Build My 40 Build... 20 years and Counting... Purists beware, this may hurt... :D

[bikersmurf]

BTW, this is the alternative to welding the U-joint onto the shaft. Welding isn’t legal in these parts, whereas, set screws into countersunk holes, lock nutted, and lock tight is.

It’s not hard to grind the flats, and I definitely don’t trust my welding ability to the level I’d risk liability and insurance coverage on it. The insurance companies are always looking for a way to get out of paying... no reason to give them a possible out.

 

[RWBeringer4x4]

I did both - though the welds are purely secondary. Threaded set screws backed up with lock nuts, but then I added a couple of small tack welds as backup.

 

[bikersmurf]

And last but not least...

to replace the stock steering shaft bearing.

Now I’m torn... if I repaint the column it’ll look new... or stick with the patina for now.

 

[archie73]

Now I’m torn... if I repaint the column it’ll look new... or stick with the patina for now.

I’m in the same theoretical rabbit hole- I’m preparing to send the body out for paint. I’d like to refresh certain things in the cab, but I want to drive it as well in a month or two when the roads are dry. I’m afraid if I start restoring dash knobs, I’ll end up trying to redo everything else. I’m thinking I’ll get it back on the road and enjoy the summer and think about the interior when they bring back the magchloride next winter.

 

[bikersmurf]

I’m in the same theoretical rabbit hole- I’m preparing to send the body out for paint. I’d like to refresh certain things in the cab, but I want to drive it as well in a month or two when the roads are dry. I’m afraid if I start restoring dash knobs, I’ll end up trying to redo everything else. I’m thinking I’ll get it back on the road and enjoy the summer and think about the interior when they bring back the magchloride next winter.

Couldn’t do it...

It got a fresh coat of semi-gloss black and some silver on the shaft. A bit less patina... at least it’s not high-gloss.

 

[bikersmurf]

DOM crush sleeves.

Mockup

Temporarily bolted in.

Pitman arm height relative to stock.

I’ve ruled out using an arm with 1.5” more drop as the TRE will interfere with the leaf springs on full stuff.

Next up drag-link and TRE to connect it all together.

Anyone know which Chevy TRE will have a Chevy taper on one end and metric threads on the other. In a perfect world it’ll be 5” longer. Ideally I’ll use a Toyota TRE with a mount for the steering stabilizer, shims to fit the TRE, and the correct length. Although theoretically possible, I’m not sure if I’ll be able to find a unicorn.

 

[bikersmurf]

I’ve found a TRE in my parts pile to make it all work.

ID TRE for Scout II P/S conversion - Toyota Hilux? 70 series?

I’m hoping someone can identify this TRE. Facts I do know: 1) it has the same size and pitch as the original Fj40 D/S TRE that attaches to the bell crank. I’ve confirmed this by screwing it into two different drag links. 2) the TRE taper matches the P/S pitman arm I have from a 9/1969 four...

forum.ih8mud.com

I’ll post up more info once I find a new TRE… I’m 98% sure I’m on the right path, but getting one seems to be an issue. One parts store is bringing one in… another I regularly deal with couldn’t find stock anywhere in North America. Fingers crossed the one I’ve had brought in is the right part.

 

[pb4ugo]

You need to differentiate between tre(tie rod end) and the tie rod, which is the rod connecting the tre's. A drag link with metric left hand threads on 1 end and sae right hand threads on the other end is custom. Cruiser Outfitters used to and appears to still offer custom drag links like you are looking for. Or get dom tubes and weld in the required threaded inserts. Or make,cut,weld something using 2 different drag links(1 40 link &1 gm link) If your box is positioned correctly a drop pitman arm should not interfere with the tie rod at full compression. On my last scout steering conversion I'm using a jeep wrangler pitman arm which drops and did the starter bushing trick for the differences in taper. . I looked thru my pile of tie rod and drag link rods and found a longer drag link that I could cut to proper length and tap to 17mm right hand threads, so I could use a stk fj40 tre on the pitman arm end. I have no idea what application the longer toyota drag link came from. Maybe its from a fj55, but idk for sure. In the future I will be upgrading to 60 knuckles, so I will be doing the samething except cutting a 60/40 tie rod to length for the drag link pitman arm end and tapping . It makes for a clean stock appearing look and there's no guessing what replacement parts are needed.

