Delta Vehicle Systems Panhard Lift Bracket, 3" & 5" (1 Viewer)

eimkeith

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And that is..?

it increases the axle shift to the driver's side during compression - so in addition to creating weird handling issues, it actually mis-centers the axle more than the stock Panhard would.

Adjustable Panhards in the rear are an expensive solution to a non-problem (aesthetic static axle centering) and a non-solution to actual suspension issues (roll center height, axle shift)
 
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Ah, I see what I did there - I misread your post at a glance (Keith) and thought you were saying that about lift brackets, hence my confusion. Agreed, issue clearly makes sense with an extended panhard.
 
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Can you please help me understand this panhard solution. Im reading that the adjustable panhard bar isnt a complete solution and that the lift bracket is. My question is that because the adjustable panhard bar is bent... Isnt that the same geometry as a lift bracket. isnt the bend part of the adjustable panhard bar accomplishing the same thing as the lift bracket? Why don't lift kits use a lift brackets instead of a whole adjustable bar? seems like it would lower the cost of their kits, improving sales.

Im reading that just changing the length wont fix the problem, but your not just changing the length, the bar is bent to a different shape.
 

Delta VS

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Can you please help me understand this panhard solution. Im reading that the adjustable panhard bar isnt a complete solution and that the lift bracket is. My question is that because the adjustable panhard bar is bent... Isnt that the same geometry as a lift bracket. isnt the bend part of the adjustable panhard bar accomplishing the same thing as the lift bracket? Why don't lift kits use a lift brackets instead of a whole adjustable bar? seems like it would lower the cost of their kits, improving sales.
Excellent question. The adjustable panhard bar could look like a crazy straw, but the fact of the matter is it connects in the same two places no matter what path it takes to get there (straight or curved). Because of the connection points, it can't solve the problem the way the lift bracket can. review the first post for details on how that works, ask more questions if you have them! Happy to answer.

Why don't other companies include? Don't know. Have been on the case of a lot of companies that sell lifts to include the bracket, only the fine folks at @cruiseroutfit have taken us up on that offer so far.
 
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Simply put, the bend doesn’t affect the straight line between mounting points, just like a boomerang shackle doesn’t change or correct a bad shackle angle on a leaf spring - the bend is just for clearance around other parts. The actual geometry is based on point A vs point B - if the line inside his circle diagram were bent, the point along the circle would still travel in the exact same way
 
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but the fact of the matter is it connects in the same two places no matter what path it takes to get there (straight or curved).

Right! tho achieving this via a bracket or bent bar is essentially the exact same thing isnt it? you could make the bracket part of the bar, still accomplishing the same geometry. I dunno im still confused. Maybe im just an idiot and it will come to me later and ill be embarrassed.
 

Delta VS

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Right! tho achieving this via a bracket or bent bar is essentially the exact same thing isnt it? you could make the bracket part of the bar, still accomplishing the same geometry. I dunno im still confused. Maybe im just an idiot and it will come to me later and ill be embarrassed.
Not an idiot, just don't see it yet, me thinks.

Our bracket actually moves the connection point, which a bar cannot do by itself.
 

Delta VS

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Right! tho achieving this via a bracket or bent bar is essentially the exact same thing isnt it? you could make the bracket part of the bar, still accomplishing the same geometry. I dunno im still confused. Maybe im just an idiot and it will come to me later and ill be embarrassed.
this may help:
The video @eimkeith posted shows exactly what you're asking about at the ~3 minute mark.

This whole video is a good animation of the diagrams in the first post of this thread. Going to edit first post and link video there for future folks. Thanks @eimkeith!
 

eimkeith

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Why don't lift kits use a lift brackets instead of a whole adjustable bar? seems like it would lower the cost of their kits, improving sales.

I get this question a lot also. DVS and I are literally the only two people in the Toyota market that are approaching this correctly; it's almost like the rest of the market is primarily concerned with axle-re-centering aesthetics in lieu of actual suspension manners. (crazy)
 
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The video @eimkeith posted shows exactly what you're asking about at the ~3 minute mark.

This whole video is a good animation of the diagrams in the first post of this thread. Going to edit first post and link video there for future folks. Thanks @eimkeith!


Alright I see it now. I was stuck on the idea of a static axle. that video explains it perfectly. Both still have movement but with your lift bracket you have lest amount of movement. Im sold, ill get a order in soon.

Im dumbfounded that lift kits dont already have this, Tho im pretty disappointed with all the lift kits ive seen thus far anyway. they all seems to be lacking in more ways than one. Either not braided ext lines, bents panhard bars instead of lift brackets, caster correction plates instead of something like the LandTank plates etc.

Over it! ill just piece together my own 4" lift. Got everything figured except which springs to use. thank you Dave from Delta! also thank you for calling me on that accelerator cable today. fantastic service. let me know when you get a dented center console lol
 

eimkeith

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Alright I see it now. I was stuck on the idea of a static axle. that video explains it perfectly. Both still have movement but with your lift bracket you have lest amount of movement. Im sold, ill get a order in soon.

Im dumbfounded that lift kits dont already have this, Tho im pretty disappointed with all the lift kits ive seen thus far anyway. they all seems to be lacking in more ways than one. Either not braided ext lines, bents panhard bars instead of lift brackets, caster correction plates instead of something like the LandTank plates etc.

Over it! ill just piece together my own 4" lift. Got everything figured except which springs to use. thank you Dave from Delta! also thank you for calling me on that accelerator cable today. fantastic service. let me know when you get a dented center console lol

one other thing to note - by raising the axle side of the bar you improve the roll center - great for on-road handling characteristics. (whereas lowering the other end, of course, lowers the roll center, making the truck feel less stable)
 
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I get this question a lot also. DVS and I are literally the only two people in the Toyota market that are approaching this correctly; it's almost like the rest of the market is primarily concerned with axle-re-centering aesthetics in lieu of actual suspension manners. (crazy)

It IS all about the look! What’s wrong with you?????

:)
 

Delta VS

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Alright I see it now. I was stuck on the idea of a static axle. that video explains it perfectly. Both still have movement but with your lift bracket you have lest amount of movement. Im sold, ill get a order in soon.

Im dumbfounded that lift kits dont already have this, Tho im pretty disappointed with all the lift kits ive seen thus far anyway. they all seems to be lacking in more ways than one. Either not braided ext lines, bents panhard bars instead of lift brackets, caster correction plates instead of something like the LandTank plates etc.

Over it! ill just piece together my own 4" lift. Got everything figured except which springs to use. thank you Dave from Delta! also thank you for calling me on that accelerator cable today. fantastic service. let me know when you get a dented center console lol

one of the reasons we put together the "treat yo self" lift kit, and are always adding parts to it. Trying to get to the point where we can offer upgraded swaybars and @LandCruiserPhil disconnects as part of the kit too.
 
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damn; you're right! I forgot about the 'gram!

I’m self conscious because my tires are small in relation to my lift and the wheels are sporting trashique flaky chrome, but I’ll fix it.

@Delta VS Team Delta has some neat products. In regards to suspension mods, the 80’s are a few decades behind everyone else.

It’s due to the recent affordability (or former affordability) and the fact that thIs specific suspension setup is unique to this particular platform.
 

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