Alignment & T-bar adjustment with truck loaded or unloaded?

[fireball]

100-series fans,

I would like to get some advise and opinions about the best way to do some final suspension setup. I had my 2.5" heavy lift installed and alignment done at Slee when I bought my truck 6 months ago. At that time the truck was stock. Since then I added a rear bumper with tire swing, drawer system, front bumper, sliders, aux battery and new grp31 main battery and a winch. The front had sagged significantly with the addition of all that weight, so I adjusted the torsion bars for 1/2" of rake and had it aligned before our spring break trip last week.

The alignment was done with the truck otherwise empty. Some stuff in the drawers, but not a lot. We then loaded up the truck for our camping trip and I was pretty suprised how much lower things got in the back.

Dropped almost 2". So I went from being a 1/2" higher in the rear to 1.5" lower under load.

The truck seemed to drive just fine both empty and under load. I'm wondering if I shouldn't have just left the front sagging knowing that under load it would even out. What do you think? Here's a photo of the truck fully loaded, with the kids and wife sitting in the truck and me out of it taking the photo.

Thanks!

 

[fireball]

It also might be worth adding that I believe the wife is on board with the purchase of an ARB63qt after this trip, and that while I do drive the truck around town a little bit, I work from home and it's not a DD. We put 2k miles on it this past week, and the majority of use will be camping trips in PA, and a few trips to VT, NH and hopefully the big trip west for 100 in the Hills late this summer.

 

[DJWUZJ]

Which springs are you running?

My thought is that you want to have the truck aligned for whatever your normal conditions are.

One thing I will say is that if you do some hill climbs with that much sag, it makes things difficult.

I'm still trying to find the perfect spring setup for my arrangement - which looks similar to yours.

 

[fireball]

I have the 2.5" slee heavy kit. Not sure the details on the springs? Includes:
2 x SOF2RH Rear Coil Springs
2 x Old Man Emu 60000 Shocks
2 x Old Man Emu 60002 Shocks
2 x Old Man Emu Torsion Bars
1 x Slee Diff Drop Kit

 

[2000UZJ]

1) remove all loose gear minus hard mounted (drawers, bumpers, etc).
2) fill up the tank half way
3) adjust torsion bars until even ride height with 1" or more of rake.
4) load the truck with typical camping gear, tools, etc. Nothing crazy. But enough to sag.
5) take measurements.
5) take the average ride height, adjust to midway point on hub>fender in mm.
6) spend another 3 days tweaking it.
6) go get a proper alignment and enjoy

This will reduce the ride height variations. Leveling with a fully loaded rig will cause it to sit excessively height in the rear when unloaded.

 

[jgray]

Get some OME 863 3" coils for the rear. You have enough weight now so it shouldn't sit too high unloaded and will support the fully loaded truck better. The 863's may feel stiffer than the Slee springs for daily driving unloaded. I didn't install 863's until after adding a full rear bumper setup and they don't bother me even when I try to take everything out of my truck.

 

[perrobravo]

I have the 2.5" slee heavy kit. Not sure the details on the springs? Includes:
2 x SOF2RH Rear Coil Springs
2 x Old Man Emu 60000 Shocks
2 x Old Man Emu 60002 Shocks
2 x Old Man Emu Torsion Bars
1 x Slee Diff Drop Kit

I had a very similar setup and sag when loaded. I added airbags, but the ride off road was terrible. I put 30mm spacers in which worked well when unloaded (which for me means RTT, fridge, bumper with swing out, sliders, recovery gear, etc.), but the sag came back when loaded up for camping with gear, kids, dog, jerry cans...Essentially the weight was too much for the springs.

Recently, I removed the spacers and replaced the Slee SOF2RH springs with OME 864s and have been pretty happy. The 864s are stiffer for sure and when unloaded the rear sits a bit high. Like you, I don't drive the truck daily so a bit of stink bug doesn't bother me, nor does a more firm ride. Loaded, the truck settles down perfectly (maybe a half inch...haven't measured) and rides very nicely, on and off road.

Note: I considered the 863s as @jgray suggest, but went with the 864s for the higher spring rate. IIRC, the SOF2RH and 863 have the same spring rate, but the 863s are taller. 863s and 864s are the same height, but the 864s have a higher spring rate.

 

[DJWUZJ]

After seeing this, and having my choices narrowed to the 863 or 864, it would be great if Slee could do a version closer to the 864 spring rate.

 

[fireball]

Perro - good info. I will probably give Slee a jingle and see what they say. After I saw how much it sagged in the back I was surprised how well it still drove. We did a few dirt roads and a mile or so of mild trails, so nothing serious while completely loaded down, so cannot attest to the offroad prowess in the "sagging position."

With no load in the back it still rides pretty stiff, so I'm not too sure I want to go with a stiffer spring. I'd sort of lean towards the taller spring with same rate.

FWIW, Loaded for this trip was adding the hi lift to the swing out, ~50# recovery gear bag added to drawers, full cooler, 5 gal water container, #90 siberian husky and a few other things in the cargo area. The Thule box had our tent, stove and sleeping bags, so probably only #50 or so up there. 175# worth of kids in the backseat, and 275# worth of my wife and I in the front. Luckily my wallet is decidedly lighter from all the money I've been spending on the truck, so that saved some weight up front

 

[perrobravo]

I wonder if your firm ride, especially when "unloaded" comes more from the shocks. I recently replaced the same OME shocks with Icons and even with the heavier 864 springs, the ride feels a lot smoother than it has since I moved away from OEM...although I realize this is highly subjective.

Before I got the Icons, I temporarily put in the 864s with the OME sport shocks and it felt a bit, but not obnoxiously firmer than the Slee springs, unloaded. When I put in the Icons with the 864s, the ride smoothed out and felt like a different truck altogether, both unloaded and loaded.

Just a thought...

 

[fireball]

Which icons did you go with? Round number $$$? Thanks!

 

[perrobravo]

Which icons did you go with? Round number $$$? Thanks!

I have the 2.5" remote reservoir Icons. They're not cheap, something like $450 each, IIRC. Best not to look too closely at my credit card statements from last month or two or do anything really crazy like trying to justify the expense.

 

[Landbender]

Has anyone running torsion bars in addition to coilovers on the front? I've seen it done by the Russians on their cruisers with a 4" lift at offroadgroup.com (scroll through the top tabs to go to their photo gallery.)
This might be an option for weighted down 100s ... But I'm a noob and would like a second opinion.

 

[jgray]

I believe the OME coil lift / load recommendations close to this:

Medium load 2.5" OME 860 - stock up to 250 lbs load in rear
Heavy load 3.0" OME 863 - 250 - 400 lbs constant load in rear
Heavy load 3.0" OME 864 - 400+ lb constant load in rear

 

[cboyd]

I believe the OME coil lift / load recommendations close to this:

Medium load 2.5" OME 860 - stock up to 250 lbs load in rear
Heavy load 3.0" OME 863 - 250 - 400 lbs constant load in rear
Heavy load 3.0" OME 864 - 400+ lb constant load in rear

Christo told me that if have to go to 864s if I wanted something stouter than the Slee Heavies. I didn't want the extra inch stinkbugging the back. That's when we started talking about the Timbrens.

Here is my truck full loaded (lives like this all the time) with the Slee Heavies and the Timbrens

 

[cboyd]

Hard to tell with the shadows, but it sits level to slight rake to the front.