Builds Broski's Adventure Rig build thread (2 Viewers)

[Broski]

Is that your son at the week @Broski? Did not get a chance to meet him!

I’m sorry you didn’t get the chance to meet him.
Yes that’s him at the wheel.
So happy that he and his wife are willing to spend some of their vacation time with us.
I’m so proud of him and his accomplishments!!
Now I just have to get him to get a classic Cruiser

PS His wife really enjoyed SAS and driving the Cruiser, making progress towards that goal !

 

[duece71]

I’m sorry you didn’t get the chance to meet him.
Yes that’s him at the lake.
So happy that he and his wife are willing to spend some of their vacation time with us.
I’m so proud of him and his accomplishments!!
Now I just have to get him to get a classic Cruiser

PS His wife really enjoyed SAS and driving the Cruiser, making progress towards that goal !

Want to go to this event sometime. Need the time though. Sweet looking pup, the blue healers are wonderful dogs.

 

[Broski]

Want to go to this event sometime. Need the time though. Sweet looking pup, the blue healers are wonderful dogs.

Definitely worth going to this event ! life's short make the time.
Sassy is the sweetest healer ever, She loves all dogs and people alike ! Shes very special to us !!

 

[Broski]

Back at it, beefing up the transfer case skid
The original stiffener on the bottom upgraded model on the top.

Should be substantially stronger.

 

[Broski]

All welded up, Just need some paint and install

 

[Broski]

Working on this project 10" ram going in replacing the 9" one. Size matters right

First time I had a weld fail, so this will be part of this project. Glad I that I caught in now and did not have it fail on the trail.

It will get a replacement Tie rod at the same time as the one in there is bent.

 

[Broski]

I cut the mount apart and started over ( I like to do things the hard way ) I made it wider at the bottom this time and set up the welds the way I should have the first time, much stronger !
The wider base add strength also.

Pre painted it and will get welded back on tomorrow.

Tie rod took a beating

I have a couple spars in my stash

 

[80t0ylc]

A question from the inexperienced, is it possible that the hydro steering is too much for an OEM or stock tie rod? Was just thinking that the 80’s tie rod is well protected, being behind the axle housing. Maybe a beefed up one would hold up better.

 

[veiloctane]

View attachment 2182623The day I brought her home. Completely stock with Lockers, Mommy and me mall crawler.
Nov. 2015 Scored it for $ 3300.00View attachment 2182618View attachment 2182618

its crazy how much 80s are worth now

 

[Feldrian]

A question from the inexperienced, is it possible that the hydro steering is too much for an OEM or stock tie rod? Was just thinking that the 80’s tie rod is well protected, being behind the axle housing. Maybe a beefed up one would hold up better.

That's definitely a rabbit hole. You could also say ram assist is too much torque on a stock knuckle casting, stock knuckle studs, stock trunnions and the tie rod ends themselves. Not sure a beefed rod would make the biggest difference without upgrading a lot of other parts as well.

That said, Broski had tested his set up pretty well and it seems to hold up. A bent tie rod isn't going to stop you from driving out. Several of those other parts mentioned would.

 

[80t0ylc]

That's definitely a rabbit hole. You could also say ram assist is too much torque on a stock knuckle casting, stock knuckle studs, stock trunnions and the tie rod ends themselves. Not sure a beefed rod would make the biggest difference without upgrading a lot of other parts as well.

That said, Broski had tested his set up pretty well and it seems to hold up. A bent tie rod isn't going to stop you from driving out. Several of those other parts mentioned would.

So true!
When the "ram assist", I'll use your terminology, is installed, do you just take it for granted that the rest of the OEM components will hold up to the additional stress they will be exposed to? I mean, isn't the reason for the "assist" is to overcome those moments that traction or tire obsticals make steering effort difficult? I know that forcing the steering wheel with a stock system on a continous basis will break the weak link in the OEM setup, which is why the trend to ram assist is used by serious rock crawlers. Are ya'll just waiting to see what breaks next? How many bent tie rods has @Broski gone through? He made the comment he has spares. Maybe the new weak link IS the tie rod. I'm just invisioning the scenero: rig stopped and driver feels he needs to change his line to the right but the right front tire is up against an obstical. A few tries and it still won't budge. Looking at the ram connection to the tie rod, right turns put more stress on the tie rod than left turns. Just an observation and why I suggested a beefed up tie rod.

