1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Rattle

Discussion in '80-Series Tech' started by TomH, May 14, 2003.

  1. TomH

    TomH SILVER Star

    Messages:
    898
    Likes Received:
    80
    Joined:
    May 14, 2003
    Location:
    Seattle
    I've been reading this forum for about 3 months now (since I bought my '97 LC) and have noticed there are some pretty intelligent people here. So I was hoping you may be able to help me out before I go crazy from the rattle in my dash.

    It sounds to me like the passenger side airbag is loose and just needs a little tightening. Of course gaining access to it seems impossible. I just picked up the service manual and it says to remove the dash (the whole dash - steering wheel, steering column, gage cluster, radio, heater controls, console, and a whole list of other things) to get to the airbag. That seems like a little more work than I want to do.

    What I am wondering is whether it is possible to pop the cover (or air door as it is referred to in the manual) and then be able to gain enough access to get to the bolts. The picture in the manual shows what looks like a clip on the left side of the door that I might be able to release with a screwdriver.

    Anyone ever deal with this or have any ideas?

    Thanks for the help.

    Tom
     
  2. Beowulf

    Beowulf

    Messages:
    12,534
    Likes Received:
    30
    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2003
    Location:
    Somewhere in the foothills...
    Tom,
    Hello and welcome to non-lurking status!

    I'll go out on a limb here because I can't answer your question about tightening the bolts securing the air bag. As I recall these are big bolts, tightly torqued, and it seems unlikely they could get loose on their own enough to cause a rattle as you describe.

    There are a lot of things in that general area of the dash. Have you checked everything carefully? My glove box door was loose and a screw had come out. It rattled a little. The amp, a speaker, several ECU's, and the antenna cable are in that area.

    If you decide to tackle the air bag bolts then carefully follow the precautions in the FSM. You don't want that thing firing off while you are working on it!

    Good luck and keep us posted on what you find.
    -B-
     
  3. semlin

    semlin rocker

    Messages:
    5,209
    Media:
    1
    Likes Received:
    324
    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2003
    Location:
    north of 49
    Tom why don't you start by removing the glove box and having a good old feel around. There are other things than the airbag in there and you might be able to squeeze a wrench or stubby screwdriver in to tighten what is loose.
     
  4. cruiserman

    cruiserman

    Messages:
    1,861
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2003
    Ditto on the glove box. Check the speaker in there, too. Mine was loose a while ago, and it drove me nuts.
     
  5. cruiserdan

    cruiserdan SupportingVendor Emeritus Supporting Vendor Moderator

    Messages:
    20,605
    Likes Received:
    2,983
    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2003
    Location:
    Surrounded by Cruisers from all over the world
    Hello Tom.

    Head the Wulf's advice regarding SRS repairs. The service manual procedure should be followed exactly. And yes, the dash will have to come out to remove the passenger air bag.
    Simon's thought about removing the glove box and snooping around some is a very good idea. I have found dash rattles in the past caused by foreign objects that have fallen into the defroster vents as well.

    Good luck in your search, unfortunately there is no silver bullet for rattles..........Dan :beer:
     
  6. TomH

    TomH SILVER Star

    Messages:
    898
    Likes Received:
    80
    Joined:
    May 14, 2003
    Location:
    Seattle
    Thanks to everyone for the input so far. I have had the glove box out, removed the speaker, took out the heater controls, radio and everthing on that assembly and have had no luck. When I removed the radio, it seemed to help, like maybe the weight of the radio was adding to the problem. It really seems like the noise is coming from right about the top of the dash where the airbag is located. It actually sounds a lot like a bar or something bouncing up and down against some other piece of metal.

    As for a face full of airbag, that is what I'm trying to avoid and really won't even mess with that until I'm sure I can disable the system. The manual says to unplug the airbag connector before doing anything. I assume this will disable the system?
     
  7. Hltoppr

    Hltoppr SILVER Star

    Messages:
    2,022
    Media:
    4
    Likes Received:
    4
    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2002
    Location:
    Port of Indecision...otherwise Northern Arizona
    Working around airbags is something best left to those who are trained to do so, as one going off next to your head can kill you, or, at the very least, make you very special. :stupid:

    Check the dash pieces, as well as the ash tray for other sources of the rattle.

