wet after the zeros. I removed and reset to make sure, still 0-0. Its at 215k, I know nothing of the history prior to past few years. I've replaced the coil is all. Desmogged by previous owner. Initially thought valve issue but with both 3 and 4 I understand can be the hg between them without water leak? No coolant/oil mix as I can tell not losing water. Gets warm I would say under load but not HOT. Any ideas on other things I should check? (prior to pulling the head. )

 

[Hugh Heifer]

Ouch.

 

[Sam Stewart]

If you have zero compression you either have a blown head gasket or you could have some bent valves. Either way you're probably going to have to pull the head. It is entirely possible to have a blown head gasket and not losing coolant. It just depends on where the gasket blew.

 

[Elbert]

you might have a cracked head too... but I'm guessing the head needs to come off.

 

[FJ60Cam]

That's exactly what happened to me. The head gasket blew between two cylinders - with no loss of oil or coolant. It actually happened on a wheelin trip and made the Chatt-Memphis drive home on 4 cylinders.

Check your valve clearance first to eliminate bent valves.

I just pulled the head, cleaned up the surfaces, and put 'er back together with a new factory gasket.

 

[Hugh Heifer]

Any news?

Sent from my thing with Woody's junk.

 

[jasharp]

Hey guys, long time no, er.. not much of anything. finally pulled the head and sure enough gasket blown between 3 and 4. considered just slapping it back on, but decided not to because of high miles and unknown history. At the machine shop the guy said it looked like it had been running hot (pic below as pulled) but as far as I know it hadn't been really. Occasionally gets warmer under load but nothing i thought too bad (that is, 1/3ish on the gauge up to more than half.) no water loss to speak of, i think I added to the overflow a few times this year. Maybe my gauge is bad and hot all the time? Old damage?

Anyway, it is done. Was warped pretty bad(?), he took off .018 to flatten. Also said exhaust valves were quite bad, but i believe was able to regrind/reuse all. Haven't picked it up yet, waiting on my gasket kit to get here and take him seals/anything else in there he needs I don't remember.

Leaves me to make sure Im not running hot. I can get one of those laser thermometers to check. What are my likely cause --

- clogged lines/poor water flow?
- bad fan clutch?
- running lean?
- i will replace thermostat too but i assume it would have been HOT all the time.
- any other ideas?

Also interesting --

- intake cracked underneath and re-welded who knows how long ago. Ugly but seems sound. exhaust manifold heat riser issue? can I test that with a torch?
- the uh er what is it called, carb riser? plate carb sits on, has like a wide skirt that i assume blocks heat; that is broken (the skirt -- also in bottom pic) and apparently has been a while with the pieces just sitting in there. Can I leave it, or replace?
- the engine hoist hook on rear driver side of the motor was UNDER the head-bolts. Seems dumb, is that normal? didn't see it on my diagram but it is for an 1980 (mine is an 83)

 

[Elbert]

get a real aftermarket temp gauge and install that where you can tell what actual temps you are running.

If it has the orginial fan clutch on it....get a new one, is the fan shroud in good shape and the fan blade in good shape. Radiator might need to be flushed/cleaned. Thermostat + gasket + seal. IF the water pump is old, hell I would replace that too.

 

[FJ60Cam]

Just looked at mine... yep, the hoist is under the head bolt.

 

[Elbert]

if that head still has the bolt in teh area of the #5 cylinder (i think) that there are numerous threads on...get that tapped and fixed while the head is off.

 

[sk8salomon]

Get one of those fatty manifold gaskets, not oem ones. I think Hugh had good things to say about them, like 1/4" thick gasket. It will seal up even a warped manifold I've heard.

 

[jasharp]

Thanks for the tips guys. Couple more things I can look at while I wait on my second gasket set (first came in bent badly).

-Hugh, can you give me the skinny on this fat gasket?
-Elbert, Im not sure which bolt you are refering to?
-Anybody running a fixed fan?

 

[FJ60Cam]

Get one of those fatty manifold gaskets, not oem ones. I think Hugh had good things to say about them, like 1/4" thick gasket. It will seal up even a warped manifold I've heard.

