71FJ40 Chevota

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71FJnick said:
Mace, thanks man, I totally didn't think about full lock interfering with the leaf. I'll do a mock up before going farther.
Thanks for the tip on the tre, I'll check that out.

On the axle, I totally agree. I'm saving up for 35s now which will help, and ultimately I'm wanting upgraded large pattern knuckles with disk brakes and histeer. That's just a ways off.

For now I'm trying to get it somewhat drive able so I can decide which direction I want to take it.
My goal is to have to buy things twice, so for this steering issue I'm looking for a reasonable, cheap fix.

That may simply be a new tre with the correct taper and thread.
Click to expand...

For 35's to 37's and reasonable wheeling you cannot beat the SM420/Stock tcase and some upgraded stock axles. Your rear axle can easily be converted to 30 spline with a lulnchbox locker (or whatever locker you wish). So it's already there. Keeping wrap under control will be the biggest thing. Without a way to control axle wrap in the rear (not really necessary in the front) you will kill your rear pinion rapidly.. If you can replace the existing TRE with a new one (they are cheap enough) and get it driveable do that. I suspect that when you go wheeling that you will have issues with binding tho. So you might want to limit that until you can get it done right. Chicago had about every problem possible with his steering (similar setup to yours) and documented it well. it's in the last couple pages of his build in the hardcore section.

I'd keep it sprung over, make small repairs to what you currently have and go from there. You do have a reasonable start. IMHO, get the steering done before tires. It's kinda important ;)

Upgraded front axle shafts are not as important without a locker. And are easily installed later down the road. A front disk brake conversion is somewhere around $250 in parts (ish) and you know the work involved. You will also need to convert the single circuit master cylinder to a boosted system of some sort. Either Hydro boost or standard Vacuum assist. Either setup can be found in junkyards for reasonable pricing. I'd work on the Stock toyota vac boost myself, with the spacer to avoid the firewall rib.

For about the cost of a new set of 35" tires, you can have your front axle in a much stronger and safer place.

Just an idea.
 
the single-most important thing to do is have a plan and work that plan. It's easy to get side-tracked into the "why don't I justs" and the "while I'm at its" when you're building your rig. With that said, it's also okay to start with the tires then work your way in as you break it. Where some people can blow up 2 1/2 ton axles, others (on the same spot) dance through on stock, sammy axles and 33s.

Around here, especially in the stuff we call snow, tire size minimum (for a FJ40) is 33s but 36s are optimal. However, (unless you can get someone to swap you a crap trailer for one ton 4.56 axles) the stock '40 stuff works just fine as long as you're religious about keeping the water out of the birfields. Lockers on both ends aren't that big of a deal because we don't have true Rubiconesque rock trails and the only wheeling we get due to land closures is snow-covered roads.... and those don't create the stress of rocks. Even our mud is pretty safe for stock axles because it's either volcanic till or clay.

Driving style also can make stock stuff last a while lot longer. On a recent outing, I was wheeling with another H3, and a couple Heeps. One Heep was a stock, JK with a dana 30 front the other a rubicon with a 44s. I didn't break, neither did the stock JK.... the other H3 blew his right front half-shaft twice (and he still owes me the one he borrowed from me). The Rubicon did exactly the same thing only he didn't have spares so I have many pictures for our next club meeting of him on a strap.... point is, we all drove the same road, same lines, same trail. Driving ability and a healthy hatred of being towed out can save a lot of parts and at least one ego (yep, I can't wait to post the pictures ;))
 
Thanks Mace and superbuickguy, you guys are right in line with what I'm planning.

I've definitely gone down the "well since I'm in there..." then had a car on blocks for 3 years ... Super sucky.

That being said, wheeling is a long ways off for this truck, and not before I'm confident in the brakes and steering, which is a loooong way off :)

One reason I'm anxious about tires is that these are too big, too warn, and have redneck (it's ok cause I'm a redneck) bead locks (aka screws in the wheel). Totally agree steering and brakes are more important, but I need to eliminate variables in the drivability issue. Tires are about 50% of the road feel.


Anyway, much appreciate the feedback and tips on what's next and how to attack this project.

More tech:
Found a few links for tres to share:

Tie Rods, Drag Links and Accessories, Steering Tie Rod Ends - Free Shipping @ Speedway Motors

Drag Link Ends - Tie Rod Ends For Sale

I also found some good data on Moogs website with respect to tapers.

Now that I know I have 11/16-18 thread on the tre, I'm searching for taper data so I can match pitman arms.
This weekend I'll take measurements and mock up how much drop I can handle on the pitman to save binding.
 
a well-serviced FJ40's steering (when the tires are larger then 31s) would best be described as "vague" or "you recommend steering directions that your '40 may or may not decide to follow." You won't be knifing a slalom course even if everything is perfect.

brakes are overrated :) that's why they make trees.
 
Guess I'll need bigger bumpers

I have a 66F100 4x4 that my grandad put tractor power steering on... You know the one that sites in the middle of the steering shaft. That only takes suggestions as well :) also doesn't return to center.