!

 

[bikersmurf]

You need to differentiate between tre(tie rod end) and the tie rod, which is the rod connecting the tre's. A drag link with metric left hand threads on 1 end and sae right hand threads on the other end is custom. Cruiser Outfitters used to and appears to still offer custom drag links like you are looking for. Or get dom tubes and weld in the required threaded inserts. Or make,cut,weld something using 2 different drag links(1 40 link &1 gm link) If your box is positioned correctly a drop pitman arm should not interfere with the tie rod at full compression. On my last scout steering conversion I'm using a jeep wrangler pitman arm which drops and did the starter bushing trick for the differences in taper. . I looked thru my pile of tie rod and drag link rods and found a longer drag link that I could cut to proper length and tap to 17mm right hand threads, so I could use a stk fj40 tre on the pitman arm end. I have no idea what application the longer toyota drag link came from. Maybe its from a fj55, but idk for sure. In the future I will be upgrading to 60 knuckles, so I will be doing the samething except cutting a 60/40 tie rod to length for the drag link pitman arm end and tapping . It makes for a clean stock appearing look and there's no guessing what replacement parts are needed.
View attachment 2814377!

Found it. Stock 40 Tie Rod, 80-81 Toyota Pickup 4x4 TRE. The Pickup TRE gives me the extra 5” of length in the Tie Rod assembly, and the extra hole gives me a mount for a stock steering stabilizer if I decide to run one. If the 40 stabilizer doesn’t have enough travel I’ll switch to a 60 series which does have more travel.

 

[bikersmurf]

I believe the old TRE I was trying to match is from a 84-85 4x pickup. The new one for an 80-81 is a 1/2” shorter… which will allow for some adjustment. The other fit, but only with the Tie Rod ajustments bottomed out at both TREs.

The boss for the steering stabilizer being on the top is better. The taper on the TRE is an exact match for the OEM pitman arm I have from a September ‘69 Bel Aire P/S pitman arm I’ve been saving for this conversion for about 22 years. If the TRE is slightly too short, I’ll cut the wide splines in the pitman arm to allow me to index it over a spline or two, but at the moment I don’t think it’ll be necessary.

I believe this 555 made in Japan part is a Unicorn… it sure looks promising.

 

[bikersmurf]

Here’s a pic of the old TRE I test fit…

As you can likely see in the first picture, the pitman arm is clocked slightly outward, and the slightly shorter 80-81 TRE should help with that.

 

[pb4ugo]

Idk, what you mean the tre is slightly outward. I wouldnt reposition the pitman arm on the p/a shaft. Just install the arm and be sure to center the box and the frt end. I found the center of the frame and centered the frt end at wheel mount surfaces to wms. I then dropped a string from the frame center and marked the tie rod w/ frt end centered, so I had an easy reference of center while setting everything up. Once everthing is centered you can measure for drag link length. This ensures equal turning each way and the box is happy & centered. Ive never had to have a stabilizer with sag steering.

 

[pb4ugo]

Once e erything is centered, dont forget to center the steering wheel.

 

[bikersmurf]

Idk, what you mean the tre is slightly outward. I wouldnt reposition the pitman arm on the p/a shaft. Just install the arm and be sure to center the box and the frt end. I found the center of the frame and centered the frt end at wheel mount surfaces to wms. I then dropped a string from the frame center and marked the tie rod w/ frt end centered, so I had an easy reference of center while setting everything up. Once everthing is centered you can measure for drag link length. This ensures equal turning each way and the box is happy & centered. Ive never had to have a stabilizer with sag steering.