Actually, the oem one is pretty decent these days. (Felpro) But, it's a helluva lot cheaper to buy it at O'Reilly's. its the exact same gasket. I ran two on the advice of Mark W. It's been holding for four or five years now with headers. One would probably be fine. It's pretty beefy (not 1/4" though)

 

[FJ60Cam]

I think Elbert was referring to the oil galley plug. They are notorious for popping out, which leads to massive oil loss on a short amount of time.

It's on the spark plug side of the head. You can tap the hole and put in a bolt.

If you already have a bolt, you are already fixed.

 

[Elbert]

I think Elbert was referring to the oil galley plug. They are notorious for popping out, which leads to massive oil loss on a short amount of time.

It's on the spark plug side of the head. You can tap the hole and put in a bolt.

If you already have a bolt, you are already fixed.

Yes... I did not explain it very well but yes. Make sure its fixed before you reinstall the head. See link

https://forum.ih8mud.com/60-series-wagons/346362-oil-galley-plug-fixes.html#post5103955

my comments on the other questions...


Fixed fan.... yes I've run them on other stuff. There are generally two types...one is a flex fan and the other is a truely fixed fan blade. Most are loud as far as noise. If you are running a mechanical fan the best solution is the OEM fan and fan clutch. I ran a fixed fan on a hot rod I use to screw around with ...for only a short time and then it went to the trash can.

 

[Hugh Heifer]

Get one of those fatty manifold gaskets, not oem ones. I think Hugh had good things to say about them, like 1/4" thick gasket. It will seal up even a warped manifold I've heard.

Yep. Remflex I believe is the brand. I had posted something on a source.

https://forum.ih8mud.com/tn-stlca/520509-remflex-6-cylinder-toyota-manifold-gaskets.html

Put is on with OE torque specs. They are made to crush under that load and not more. They are the bomb.

 

[jasharp]

From Japan With Love

No, its not running yet.

Buggered one of the alignment pins; considered trying to use it anyway, but didnt want to misalign anything, or damage the gasket, etc. It may have been ok, but i didnt do it. $2 a piece from the dealer.

Also wanted to chase the headbolt threads, but it turns out it is M13x1.75 which is odd apparently and not in any tap kit I could borrow or buy locally, nothing larger than M12. I ordered one. Kind of pricey at $30 but even if someone had one I could borrow in Chatt or Nashville, it would have been impractical. Maybe if I can ever make it to another meeting again. . . So if anyone needs one in future I have one.

Other "Oh look while it's apart"
- new waterpump from sam at Lowe T
- oil galley plug (thanks elbert, fj60cam)
- fan clutch - think Im going to end up with aftermarkte Aisin (found somewhere here on mud)
- believe I will reuse the cracked/rewelded intake mainfold
- carb looks like it hasnt been touched in a long time, but messing with that starts to get scary.

Plan to resume Sat morning. Any other "oh dont forget!"s are wellcome.

 

[jasharp]

Nothing too exciting here, but for my own documentation:

Oil galley plug:

Threads Chased:

Felpro Gasket:

Torqued to 90lbs (manual said 84-97):

Fan Clutch arriving today, should be the last of the spendy bits. After the Holiday should be able to continue.

 

[Hugh Heifer]

Nice work.

 

[jasharp]

my kingdom for an ultrasonic cleaner

Sloooooowly making progress.
I have come down to Saturdays only, but another week I should be able to add on to that. This is good because I would need to look at the brakes on the 4Runner if I were going to go on the New Year's Run (Im still less than 50% on that, dont have the guts yet to post it in the main thread.)

Essentially I am spending a lot of time preping; for example, i ended up disassembling the entire rocker assembly (i had not planned on it, they cleaned it when they did the head but a couple were kind of like frozen.) The manifold I have taken off twice -- finally got all the bolts in after filing down one of the flanges. So now the exhaust is snugged, but without the intake. Hopefully I can sneak it on without anything moving too much.

Few more assorted pics: