Another Dual Battery and Power Distribution System

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SkyHunter

SkyHunter

10 Year 15 Year
Joined
May 12, 2009
Threads
6
Messages
90
Location
San Diego, CA
I have been researching dual battery systems and power distribution systems on IH8MUD for awhile and I am now ready to install my own. Thanks to everyone who has posted their projects for the rest of us to learn from. This first post is my plan and I will follow up with pictures as I go. Hopefully this project will begin in a couple of weeks so if anyone has suggestions or lessons learned then I’m all ears.

After finding this Blue Sea Systems power distribution design centered around their SafetyHub device,

http://www.bluesea.com/systems/43/Battery_Management_Circuit_Protection_and_Switching_SubSystem,

I used many ideas from this forum and consulted with a couple of electrical engineer friends of mine to come up with the following concept for my vehicle:

IBS Dual Battery RevF.webp


Here are the planned components:

  • IBS Dual Battery System with Relay Booster Module. While the kit does not come with fuses for the Battery Monitor wires, I decided to follow my electrical engineer friends’ advice and will add them. The IBS installation instructions mention using 6A fuses as an option. I traded emails with Beat (pronounced Bay-at) at IBS and he said there would be no problem including 5A fuses on those lines. He said they used to provide fuses but no longer do. George, at Extreme Outback, told me that if there was a short in those lines without a fuse they would likely melt quickly and not create a hazard because they are so thin. In the unlikely event of a short, I’d rather blow a fuse than melt the wires so I will install the following in-line fuse holders from Blue Sea Systems, http://www.bluesea.com/products/5065/Waterproof_In-Line_ATO_ATC_Fuse_holder.
  • Blue Sea AMI/MIDI Safety Fuse Block at the Main Battery positive terminal with a 200A fuse, http://www.bluesea.com/products/7720/AMI___MIDI_Safety_Fuse_Block.
  • Blue Sea SafetyHub 100 Fuse Block in the engine bay next to the Auxiliary Battery, http://www.bluesea.com/products/7725/SafetyHub_100_Fuse_Block. The two batteries will be connected through this device using a 200A fuse. It will also feed the two fuse blocks in the vehicle using a 125A fuse on each wire. The wires to the fuse blocks will be 2 AWG. The four low power outputs can then power engine bay accessories. I have no requirement for a large air compressor to run air tools, so one of the low power outputs should be sufficient for an onboard air compressor used to inflate tires.
  • Blue Sea m-Series Mini Dual Circuit Battery Switch, http://www.bluesea.com/products/6010/m-Series_Mini_Dual_Circuit_Battery_Switch_-_Red. This will provide an ability to disable the two fuse blocks if desired.
  • Two Blue Sea ST Blade Fuse Blocks – 6 Circuits with Negative Bus and Cover, http://www.bluesea.com/products/5025/ST_Blade_Fuse_Block_-_6_Circuits_with_Negative_Bus_and_Cover. One will be installed in the front cabin and one will be installed in the rear compartment. The Blue Sea wiring diagram for this device shows a 125A fuse on the input, that is why I will put the 125A fuses in the SafetyHub 100 leading to these fuse blocks. Originally I had planned to run low power lines from the SafetyHub 100 in the engine bay to the forward cabin to power radios, but SanDiegoCruiser recommended putting a fuse block in the cabin to make it easier to add more toys in the future. That made a lot of sense so that’s what I’m doing, thanks Craig. I don’t have all the accessories shown in the diagram yet, but it’s only time and money to add stuff… My priority list of accessories is:
    • ARB Fridge
    • CB Radio (I know it’s old school, but my non-MUD friends still use CBs and I have one sitting in my garage ready to go)
    • Onboard air compressor
    • Power outlets (12V and USB)
    • Rear hatch lights
    • A ham radio when I join the club
This will be my first DIY electrical job so if you are learning by doing like me, I found these articles to be helpful:

http://www.bluesea.com/support/arti...oosing_the_Correct_Wire_Size_for_a_DC_Circuit

http://www.bluesea.com/support/arti..._Fuse_Holder_For_Your_DC_Product_Installation

I think that’s about it for now. Hopefully folks will find this posting useful. P.S. in case you are wondering how I did the drawing, I used Microsoft Visio.
 
Awesome project. Anxious to see how it'll turn out!
 
That's ambitious! It looks like a bells, whistles, belt, suspenders and diapers kind of system. With all those fuse blocks it's going to be expensive. There are much easier ways to do this, but I applaud you for going whole hog here. It's a very well protected, very flexible install. It's more than you need, but overkill is what we're all about!

The ham radio should go directly to the battery, with fuses right at the battery ideally on both leads. In your circuit diagram, there are too many opportunities to pick up noise form all the components. With an install this nice, CB? Tell your friends to get out of the '70s.

I would fuse the power lead on #2 battery (the one that goes to the hub).

I assume the "RBM" is to limit the usual voltage drop with an isolator relay?

The Blue Sea stuff is nice quality. Post up pics of the completed install.
 
My sympathies to your alternator ;) Let us know how this install works out. Pay attention to wire sizing and use waterproof connections on everything in the engine bay.
 
It's a good diagram and from another visio geek let me say thanks. There is another company in your area that publishes a great software called Smart Draw which I use for presentations(Just my .02 cents)

Can I ask about what type of radios you're connecting? Obviously one is the center console, what is the other?
 
I can't even count the number of times that my Breaker has been used.... Whether tinkering with adding a connection, or jumping another rig, the breaker helps to completely isolate the dual batt. Highly recommend.

Awesome diagram. Wish I had this when doing mine!
 
Cruiserdrew said:
That's ambitious! It looks like a bells, whistles, belt, suspenders and diapers kind of system. With all those fuse blocks it's going to be expensive. There are much easier ways to do this, but I applaud you for going whole hog here. It's a very well protected, very flexible install. It's more than you need, but overkill is what we're all about!

The ham radio should go directly to the battery, with fuses right at the battery ideally on both leads. In your circuit diagram, there are too many opportunities to pick up noise form all the components. With an install this nice, CB? Tell your friends to get out of the '70s.

I would fuse the power lead on #2 battery (the one that goes to the hub).

I assume the "RBM" is to limit the usual voltage drop with an isolator relay?

The Blue Sea stuff is nice quality. Post up pics of the completed install.
Click to expand...

"Over engineer" is a phrase I often hear from my wife, hahaha. I decided I only want to wire things up once hence the reason to plan for growth.

I am pretty sure RFI from the components is not the primary source of noise in the vehicle. One of my electrical engineer friends who I had peer review my concept is a ham radio user and he wrote this very interesting article on how to reduce RFI to your radio. He is a very accomplished engineer and has successfully reduced RFI on other things besides his own vehicle...

http://www.n5dux.com/ham/files/pdf/Automotive RFI Elimination.pdf

The SafetyHub will be right next to the auxiliary battery and it will have a 200 A fuse going to the main battery. I don't see a reason to install another fuse on that line.

My Land Cruiser will be the only yacht I will ever own despite living in San Diego so the Blue Sea stuff will fit nicely...
 
perrobravo said:
No fuse or switch on the winch?
Click to expand...

I've never seen any installation with a fuse or switch on the winch. I'd need to think about why...
 
El Cid said:
It's a good diagram and from another visio geek let me say thanks. There is another company in your area that publishes a great software called Smart Draw which I use for presentations(Just my .02 cents)

Can I ask about what type of radios you're connecting? Obviously one is the center console, what is the other?
Click to expand...

Thanks for the tip about Smart Draw. Getting a ham license is a future goal of mine. The only radio I have is the Cobra 75 WX ST CB radio. I don't know enough about Ham Radios to know what I might get but I will certainly be studying this forum at that time :)
 
RobRed said:
As drew mentions... fuse or better yet 150A Breaker so you can service the systems on the output side of the battery#2.
Click to expand...

