gain a few horses in my 83 fj60 (1 Viewer)

[dmase]

I am buying a boat and would like to give the old inline 6 a little boost in horsepower to tow the boat and actually get it up some sfreeway hills a little easier. Any suggestions of things I can do. The boat is a ski boat only 19' in length so not too heavy but still a few more horses would be well needed.

thanks guys and girls

dan

 

[Ralphy]

Well depending on how much ya wanna spend there are diffrent things , my neighbours started stock 4 yrs ago , first and most noticeable was the extractors and 2 1/2 in exhaust with a free flowing muffler , afterwards came new rings and 20 tho off the head , wich again made a big diffrence , removing the stock air cleaner assy also improved power and mpg as well . but hey most noticeable overall was the exhaust

 

[swank60]

I've heard good things about doing a Webber carb conversion. If you don't want to replace the whole exhaust system, you could go with a hi flo muffler and there's a hi flo cat converter too. I noticed an increase in power by just putting in a K&N air filter - I don't tow anything.

Basic premise is, if you can make it breath better, you can make it go better.

 

[kling-on]

MSD did wonders for my 60 LOTS of power over 1500rpm

 

[jwest]

[quote author=kling-on link=board=1;threadid=14212;start=msg132527#msg132527 date=1081093972]
MSD did wonders for my 60 LOTS of power over 1500rpm
[/quote]

...been thinking about this. Which MSD?
Are you replacing your plugs, wires, dist., and rotor more than usual?

 

[dmase]

Thanks guys,

I'll try a k&n and maybe the exhaust and see what happens. If not enough, and never enough, I will go witht eh carb swap. One thing, does the card swap fxxx up emissions at all. I live in AZ and they are fairly strict.

thanks
dan

 

[Poser]

The Weber carb will mess with emisions....as will a Holley, or any aftermarket carb...

Go this route...pleanty of power, lots of emision fun...

http://www.paceparts.com/product.asp?0=239&1=241&3=917

Good luck!

-Steve

 

[Cruiserdrew]

Dmase-you are in need of some hard truth here, before you spend a lot of money and jack up a perfectly good cruiser. If you want your 60 to tow a boat, any boat, but especially a heavy fiberglass outboard skiboat, you need a Chevy 350 conversion. Otherwise, you will not be happy. The 2F engine with bolt on mods like carbs and exhaust might gain 5-10 HP and little or no torque. You need a bigger, more powerful engine, or better yet, a new tow rig. If emissions are an issue, and they are many places now, you will never pass again with a Weber. They run rich, generally and do not work as well as a stock carb that has been cleaned out, and rebuilt. I had a Weber on my FJ40 that I GAVE away. That's how bad they are. K and N airfilters will not benifit a slow turning motor like a 2F. Save your $. Headers suck too, in my opinion. They are very hard to seal well against the block and have other issues with engine compartment heat, noise, and rusting out. Maybe you gain a bit of power but I can't feel it. The stock manifold is way better. So I don't want to rain on your parade, but the 60 is not a good tow rig. Before you mess it up in a way that some future owner will hate you for, see if you can't use it AS IS to get to the lake, or buy another rig that suits your needs better. You can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear, and you can't make a high speed tow rig with a 2F motor no matter what you bolt to it. What ever you do though, have fun water skiing. Sorry, I re-read this and it sounds a bit harsh, but I'm trying to save you some $ and a whole lot of frustration.

 

[Poser]

Andrew nailed it.

If the 60 is not going to satisfy the pulling needs, or wants, however it shakes out, you need to think about a real pull rig...

Good luck!

-Steve

 

[Rice]

Most important advice has already been mentioned. Beefing that engine up can happen but would have to be from the inside out (heads, cam, valves, intake, headers, carb) .... by that time you have more power but actually end up with less low end torque.

One additional mention: Do not use a K&N filter. They allow a high amount of dirt past and are only a shake better than no filter at all. Worn cylinder walls and rings will soon follow.

 

[dmase]

Thanks guys,

I agree, I love the 2f on the trail and around town it is great. I really don't want to drop a v8 in especially since I had it rebuilt about 1 year ago, fun option but not now. Thanks andrew, harsh but truthful. I can take the money I would of spent trying to get 10-15 hp and go buy an old ford or chevy pick-up with a v8 already in it and put the boat behind it. s*** in arizona those trucks are a dime a dozen. I love the crusher and it will stay the way it is, the engine that is.

appreciate it
dan

 

[Webster]

One option that worked well for me was to convert to GM TBI fuel injection. Noticable jump in power and easily reversible if you hold onto your old parts. I don't yet know about emissions as I haven't had mine tested. The information I have read is that it runs cleaner on fuel injection. Lots of good info in the tech articles on this conversion.