    -H-
     
  8. PHAEDRUS

    PHAEDRUS

    Messages:
    2,036
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2003
    Tom,
    disconnecting the air bag is pretty tricky.
    1. disconnect the battery ofthe veh.
    2. then disconnect the harness.
    3. then disconnect the bag end plug
    the reason behind all of this silliness tis to avoid pissing off the srs control unit. if you tickle it wrong it will throw a code at you and an air bag light is more annoying than a rattle.

    as to culprits I am just going to throw this out I dont recall if the dash brace is bolted to the inside of the a pillar or welded but I would check there as well. oh sorry forgot I wasnt talking to a body tech, the cross brace passes through the middle of the dash and mounts behind the door hinges on the inside of the veh. take a good look at those. ofter that I would check your ac lines and teh squirell cage mounted on the front of the fire wall.
    Dave :beer:
     
  9. TomH

    TomH SILVER Star

    Messages:
    898
    Likes Received:
    80
    Joined:
    May 14, 2003
    Location:
    Seattle
    Well, looks like the rattle problem is solved. I pulled the glove box last night and was able to simulate driving (e-brake on, in gear, and a tiny bit of throttle) so the rattle would, well, rattle. I tracked it down to the ECM, at least I think that is what that thing is called. I found a loose bolt, tightened it up and all is quiet again. I may be able to retain my sanity...

    Thanks again for all the input.

    Tom
     
  10. landtank

    landtank SILVER Star

    Messages:
    18,425
    Likes Received:
    601
    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2003
    Location:
    Groveland MA
    Look at that, 3 posts and you saved yourself a trip to the dealer. Now take that money saved, multiply it by 10 and I bet we can spend it for you in less than 3 more posts :G.
     
  11. cruiserdan

    cruiserdan SupportingVendor Emeritus Supporting Vendor Moderator

    Messages:
    20,605
    Likes Received:
    2,983
    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2003
    Location:
    Surrounded by Cruisers from all over the world
    Um...Rick,

    Not all trips to the dealer are bad, are they? :tear:

    The Wulf makes regular pilgrimages just to visit. Well, at least he used to til some dirtbag sold the reason for his repeated visits..................... :dunno:
     
  12. Beowulf

    Beowulf

    Messages:
    12,534
    Likes Received:
    30
    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2003
    Location:
    Somewhere in the foothills...
    Tom,

    You've learned some valuable lessons and you're about to learn another. Up to now, you've learned that this forum is a great source of information and can save you some money. You've learned to avoid working on the SRS. You've learned that lots of things can cause dash rattles.

    Now, you're going to learn another:
    >> ... simulate driving (e-brake on, in gear, and a tiny bit of throttle) <<

    Don't do this again. Most 80 series e-brakes will barely hold a truck on a slight incline. Engine running, in gear, and with throttle is begging for a big hole where your garage wall used to be. Put it on jack stands if you must try this or use some giant wheel chocks.

    Glad you found your rattle! :G

    -B-
     
  13. landtank

    landtank SILVER Star

    Messages:
    18,425
    Likes Received:
    601
    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2003
    Location:
    Groveland MA
    Don't be so hard on yourself, a real dirtbag would have charged him admission ;)
     
  14. Beowulf

    Beowulf

    Messages:
    12,534
    Likes Received:
    30
    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2003
    Location:
    Somewhere in the foothills...
    >> Well, at least he used to til some dirtbag sold <<
    >> the reason for his repeated visits <<

    and

    >> ... a real dirtbag would have charged him admission <<

    I used to enjoy coming by to fondle the S/C from time to time but Dan makes it seem like that was my only reason for visiting. Perhaps it was a *big* part but it wasn't the only reason.

    However, I resent the implication that our friendship hinged on an occassional blower peek. A little depression set in when it was discovered that he sold it without giving me a chance to meet or beat the offer from MTS. :tear:

    If you really must know, using my thong for the S/C packing material is what really chapped my butt. :G

    -B-
     
  15. cruiserdan

    cruiserdan SupportingVendor Emeritus Supporting Vendor Moderator

    Messages:
    20,605
    Likes Received:
    2,983
    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2003
    Location:
    Surrounded by Cruisers from all over the world
    -B-

    Based on coverage, I'd say that chapping was inevitable with or without your beloved thong.............. ::)

    FOOTNOTE:
    Oh, he still visits post S/C....... :G Albiet not quite as cheerful as he used to be....... :dunno:
     
