Progress or lack there of on my noise problem

[Romer]

Based on the symptums, I believe it is either the front or rear bearing in the front differential. I can't see why removing the drive shaft would make a difference on the bushing that goes behind the knuckle spindle. Plus, I know I put a lot of grease inside the hub so I don't see the spindle being an issue. I torqued everything to spec as I put it back together. I also took the end cap off and verified there is grease at the end of the spindle.

I don't think its the Tcase because the noise is up front at about the driveshaft to pinion plate sound (best I could tell). And, I believe (not sure) the squeaky whistle bearing sound was there before I replaced my tcase. I recall taking my driveshaft off then to daignose the problem.

Is it possible since I had a bad Tcase causing severe vibrations that those could have coupled thru the driveshaft into the differential bearings?

I know its not the driveshaft after trying a CV shaft. At least I have completely ruled that out.

Another reason is that when I added the 1"spacers, the driveshaft noise got worse and everyone said it should have worked with a 2.5" lift as they would be the same as the heavies. I also think that the height (pinion angle) with the spacers is about equivelant to what it was when I installed the lift with no ARB, Winch or sliders.

My plan is to take it to Slee and have them put the ears (device) on and pinpoint the sounds.

I'll post the results because I always like to know how the story ends.

I sure am learning a lot. I can swap drive shafts and swaybars pretty quick now.

 

[Bongani]

Romer

I have the same GRRRRR on my vehicle when decellerating at highway speeds which only started after my OME lift. Also did the out of phase props change, stripped the whole front diff, adjusted ring bearing preload, pinion preload, replaced birfields (that was shot). Replaced the transfer output bearings, front and rear. With the front drive shaft removed the sound was almost entirely gone if not totally, after all one gets so programmed to look for trouble after listening for grrrr sounds all the time. Eventually dropped my lift with about 1" which reduced the problem to now very occational. Then the truck looked like a stinkbug so I added 15mm spacers and the problem was back in full force. Took out 5mm and the problem is gone again.

What is cause it? Well I don't know, but it lift related. I am still thinking that pinion angle might have something to do with it.

Good luck and please give feedback. BTW, I had a high whining sound at highways speeds that was resolved after replacing the transfer output bearings.

 

[Romer]

Bongani,
I had the lift installed by Slee last October. The first I heard this partiqular grrr sound was two weeks ago and its getting worse. The first I recall hearing the squeaky bearing noise was April. I installed the 1 inch spacers in July and took them off a week later bacuse it was making the classic drive shaft noise. This does not sound like that. It's a deeper tone and less regular in tempo and sounds more like damage is occurring.

The sound my tcase made before I had it swapped it in April was completely different.

Did you try the CV Double Cardon shaft in your set-up? I recall that has worked for others, but had no effect on my situation. That to me rules out the lift as it relates to angles at the tcase and pinion. Someone let me know if I am wrong with that assumption.

 

[Bongani]

Did you try the CV Double Cardon shaft in your set-up? I recall that has worked for others, but had no effect on my situation. That to me rules out the lift as it relates to angles at the tcase and pinion. Someone let me know if I am wrong with that assumption.

Nope, decided against it. Dropping the lift with 1" was sufficient enough for me to resolve most of the problem.

 

[tarbe]

Could the additional lift induce enough pinion angle that the bearings are not getting lube?

Castor correction should minimize this effect, but if the correction is not sufficient, will the pinion bearings go dry?

 

[OGBeno]

Ken--

It sounds that since you have taken care of most possible common stuff that can occur after a lift...

Did I recall that you had your xfer case fail on you and then you replaced it? Just wondering as I remember xfer failures being rather uncommon.

I'm going to agree with Tarbe and some others who are pointing to your pinion angle. The bushings to your specific truck (and I stress the relative nature of these problems) might not have corrected enough. Notice how just bringing the truck down a bit takes care of vibration and sound problems? That sounds like driveshaft anglularity issues.

You might have to take more drastic action to correct angles in your driveline.

The front diff/xfer case bearings might be worn, but I would rule out the xfer as that was recently replaced, again, IIRC.

Unfortunately, I'm not sure what the corrective measure might be--maybe the brackets from Slee? I believe they are for 3"+ lift and they might work better at correction pinion angle from front diff. to xfer.

Good luck man.
-onur

 

[StillCrazy]

Noise

Mine had a similar noise that kept getting worse till it finally started locking up. Ended up being a snap ring on the front axle where it goes into the front hub was missing (broken I assume) The replacement was done by a dealer after they located it so I sorry I can be more specific. In my case it would be running just fine and then all of a sudden make a nasty growl and pull to one side. The opposite side from the missing snap ring interestingly enough. It also messed with the antilock system so the brakes wouldn't work either.....
Good Luck

 

[Romer]

Thanks for the input. I guess I should mention with my problem, you can't feel it in the steering and it dosen't pull at all. I have taken my hand off the wheel when it is happening and there are no movement issues.

Beno - I did have to replace my transfer case. Robbie did it at Slee along with installing my lift. He did me a favor and looked over everything Thursday and didn't see anything obviously wrong.