 

[Dunbar]

Here is an interesting link to a scientific analysis of K&N air filters. http://tinyurl.com/26ez9

I agree that you will not be able to gain significant horsepower increases with exaust and air filter mods. Not the kind you are looking for for towing your boat. I however commonly tow a 1600lb (empty weight) trailer with up to 1000lb of cargo with my FJ62. The 62 without a trailer will slow to 50mph on long steep grades and with a trailer it has trouble with hills. Conservation of momentum comes to mind, like I used to pracitce in my air cooled vert beetle before hot rodding the heck out of the motor.

With the auto tranny in the FJ62 on flat runs I could easily tow up to 2600lb at 70mph. The problem is with the A440F automatic trans and the cusp between overdrive and 4th gear. It's similar to running 33" tires without a trailer, you wind up back & forth between overdrive and 4th on any hill or against the wind. The A440F robs lots of power from the 3FE engine. I converted my truck to an H55F 5speed manual gearbox which allows me a lot more control of how I apply the power. The overall final drive ratio is shorter than the A440F but perhaps taller than the 4 speed in the FJ60 despite the rack & pinon difference.

As for better breathing you could have some porting and polishing work done on the head but that alone will not get you a significant increase in power. When I rebuilt my 3FE I went 40 over on the pistons, installed perfect circle rings, and had Jim Chenoweth work over the cylinder head. He installed Chevy SS valves and did some porting and polishing. I had the rotating assembly balanced as well. All that work resulted in a noticable increase in power. Nothing significant but noticable. I equate it to the increase I got when I had preveously installed the Flowmaster muffler and a K&N air filter.

I did get a significant power increase with the overbored throttle body that I just installed. At least 4 times the difference I noticed from all the other mods combined. RC Engineering overbored it by 3mm and installed a new butterfly valve. I have not had a chance to find a grade to pull, it's flat as hell around Houston, but that will be the true test for towing ability. I have realized a significant increase throughout the power band. In 2nd gear it will put me back in the seat when I mash on the foot feed.

Of course an overbored throttle body will not do you any good on your 2f unless you also fuel inject it. That being said, there are ways to get more power out of these engines without killing them or loosing torque. If the FJ60 were mine I would have Jim C. rebuild the carb and drive it. Go ahead and pull your boat and see if you can live with going slow. If other drivers are throwing rocks at you look into a different tow vehicle or drop in a SBC. Going slow sounds a lot cheaper though.

I am no automotive engineer but would love to see what a 2F would do with 3 WEBER DCNF side draft 2 bbl carbs and a 2.5 inch exhaust would do. My beetle displaces only 1904 cc but runs like a banshee on crank with twin 44mm 2 bbl Weber carbs and moderate cylinder heads. Thats a mild upgrade in VW terms, the guys displacing 2180cc and up have the front wheels in the air on launch. Our TLC engines are tractor motors, but motors none the less. They pump air and if you make them pump more air they make they more ponys. These guys make a living out of hot rodding inline 6 cyliner engines: http://cliffordperformanceshop.com/site04/home.htm

I digress, ... go ahead and pull the boat and flog the dog crap out of the 2F. If it aint enough add a SBC or buy a turbodiesel tow rig.

Good luck

 

[Perfect Obsession]

My 2 cents.
- Fresh "cold" intake air has better density than warmed air.
- Separated front/rear bank header exhaust (cyl no. 123 and 456 grouped into an independant exhaust). J**p 4.0L H.O. use this exhaust separation to lower intrabank exhaust valve overlaping.
- Another camshaft/valves setup optimized toward maximum torque (not HP) at your cruising rpm. Ah!Ah! Clifford...
- Concerning the carb or TBI, separating front/rear bank intake manifold would add more power by reducing intrabank intake valve overlaping.
- Environmental constraint and TBI: I don't know GM TBI but if this setup has Oxygen sensor with closed loop control plus a learnable computer, I would add it. I very well know the Toyota Computer Controlled system (TCCS) and if GM TBI is similar, that's should be a big plus for clean fuel economy and power.

P.S.: Concerning header and exhaust pipe size, header diameter should be progressive to increase gaz speed and accelerate gaz particule before the collector (ex: first section outer diameter equal to the second section inner diameter) and have about 20" to 26" length from the head. IMHO, the important point here is to keep front and rear bank header separated.

Header configurations:
A) Two short 3-to-1 manifold (one for each bank) with two long pipes converging into a free flow 2-to-1 collector & exhaust pipe
B) Six long pipes with two 3-to-1 collectors (one for each bank) converging into a free flow 2-to-1 collector & exhaust pipe
C) Six long pipes with one 6-to-1 collectors & free flow exhaust pipe

Having choice, I would choose configuration "A" at 70%, "B" at 20% and "C" at 10%, so "banked" header is more important than size and flow. IMHO.

 

[dogboy]

Perfect Obsession,
your avatar is distractingly hypnotic in the most wonderful of ways....... must concentrate, focus power....... nope, loosing battle