Inner AND outer anti-squeal shims?

[2001LC]

Wait... you don't use all 4 shims for each side? Isn't that what the FSM is showing?

I bought two kits and used all 4 shims on one caliper. The grooved one on the inside and the smooth one on the outside, but now that i think about it, they didn't quite fit right

You guys think I need to pull it all apart tomorrow?

Only one kit needed per rears. FSM shows the two parts of each shim. The kit have second part (black inner pad) attached.

IDK if it will make much difference doubled up like you did, short term. If horse show side on piston side, you may get some delay or extra pedal travel. Long term if they get dirt in between, may rattle or squeal. Possible cause some wear issues!

 

[FrankieJoe14]

Thanks for the reply @2001LC

Balls. Looks like I'm taking it all apart again. I knew it didn't feel right.

 

[FrankieJoe14]

OK so, incase anyone makes the same mistake I did.

You should NOT run 4 shims per caliper. I only took it for a test run down the block and the pads were already wearing unevenly.

It's fixed now. The shim with the full padding goes on the piston side, and the one with the cutout goes on the other side. Little clip for low pad indicator goes on the inside pad.

 

[tjb]

It's fixed now. The shim with the full padding goes on the piston side, and the one with the cutout goes on the other side. Little clip for low pad indicator goes on the inside pad.

This is the way @2001LC thinks an ‘07 came from the factory:

Here a shot of 07LC w/64K and no record of rear brake work being done. You can see the anti shim plate on outside is the full (uncut). It has undercut shim with horseshoe back on back/inner against piston. It also has wear indicator on inner top. You can also see correct orientation of clips (Rear disc brake support plate)

Contra that, the FSM implies that the wear indicator is on the outer bottom, based on the diagrams of these pages:

FSM: Ambiguous on cutout/horseshoe anti–squeal shim; wear indicator on bottom of outside pad.

@2001LC observation of an 07 LC with no records of brake work (so presumably as it came from the factory): Cutout/horseshoe anti–squeal shim on the inside pad; wear indicator on top of inside pad.

So … .

I put the horseshoe cutout shim on the inner pad and the wear indicator on the bottom of the outer pad.

I put the clips in the way the previous installer did, and I think it matches what @2001LC shows in his 07 LC.

 

[NearJetties]

This thread was super helpful. I found the PO had Toyota pads in but zero shims in the front and looked like no grease was used. Started squeaking about 40k into my ownership…not sure how it went that long.

All new clips, pins and anti-squeal kit in the front fixed 99% of the squeaks. Used the old pads as they were still ~40%.

I’m guessing it’s all missing in the back too but it’ll be a while before I tackle it as I mananged to tear a muscle or tendon in my bicep rotating the tires

Put in some Trail Tailor extended HD sway bar links in too.

 

[uHu]

After re-reading this thread, a comment about the wear indicator on the rear pads: It does make sense to have the wear indicator on the inner pads, not on the outer as indicated on the drawing in the FSM. Reason: The inside pad will always work, even when the slide pins start seizing up. Normally the inside wears faster than the outside, and it's good to be notified before you get steel on steel. I've seen rears where the outside pad is still thick, and the inner is gone. You would normally notice tho', that the disk outside gets a coat of rust when the slide pins start sticking.

 

[fussychicken]

Wanted to give a big thank you to all those that have posted in this thread. It was GREAT for figuring out the clips and backing plates.

I recently went hog wild and changed out the master cylinder, calipers, lines, rotors, and pads all at once with OEM parts. There was really nothing “wrong” with my brakes before, but the master cylinder was at 40sec for the cycle time so I figured I might as well do this all at once.

It felt a little wasteful to toss out the old calipers, but brand new OEMs are so cheap when the dealers do that 25% off sale with free shipping. I had a bad experience rebuilding calipers 20 years ago on my Mr2, so I just treated myself this time.

And yes, just like everyone else, for the rear, my inner pads were way more worn than the outers. Really glad I looked into this because the inners were pretty far gone! And yes, I also put my wear indicator for the rears on the inside pad. Seems to make sense?

Only real helpful advice I have is to get a flare nut wrench if you are going to do the lines! Of course I know many of you will say, "Duh!" but I was being lazy and didn't have one and almost rounded off one of the line fittings. Thankfully I stopped being stupid and went and got one and that did the trick.

Finally, I have to say the results were quite surprising! While the brakes felt pretty good before, they felt even better after I was done! Not sure if it was the pads, lines, master cylinder, or calipers, but in any case the brakes are even more responsive now and stop very high up on the pedal. I hope I’m good for another 250k miles now!


Lets get ready to rumble

Front Pad Order

Fronts all shiny

Getting the rear clips right. I think...

Rears all shiny

 

[Tummler]

@fussychicken OP here. You are welcome.

As a follow-up to my OP, intermittent brake noise eventually returned (accompanied by the surprisingly fast consumption of rear pads). I decided to give it one more try earlier this spring.

This time, I followed each and every word of the FSM. I disassembled and assembled everything exactly as described in the FSM. I replaced every part the FSM indicated should be replaced. I did everything the FSM said to do, in the order it said to do it, and I did nothing else. After that, I replaced the brake fluid using 2001LC's recommended procedure. I have had no brake noise, whatsoever, since I did all of this.

I have no idea what, exactly, fixed the brake noise, or maybe it was just luck. I note that I mostly worked on GM vehicles growing up, and I suppose it is fair to say that this experience caused me to not worry about the details of whatever job I was performing.

 

[PabloCruise]

You should have 4 plates per corner - 2 pad retainers and 2 anti squeal shims.