 

[Road Apple]

That waterfall of beautiful Broski !! What trail is that on?

 

[Broski]

A question from the inexperienced, is it possible that the hydro steering is too much for an OEM or stock tie rod? Was just thinking that the 80’s tie rod is well protected, being behind the axle housing. Maybe a beefed up one would hold up better.

So true!
When the "ram assist", I'll use your terminology, is installed, do you just take it for granted that the rest of the OEM components will hold up to the additional stress they will be exposed to? I mean, isn't the reason for the "assist" is to overcome those moments that traction or tire obsticals make steering effort difficult? I know that forcing the steering wheel with a stock system on a continous basis will break the weak link in the OEM setup, which is why the trend to ram assist is used by serious rock crawlers. Are ya'll just waiting to see what breaks next? How many bent tie rods has @Broski gone through? He made the comment he has spares. Maybe the new weak link IS the tie rod. I'm just invisioning the scenero: rig stopped and driver feels he needs to change his line to the right but the right front tire is up against an obstical. A few tries and it still won't budge. Looking at the ram connection to the tie rod, right turns put more stress on the tie rod than left turns. Just an observation and why I suggested a beefed up tie rod.

The stock tie rod has held up really well, It's the original to the truck It's been bent for a while now and I did a few hard runs with it that way. IMHO it is up to the task of Ram assist, the ram definitely did not bend it.
I really like the OEM set up with the tie rod in the back, It really does protect the tie rod and ram. In this instance the tie rod is bent up from landing on it not running into it.
Even at that it only bent so much because it makes contact with the bottom of the front differential witch keeps from bending it so much that it's undrivable. It did spring back enough that it was not making contact with anything. The ram mount was damaged at the same time but held even with the broken weld !
I have several spares because I'm a parts hoarder, If I see a deal I just buy stuff up and add it to my stash
I also keep with the OEM tie rod as it does not bind on the front control arms under full articulation like the bigger after market tie rods do.

The Ram assist IMHO actually takes pressure off several key components of the steering system, the steering box and sector shaft, steering box frame mount, passenger side steering arm and knuckle bolts and the drag link.

Not sure why you think the there would be more stress during right turns then left. I would disagreed it's a push pull situation and it shouldn't matter where on the tie rod the ram is attached theirs still equal pressure each way.

I do agree that beefing up certain components just moves the failure point to the next weakest link. In this scenario the rest of the components have proven to be up to the task and a testament to how will built these rigs really are.

It does help that everything was rebuilt with new OEM parts, and that I'm constantly checking and replacing as necessary.

IMHO Ram Assist or Hydro is a worthwhile upgrade for anyone with lockers that use's them for off roading. As soon as both locker are engaged it very difficult to turn and if your in rough terrain ( rocks ) can be nearly impossible.
Theirs no way my rig would be nearly as capable with out it !!

 

[Broski]

That waterfall of beautiful Broski !! What trail is that on?

It's near the bottom of Black Bear pass, We had lunch there !!

You should have been there, We missed you Bro !!

 

[Squeegee]

The stock tie rod has held up really well, It's the original to the truck It's been bent for a while now and I did a few hard runs with it that way. IMHO it is up to the task of Ram assist, the ram definitely did not bend it.
I really like the OEM set up with the tie rod in the back, It really does protect the tie rod and ram. In this instance the tie rod is bent up from landing on it not running into it.
Even at that it only bent so much because it makes contact with the bottom of the front differential witch keeps from bending it so much that it's undrivable. It did spring back enough that it was not making contact with anything. The ram mount was damaged at the same time but held even with the broken weld !
I have several spares because I'm a parts hoarder, If I see a deal I just buy stuff up and add it to my stash
I also keep with the OEM tie rod as it does not bind on the front control arms under full articulation like the bigger after market tie rods do.