I could have spent hours checking out more stuff, like tearing down the pass side axle to check to make sure everything was good. These new ear things Christo has are pretty good, and for a reasonable fee I can have the location isolated and know what I am dealing with.

 

[Safado]

Did you try the CV Double Cardon shaft in your set-up? I recall that has worked for others, but had no effect on my situation. That to me rules out the lift as it relates to angles at the tcase and pinion. Someone let me know if I am wrong with that assumption.

Ken,

By no means an expert in the area...but I think you might be working under a wrong assumption. I just fixed this problem in the rear of my 80. As I understand it, angle is everything when it comes to drivelines. If they're not perfect, they'll moan just like you're describing. With your stock shaft, they need to be parallel...this has been changed with the lift. (why it's taken so long to show itself I don't know). If you have a CV joint, the pinions needs to be pointed up to the t-case...if not, you'll get vibrations.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that just cause you slap a CV shaft in the front, doesn't mean the vibrations will go away...it needs to be properly set-up for that shaft as well. Don't rule out the pinion angle. You could also try someone elses working shaft with a similar lift pretty easily.

Good Luck.

 

[Romer]

The front diff does not get turned up to the CV shaft. The rear diff does. If it was the pinion angle, the CV shaft should have worked.

It is getting progresively worse over the last couple of days. I can hear it at slower speeds.

I will post the results after the ear test and then after its fixed.

Ken

 

[Safado]

The front diff does not get turned up to the CV shaft.
Ken

Again, not an expert...just spent hours discussing it with them and reading about it...but who said this? I have CVs both front and rear...both pinions are pointed as I understand they should be. No vibrations.

Read Geometry 101 on Tom's Tech Info page. The other articles are good reads as well.

http://www.4xshaft.com/

 

[Romer]

Thats what Robbie told me. I consider that a good source

 

[sleeoffroad]

The front diff does not get turned up to the CV shaft. The rear diff does. If it was the pinion angle, the CV shaft should have worked.

Ken, you do not turn it up by adjusting something. however with the correct caster at about 4"+ of lift, the pinion is tilted up to the transfercase. So, unlike the rear where you have to do it bu changing the length of control arms, the front just end up that way. That is why I did not think the CV shaft would make a difference in your case. Also that is why he CV shaft does not work in cases where the geometry does not lend it to the use of one.

 

[Romer]

Thanks for clarifying Christo. So the CV shaft proved it wasn't the drive shaft, did it also prove it wasn't the pinion angle? My problem is getting worse, so I think the pinion angle is a moot point in any case.

 

[Romer]

Did you try removing the rear driveline and run the front driveline only?

Should have listned to you more phil.

Christo put the ears on and found two problems. One appears to be the rear drive shaft and the other was caused by the slider touching the body in the front. When I slowed down, both made noise and the slider against the body steered me to the front.

I'm off to pick it up and then will have the rear shaft rebuilt and balanced and see if that takes care of it. Still not clear as to why removing the front drive shaft made the noise go mostly away. I'm sure someone will explain it to me.

 

[T Y L E R]

Still not clear as to why removing the front drive shaft made the noise go mostly away. I'm sure someone will explain it to me.

I'm thinking it was transmitting some vibe thru to the axle/frame --->slider


Without it on , there was a break in transmission ..



TY

 

[sleeoffroad]

Moral of the story, when trying to isolate noises always try removing both shafts, one at a time. Also, for a lot of people the noise sounds like the front, but if you look where the transfer case is located, you will see that the rear output flange is about inline with the front seats. The upper u joint of the rear shaft has a distinct notch in it when you rotate it around it's axis.

U joints are a lot easier to replace than opening a diff. And starting with the driveshaft rebuild is the obvious choice. The needle bearings are more likely to go than bigg roller bearings. Lack of lubrication is probably the main culprit. Typically no-one runs the diff dry, but they sure do run the driveshafts dry.

 

[landtank]

I remember a thread a while back that people where having a vib problem with the right sliders. I have had mine on now for over 1000 miles and not a peep out of them. I did post of an interference with the transmission rear crossmember that I had, was that where the rubbing was from?

 

[Darwood]

Should have listned to you more phil.

Christo put the ears on and found two problems. One appears to be the rear drive shaft and the other was caused by the slider touching the body in the front. When I slowed down, both made noise and the slider against the body steered me to the front.

I'm off to pick it up and then will have the rear shaft rebuilt and balanced and see if that takes care of it. Still not clear as to why removing the front drive shaft made the noise go mostly away. I'm sure someone will explain it to me.

I had the same problem with my truck. For some reason removing the front driveshaft can quiet down a noisey rear driveshaft. I dealt with the driveshaft vibrations for a year before I found out that it was in fact the rear shaft that was the culprit. During this time period I went from J springs to the 6 inch springs and the noise continued through all heights.

 

[Romer]

Even with Christo's morale (it's a good one). The problem was masked by the slider hitting the pinch weld in the front. This caused a lot of the noise that we were hearing. I only bring that up so that others might check that as well. I believe that was making the grinding noise that was coming from the front pass side. You can see were there was metal to metal contact.

Thanks Christo for your help today. The electronic ears are also a good thing as it quickly pinpointed the noise.