For nostalgia, I keep it going
 
71FJnick said:
One reason I'm anxious about tires is that these are too big, too warn, and have redneck (it's ok cause I'm a redneck) bead locks (aka screws in the wheel). Totally agree steering and brakes are more important, but I need to eliminate variables in the drivability issue. Tires are about 50% of the road feel.
Click to expand...

Just keep in mind that because of the low steer setup you currently have with a springover, your steering will never work properly. And, it's a lot more dangerous than a tires road feel..

Even going to some bent arms (always creeped me out but seem to hold up fine) Like "W" at Up and Over in your neck of the woods used to do. These were stock arms heated up and bent up to make a "hysteer" system.


or a cast/welded double steering arm like this one
Partsforsell008.jpg


71FJnick said:
More tech:
Found a few links for tres to share:

Tie Rods, Drag Links and Accessories, Steering Tie Rod Ends - Free Shipping @ Speedway Motors

Drag Link Ends - Tie Rod Ends For Sale

I also found some good data on Moogs website with respect to tapers.

Now that I know I have 11/16-18 thread on the tre, I'm searching for taper data so I can match pitman arms.
This weekend I'll take measurements and mock up how much drop I can handle on the pitman to save binding.
Click to expand...

See if you can somehow use a 2027 DLE It's got a ton of angularity available. It is a Drag link end instead of a Tie Rod end. They tend to have the proper taper for your pittman arm and tend to have a lot more misalignment available.
ES2027L GM -TIE ROD DRAG LINK

Parts Mike has a ton of information available.
 
I bet you can sell whatever tires and wheels those are on craigslist and turn around and come up with useable 35's and steel wheels and not be out much money.

Some great info has been presented here as well, thanks for a helping a long time friend of mine!
 
So after much searching, I believe the pitman arm and TRE are from a J**p. I found that 94 wranglers used the 3094 end to attach to the pitman arm. Also, I've decided to just patch this back together without dumping too much money in it:worms:. I really need to focus on steering when I do the front axle rebuild, and that will just need to move up the list a bit. The ideal setup, as Mace said, is a new pitman, 2027 end to a custom drag link, then to a set of hi steel arms. I've go the PL drafted for the new axle once it gets the big knuckles.

So for today, i bought a TRE and will install it. It seems the pitman arm is warn out and enlarged, I'll use... um...cough..washers :eek: to get the arm to fully seat on the TRE. Then I can do some shopping for a cheap arm to simply eliminate the washers while I work on other things.

at any rate, for those folks down the road using search, I found a few good resources on TREs and drag links:
Both of these sites list the min and max diameter for the TRE and the length of taper. It was useful to me while I searched for options.

http://truckpartsetc.com/sales/pdfs/dayton/dayton_lightdutysterring_217.pdf
Moog Suspension Parts - Universal Outer Tie Rod Ends
 
it's surprising and kind of cool that most of the FJ40 underpinnings are dimensionally the same as GM and/or Land Rover.... which makes a huge amount of sense because GM really did some nice things for Toyota to get them in operation and Land Rover which (perhaps unknowingly) became the pattern for much of the running gear.

and in that vein, when I do update the axles in my Discovery 2, I'm using FJ40 axles... same offset, same width, MUCH stronger and far better part availability...
 
Right, it's all the same.... and slightly different. haha that just makes it all the fun.
I'm a little twisted, but I like doing this research and learning how it all interacts. In fact after my last post I did some more research and found the Waggy pitman arm that's discussed a lot. It's apparently the same as CJ/YJ/XY/TJ stuff, but basically flat. It's more likely that my pitman is a stock wagoneer arm or flat CJ arm than a 94. I just ordered a TRE for a CJ (moog # ES62L) to see if it fits better. it has a smaller min dia on the taper so I'm hoping it nests better... I'll be returning one of the arms.
Oh and I also ordered a new timing light, this one has replaceable leads (I melted the last one on my header :doh:

Here's a pic from pirate I found helpful...

Capture.webp
 
A large number vehicles used the Saginaw steering box. It's amazing how interchangeable they are
 
GM is pretty good at maintaining interchangeability. I'm a GM fan and when I swapped a 6.2 for a SBC I was stunned to see that even the exhaust dumps matched the stock exhaust....
 
It's funny that we were talking about propane, and my comment was it's not worth it because it's an expensive conversion.... but here's an entire, running truck with the propane conversion for $550.... put a carb on it and you'd get your money back...
1980 C10 Service Truck
 
Drool. Those are sweet.
I need to fill the cruiser bank first then start buying.

The new Wife and I just set the budget...

I'll probably take Mace's advice and put off tires for a bit, which will help.
 
Mace said:
A large number vehicles used the Saginaw steering box. It's amazing how interchangeable they are
Click to expand...
I actually live in Saginaw, where the Saginaw Steering Division(Delphi,Nexteer,TRW) was formed. Also home of the Saginaw Transmission Plant. Also we poured between 30-50%(depending on day/week/ etc) of the GEN 2/3/4 V-8's GM put out everyday.
 
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