  16. CruisinGA

    CruisinGA

    Messages:
    6,163
    Likes Received:
    8
    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2003
    Location:
    Georgia Tech
    Ok its all coming together now....
    I used to wonder how C-Dan was a walking encyclopedia of prices and parts. And then I keep hearing mentions of a dealership. Now I think I am about to make the connection, so stand back.....
    C-DAN WORKS AT/OWNS A DEALERSHIP!!!!!!!!
    so which one is it? and how much is a UZJ100 with rear locker?
    (I really am interested)
     
  17. cruiserdan

    cruiserdan SupportingVendor Emeritus Supporting Vendor Moderator

    Messages:
    20,605
    Likes Received:
    2,983
    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2003
    Location:
    Surrounded by Cruisers from all over the world
    Crusin,

    I do not own an automobile dealership, I must work to feed my dogs. :G

    If you wish to have a 100 with a factory locker you will need to buy it used as they are no longer offered with that feature. :ugh: It was rear axle only, BTW.

    As I'm used to vehicles being sold one piece at a time I don't know how much to expect to pay. I would guess at least 20G's and on up........... :dunno:

    (sharp lad, wouldn't you say?)
     
  18. CruisinGA

    CruisinGA

    Messages:
    6,163
    Likes Received:
    8
    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2003
    Location:
    Georgia Tech
    Haha, yah, I don't go to private school for nothin you know! :p
     
  19. Scamper

    Scamper

    Messages:
    1,460
    Likes Received:
    2
    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2003
    Location:
    Somewhere in NJ
    Hey B, don't be so quick to pine for that S/C...some of us have felt the sting of a S/C installed on a (let's say) mature LC. On the other hand...some of us have caused our own problems and shouldn't blame TRD. :G BTW, I was wondering what that was packed with my S/C. I thought it was a 'special' belt, but couldn't figure out where to put it! Guess I should have figured that leopard-skin belts smelling of coconut are not common...

    Cruisin--be kind to Dan. He's a wealth of info on LCs, and his dogs are going hungry, in part due to guys like me :dunno: who complain about the price of LC parts.
     
  20. TomH

    TomH SILVER Star

    Messages:
    898
    Likes Received:
    80
    Joined:
    May 14, 2003
    Location:
    Seattle
    Beowulf

    You've learned some valuable lessons and you're about to learn another. Up to now, you've learned that this forum is a great source of information and can save you some money.

    I can't agree with you more on this one. You guys are certainly a wealth of information when it comes to Land Cruisers (probably other things too).

    You've learned to avoid working on the SRS.

    Yeah, I kind of knew that already but this group certainly confirmed it and cleared up any aspirations I had about digging into that system.

    You've learned that lots of things can cause dash rattles.

    Yes, and that sound under a dash can travel to odd places. My wife and I were both certain the noise was coming from the top of the dash. Guess we were wrong.

    Now, you're going to learn another:
    >> ... simulate driving (e-brake on, in gear, and a tiny bit of throttle) <<

    Don't do this again. Most 80 series e-brakes will barely hold a truck on a slight incline. Engine running, in gear, and with throttle is begging for a big hole where your garage wall used to be. Put it on jack stands if you must try this or use some giant wheel chocks.


    I guess I have to disagree with you on this one. I do understand your concern, especially since I have noticed how poorly the e-brake holds and have considered adjusting it (and it sounds like that might not be much help). But maybe you don't fully understand the situation. I was sitting in the drivers seat and holding the throttle at about 1000 rpm, barely over idle. Now assuming the e-brake snapped completely, if I simply took my foot off the gas, the truck would not go anywhere in a hurry - not to mention I could just slide my foot off the gas and onto the brake. It's not like I was running the truck at 2000 - 3000 rpm which would be a different situation all together. I understand there was risk in what I was doing but I think the risk was minimal. As for using wheel chocks, that is a very good idea, but they'd really have to be giant ones to keep a LC from going over them. I don't think jack stands would have worked because I don't think I would have got the resistance I needed to cause a vibration that would have triggered the rattle. Probably the best idea would have been to have my wife drive while I rode in the passenger seat and hunted for the rattle. Of course this might be scarier than just using the e-brake.

    Thanks again for the input - I really do appreciate the help. Oh, and if I ever do go through the garage wall, I'll be sure to let you know so you can have a good laugh at my expense.

    Tom