The Ram assist IMHO actually takes pressure off several key components of the steering system, the steering box and sector shaft, steering box frame mount, passenger side steering arm and knuckle bolts and the drag link.

Not sure why you think the there would be more stress during right turns then left. I would disagreed it's a push pull situation and it shouldn't matter where on the tie rod the ram is attached theirs still equal pressure each way.

I do agree that beefing up certain components just moves the failure point to the next weakest link. In this scenario the rest of the components have proven to be up to the task and a testament to how will built these rigs really are.

It does help that everything was rebuilt with new OEM parts, and that I'm constantly checking and replacing as necessary.

IMHO Ram Assist or Hydro is a worthwhile upgrade for anyone with lockers that use's them for off roading. As soon as both locker are engaged it very difficult to turn and if your in rough terrain ( rocks ) can be nearly impossible.
Theirs no way my rig would be nearly as capable with out it !!

This is the thing I’m most excited for it’s hard to pick a line when you literally can’t steer

 

[Feldrian]

So true!
When the "ram assist", I'll use your terminology, is installed, do you just take it for granted that the rest of the OEM components will hold up to the additional stress they will be exposed to? I mean, isn't the reason for the "assist" is to overcome those moments that traction or tire obsticals make steering effort difficult? I know that forcing the steering wheel with a stock system on a continous basis will break the weak link in the OEM setup, which is why the trend to ram assist is used by serious rock crawlers. Are ya'll just waiting to see what breaks next? How many bent tie rods has @Broski gone through? He made the comment he has spares. Maybe the new weak link IS the tie rod. I'm just invisioning the scenero: rig stopped and driver feels he needs to change his line to the right but the right front tire is up against an obstical. A few tries and it still won't budge. Looking at the ram connection to the tie rod, right turns put more stress on the tie rod than left turns. Just an observation and why I suggested a beefed up tie rod.

+1 to all that @Broski added.

With ram assist you can still "feel" your steering, so it would be more likely operator error than design that broke components when a driver tried to steer when wedged hard in the rocks.

Ram assist decreases forces on:

1. Steering box
2. Sector shaft
3. Pitman arm
4. Frame behind steering box
5. Panhard bushings and frame mount
6. Cross frame brace to panhard frame mount
7. Drag link and rod ends
8. Steering stabilizer (can actually be removed)
9. Passenger side steering arm and knuckle studs

Forces are (potentially) increased on:

1. Tie rod and tie rod ends
2. Knuckle castings
3. Trunnion bearings and pins
4. Spindles
5. Differential housing

We also run pretty small rams on 80s, so there's not enough force to break big components. If you managed to shoehorn a 3" ram back there ... different story (though you wouldn't have the fluid volume to run it, anyway). Guys running full hydro setups and high volume, high pressure pumps in buggies or super modified builds are the ones who tend to break steering components the way you're thinking.

 

[80t0ylc]

+1 to all that @Broski added.

With ram assist you can still "feel" your steering, so it would be more likely operator error than design that broke components when a driver tried to steer when wedged hard in the rocks.

Ram assist decreases forces on:

1. Steering box
2. Sector shaft
3. Pitman arm
4. Frame behind steering box
5. Panhard bushings and frame mount
6. Cross frame brace to panhard frame mount
7. Drag link and rod ends
8. Steering stabilizer (can actually be removed)
9. Passenger side steering arm and knuckle studs

Forces are (potentially) increased on:

1. Tie rod and tie rod ends
2. Knuckle castings
3. Trunnion bearings and pins
4. Spindles
5. Differential housing

We also run pretty small rams on 80s, so there's not enough force to break big components. If you managed to shoehorn a 3" ram back there ... different story (though you wouldn't have the fluid volume to run it, anyway). Guys running full hydro setups and high volume, high pressure pumps in buggies or super modified builds are the ones who tend to break steering components the way you're thinking.