DJWUZJ said:
I can't even count the number of times that my Breaker has been used.... Whether tinkering with adding a connection, or jumping another rig, the breaker helps to completely isolate the dual batt. Highly recommend.

Awesome diagram. Wish I had this when doing mine!
Click to expand...


As I mentioned to Cruiserdrew, the SafetyHub has a 200 A fuse in it going to the main battery. The SafetyHub also has the fuses to the two fuse blocks in the vehicle. I have read many of your postings RobRed and you do great work. I installed the dual circuit switch on the power lines going into the vehicle to allow all that stuff to be isolated. It's not as foolproof as a breaker I know...
 
Sky Hunter... the relay I suggest is on the output side of batt 2 leading to the aux systems (safety hub 100). This is a convenience item (in your case) so at a press of a button kill power to the aux systems for maintenance etc. Obviously you can disco the cable manually but for $15 why not add the convenience.
 
SkyHunter said:
I am pretty sure RFI from the components is not the primary source of noise in the vehicle. One of my electrical engineer friends who I had peer review my concept is a ham radio user and he wrote this very interesting article on how to reduce RFI to your radio. He is a very accomplished engineer and has successfully reduced RFI on other things besides his own vehicle...

.
Click to expand...


Well, decades of practical experience with Ham radio installs, suggest that battery itself is an excellent noise filter and there is no downside to running your radio directly from it. I skimmed that article and the noise bit seemed to apply mostly to HF, but what ever.

The biggest problem I see with your install, is just the shear complexity of the thing. You will eventually have to trouble shoot the system, and it will be easier to sell the truck than fix all that wiring.

If you think about it, what you need is dual batterys, a fridge and a way to hook up your radio. Not rocket science. Like I said, the exercise is cool, the drawing is cool, but if you spend more time with it and apply the KISS principle, you may take a different path. Good luck.
 
RobRed said:
Sky Hunter... the relay I suggest is on the output side of batt 2 leading to the aux systems (safety hub 100). This is a convenience item (in your case) so at a press of a button kill power to the aux systems for maintenance etc. Obviously you can disco the cable manually but for $15 why not add the convenience.
Click to expand...
Rob, Steve has a master manual switch that basically shuts down everything on the 2nd battery circuit. Isn't that similar to what you are suggesting?
 
Very nice setup Sky Hunter. RF noise in ham radios (usually HF radios) very rarely comes from power wires running into the radio these days. It more likely comes from electronic components within the cars electrical system and is picked up by the antenna. As Sky Hunter mentioned in the article he referenced above, there are many ways one can mitigate that noise, including placing ground straps on various parts of the body of the truck etc.
 
SkyHunter said:
Thanks for the tip about Smart Draw. Getting a ham license is a future goal of mine. The only radio I have is the Cobra 75 WX ST CB radio. I don't know enough about Ham Radios to know what I might get but I will certainly be studying this forum at that time :)
Click to expand...

I can offer you no help in the Ham radio department, but there are some excellent and generous posters here(SanDiegoCruiser) who have good working systems going. If I had the spare change lying around, I'd pile right into that.

Your diagram is the gold standard, we would be wise to synchronize these threads. The cable/connection thread was eye opening to say the least.
 
RobRed said:
Sky Hunter... the relay I suggest is on the output side of batt 2 leading to the aux systems (safety hub 100). This is a convenience item (in your case) so at a press of a button kill power to the aux systems for maintenance etc. Obviously you can disco the cable manually but for $15 why not add the convenience.
Click to expand...

SanDiegoCruiser said:
Rob, Steve has a master manual switch that basically shuts down everything on the 2nd battery circuit. Isn't that similar to what you are suggesting?
Click to expand...

I understand what Rob is saying...put a breaker between the auxiliary battery and the SafetyHub so I can take the entire second battery and everything connected to it offline. Craig, my switch only shuts down the accessories connected to the auxiliary battery. Rob is correct in saying it would be a convenience item for me since a breaker would be redundant protection to the fuse in the SafetyHub.
 
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