In this case I’m using a OEM Toyota drag link. I’m 85% sure the adjustment in the TREs will be sufficient to allow the box to be centred. If the TREs are turned out too far, I’ll use a hacksaw and file to turn the wide splines in the pitman arm into two splines to compensate for the OEM bend in the pitman arm allowing me to move it closer. The alternative is a custom pitman arm (or drag link) to save 20 minutes work with a file.

My goal, and I’m on target, is to use all off the shelf parts. The flaming river DD slip shaft and U-joints are the exception to that.

 

[bikersmurf]

Once e erything is centered, dont forget to center the steering wheel.

That will be the easy part since the steering box input shaft and the steering wheel are both unindexed.

 

[bikersmurf]

You need to differentiate between tre(tie rod end) and the tie rod, which is the rod connecting the tre's. A drag link with metric left hand threads on 1 end and sae right hand threads on the other end is custom. Cruiser Outfitters used to and appears to still offer custom drag links like you are looking for. Or get dom tubes and weld in the required threaded inserts. Or make,cut,weld something using 2 different drag links(1 40 link &1 gm link) If your box is positioned correctly a drop pitman arm should not interfere with the tie rod at full compression. On my last scout steering conversion I'm using a jeep wrangler pitman arm which drops and did the starter bushing trick for the differences in taper. . I looked thru my pile of tie rod and drag link rods and found a longer drag link that I could cut to proper length and tap to 17mm right hand threads, so I could use a stk fj40 tre on the pitman arm end. I have no idea what application the longer toyota drag link came from. Maybe its from a fj55, but idk for sure. In the future I will be upgrading to 60 knuckles, so I will be doing the samething except cutting a 60/40 tie rod to length for the drag link pitman arm end and tapping . It makes for a clean stock appearing look and there's no guessing what replacement parts are needed.
View attachment 2814377!

Addressing a different piece in your post to clarify things, The ‘dropped’ jeep pitman are didn’t interfere with the drag links, perhaps a previous post was unclear. My concern was that the end of the pitman arm could be over the leaf springs and could interfere with them. By keeping the pitman arm stock height this problem should be avoided and bump steering minimized.

 

[bikersmurf]

ground down to bare metal and primed with self etching, weld through primer. Still need to sand and prime a bit on the inner side of the frame rail. Ran out of steam.

Couple things I thought I should mention:

1) the drag link is just being test fit, and is currently bottomed out at the other end. Once centred it’ll have about 1/4” of exposed threads on each side.

2) the box will be mounted with grade 8, 1/2” bolts and nylock nuts for final assembly. I don’t recommend grade 5 for mounting a steering box.

If you’re following along you must be ok with watching paint dry. As the thread title suggests, this is a slow build as I try to fit it into my busy family life.

 

[bikersmurf]

Modified steering column with Flaming River U-joint installed.

U-joint with splines to match P/S input shaft.

I’ll need to cut the DD slip shaft to match the space. It appears the shaft will be close to straight to the box and column. I’ll have a better idea once it’s installed.

 

[bikersmurf]

Full turning range L & R, and full range on steering box. Still manual, but the wheels now steer.

Nothing interferes and clearances look good.

 

[bikersmurf]

I’m posting this link for future reference. Without the pump attached there’s roughly an inch of play (turn) in the steering wheel. An inch is spec for this box, but since it’s an older box, I figure it’ll be worth checking the worm gear preload and pitman shaft preload once it’s all assembled and lubricated. I currently don’t want to mess with it when it only has a limited amount of P/S fluid in it after sitting on a shelf for close to a decade.

https://www.midweststeering.com/wp-content/uploads/Sag-525-Serv.pdf

I’ve frequently seen recommendations to take up slop by adjusting the pitman shaft preload… however, that doesn’t appear to be the best course of action. First adjustment should be the worm gear preload.