Interesting, and sounds like you’ve researched and studied quite a bit. Also sounds like the 80’s frame and crossmembers need close inspection and possible repair before attempting the runs you guys do. Probably not a bad idea for any 80 considering how susceptible these points on our frames are. Thanks for posting!

 

[80t0ylc]

The stock tie rod has held up really well, It's the original to the truck It's been bent for a while now and I did a few hard runs with it that way. IMHO it is up to the task of Ram assist, the ram definitely did not bend it.
I really like the OEM set up with the tie rod in the back, It really does protect the tie rod and ram. In this instance the tie rod is bent up from landing on it not running into it.
Even at that it only bent so much because it makes contact with the bottom of the front differential witch keeps from bending it so much that it's undrivable. It did spring back enough that it was not making contact with anything. The ram mount was damaged at the same time but held even with the broken weld !
I have several spares because I'm a parts hoarder, If I see a deal I just buy stuff up and add it to my stash
I also keep with the OEM tie rod as it does not bind on the front control arms under full articulation like the bigger after market tie rods do.

The Ram assist IMHO actually takes pressure off several key components of the steering system, the steering box and sector shaft, steering box frame mount, passenger side steering arm and knuckle bolts and the drag link.

Not sure why you think the there would be more stress during right turns then left. I would disagreed it's a push pull situation and it shouldn't matter where on the tie rod the ram is attached theirs still equal pressure each way.

I do agree that beefing up certain components just moves the failure point to the next weakest link. In this scenario the rest of the components have proven to be up to the task and a testament to how will built these rigs really are.

It does help that everything was rebuilt with new OEM parts, and that I'm constantly checking and replacing as necessary.

IMHO Ram Assist or Hydro is a worthwhile upgrade for anyone with lockers that use's them for off roading. As soon as both locker are engaged it very difficult to turn and if your in rough terrain ( rocks ) can be nearly impossible.
Theirs no way my rig would be nearly as capable with out it !!

Good to hear about the stock tie rod, although with that type of driving, I’d be hoarding tie rods too, along with some other parts. The reason I believe there to be more tie rod stress on right obstacles is that the ram joint is not centered on the tie rod. Basic physics would argue there is more flex possible on the passenger side length of the tie rod. And with right turn immovable obstacles , when the steering wheel is forced the only possible give is in the flex of this rod due to the driving link (the ram joint) pushing a much longer section to the TRE. But your experience trumps my theory, as it should.

 

[Broski]

Good to hear about the stock tie rod, although with that type of driving, I’d be hoarding tie rods too, along with some other parts. The reason I believe there to be more tie rod stress on right obstacles is that the ram joint is not centered on the tie rod. Basic physics would argue there is more flex possible on the passenger side length of the tie rod. And with right turn immovable obstacles , when the steering wheel is forced the only possible give is in the flex of this rod due to the driving link (the ram joint) pushing a much longer section to the TRE. But your experience trumps my theory, as it should.

The only thing I have really need to hoard was rear tail lights but I think the new armor has taking care of that !!

In theory your right about the tie rod, But IMHO theirs just no way that the 1.5" ram can produce enough force to buckle the tie rod in the way your thinking and if it could something else would fail first.

The only resin to go to a beefier tie rod is to help it hold up to being smashed into obstacles not to hold up to the forces produced by the steering system.

 

[mudgudgeon]

Good to hear about the stock tie rod, although with that type of driving, I’d be hoarding tie rods too, along with some other parts. The reason I believe there to be more tie rod stress on right obstacles is that the ram joint is not centered on the tie rod. Basic physics would argue there is more flex possible on the passenger side length of the tie rod. And with right turn immovable obstacles , when the steering wheel is forced the only possible give is in the flex of this rod due to the driving link (the ram joint) pushing a much longer section to the TRE. But your experience trumps my theory, as it should.

Turn one direction is gonna push on the tie rod, turn the other way will pull on it.

If you do a hard right handed obstacle, you just have to follow up with a left handed one to balance it all out