View attachment 1306369

Be aware too, in my experience, 100 series brakes make noise. Mine does, 3 of my friend's trucks do. All are in great shape, new pads, couple of them with new rotors, still sometimes make a little noise. All OEM parts, so it may be something with that, but they do.

Interestingly, I just did my front brakes and noticed an additional spring that's not called out in the FSM or in the parts guides. It's not the clip that goes through the two pad pins, it's another one that sits over the window in the caliper, kinda looks like a "w". I wasn't sure of the orientation and ended up just looking at the other side to check.

Toyota may have redesigned the shims, my 99 has 4 plates. @beno anything you know about this?

I am just digging in on this.
After years of ownership, I bought some OEM front brake pads, and now - squeak and squeal.
For a '99 the shim pad kit is 04945-60020, yes?

 

[2001LC]

I am just digging in on this.
After years of ownership, I bought some OEM front brake pads, and now - squeak and squeal.
For a '99 the shim pad kit is 04945-60020, yes?

Yes, provide factory install calipers in place. The 98-02 calipers have smaller pistons. So the outer shims of 98-02, have less spread then the 03-07 shims piston clips. These outer shim, hang onto piston. The seal of the piston, curls during braking. As we release brake pedal, piston is pull back as seal uncurls. This micro return of piston, pulls pads off rotors. This is why we need the proper outer shims, no matter what pads are used. We also need the fitting kit, to lock outer edge of pad to shim. https://partsouq.com/en/search/all?q=0494760100

One trick to increase braking in the 98-02, is install 03-07 front calipers.

Brake pads that do not have chamfered edges, tend to squeal in last few feet of braking. DBA pads are a good example. They do not chamfer, to maximum pad surface.

 

[Lavender Jones]

Getting ready to do the rear pads and rotors and am trying to figure out the anti squeal shim kit piece... I ordered the rear shim kit (04946-60031) which came with 4 total plates - can anyone confirm if just 1 kit covers both sides, or do you need a kit per side? The FSM makes it seem as if there are 2 plates per pad, or 4 total plates per side, and that the kit just covers 1 side... But after reading this thread it seems that only 1 plate is needed per pad and therefore 1 anti squeal shim kit covers both sides...

Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.

 

[2001LC]

1 kit. Two plates per pad, black inner pre attached to chrome outer.

 

[Lavender Jones]

I kit. Two plates per pad, black inner pre attached to chrome outer.

Ok perfect. Appreciate the response!

 

[2001LC]

Important: Lightly lube pins and replace boots.

 

[Lavender Jones]

Important: Lightly lube pins and replace boots.

Are you still doing horseshoe shim and wear indicator on inner pad?

 

[2001LC]

Yes, I like wear indicator on inner pad at top.
Why:

• Inner pads almost always wear faster.
• Top tends to stays cleaner, reducing chance pad/wear indicator of sticking.

But , this results in horseshoe shim rubber backing, on inner pad. Which logically, is not where horseshoe shim was designed to be.
This may result. An unpredictable delay in pads forceful contact with rotor. Since shim will flex, as piston presses on area without rubber backing. This flex, may also result in added wear of rubber backing. Which makes likelihood, of needing new shims each pad change, higher.

So it's a trade-off. Reduce chance of metal to metal connect, thus need for new rotor. Or increase likelihood new shim kit needed when pads replaced.

More important, are the pin "boots". Replace them! If they fail, pins may rust in mounting plate. Result in:

• Unusual pad wear.
• Damaged pins and mounting plate.

 

[Lavender Jones]

Yes, I like wear indicator on inner pad at top.
Why:

• Inner pads almost always wear faster.
• Top tends to stays cleaner, reducing chance pad/wear indicator of sticking.

But , this results in horseshoe shim rubber backing, on inner pad. Which logically, is not where horseshoe shim was designed to be.
This may result. An unpredictable delay in pads forceful contact with rotor. Since shim will flex, as piston presses on area without rubber backing. This flex, may also result in added wear of rubber backing. Which makes likelihood, of needing new shims each pad change, higher.

So it's a trade-off. Reduce chance of metal to metal connect, thus need for new rotor. Or increase likelihood new shim kit needed when pads replaced.

More important, are the pin "boots". Replace them! If they fail, pins may rust in mounting plate. Result in:

• Unusual pad wear.
• Damaged pins and mounting plate.

Ok thanks! I am doing this today and purchased the pin boots to replace those - also got the toyota rubber grease to use on the pins / boots

 

[2001LC]

I find many uses for the Toyota rubber grease. Good stuff!

 

[buddysharp]

Well, on the floor of the garage this afternoon on my '04 100 series. last time I did the rears, I "upgraded" to a power stop set of pads and rotors. I installed the wear indicators as they were on the original and per FSM (seemingly bottom of outside pad). Upon disassembly today, the wear indicator on drivers side broke off and the passenger side was no where to be found. Recently, there was no warning noises from the wear indicators (obviously) and my wife toasted the slotted\drilled rotors on a long trip. Today, bought Toyota rotors, pads, pins, boots and shim kit. Trying to install the wear indicator on the bottom of the outside pad. If I try to slide it OVER the pad and shim, it's super tight on won't seat all the way. If I slide one side of the wear indicator UNDER the shim (between the shim and pad) it fits quite loosely.

Really don't want to muck this job up again and would appreciate effective wear indicators warning me it's time for pads. Going to fiddle now to follow what @2001LC suggested above and put on inner pad at top but still not clear if OVER the shim or between the shim and pad.

Any guidance would be greatly appreciated!

 

[2001LC]

Notice we've two variation of the rear shims. The arrow points to location for wear indicator. It is made, for wear indicate on outer pad. But I like inside top. Why: Inside pads wear faster, on 9 out of 10 100 series.