So I am wondering what everyone thinks would be the ideal drivetrain for a pig. I know the first question is it depends on what my plans for the rig is. So ideally this pig is a mall rat. I am going to put a small lift 2-3" on it to do some mild wheeling to get to campsites etc. Since it is a mall rat I would like to stick with an auto tranny and have a modern engine that can easily mount power steering pump and an ac compressor. I want the rig to be able to cruise on the interstate at 75 plus. I am open to everyone's idea I just want to hear some options. I have already thought about the Chevy route, so if you're going to suggest that let me know why you think its the one..
Ideal drivetrain (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter FEJavelina
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Not to high jack. Interested in this myself. ..
Let me start. Not being a total purest, went with a modern chevy. I like the FJ60 axles and steering, easy to get and it gives the wagon a bit wider stance. Another plus with the 60 axles, the chevy oilpan fits better, as the pumpkin is moved to the right alittle. The newer chevys are pretty dependable, easy to find parts on weekends and get reasonable gas mileage.
With a small lift, you might wind up getting 33" tires, so the 4:11 gears might be a better option with the chevy.
One thing I'd like to change is the rear axle to a full float axle, if I have problems with breakage, I'll change out.
There's no one right way, a lot of roads to the same destination.
With a small lift, you might wind up getting 33" tires, so the 4:11 gears might be a better option with the chevy.
One thing I'd like to change is the rear axle to a full float axle, if I have problems with breakage, I'll change out.
There's no one right way, a lot of roads to the same destination.
1FZ-FE
A343F auto or H151F
HF2A converted or HF1A part time transfer case
Toyota I-6, in keeping with OE form, but a modern drivetrain.
Readily available (assuming A343/HF2A converted), parts will be available until 2027, lots of grunt, with plenty of power for highway drives.
Can retain the 1FZ-FE PS and AC.
Not an easy swap to keep the auto, but an H151/HF1A equipped Cruiser ECU could simplify, although they're non-US and expensive due to.
I've been researching and scavenging earth for the proverbial holy grail BH and associated clutch tid bits to run an H55/split case behind the 1FZ.
It's been accomplished elsewhere and extremely attractive since H55/split case combos are easily sourced, new and used, in the US.
H55/split case compatibility, with a corresponding, dumbed down ECU, make the swap much easier a pill to swallow, since a new H55 and rebuilt split case can be purchased for less than an H151, by itself.
A343F auto or H151F
HF2A converted or HF1A part time transfer case
Toyota I-6, in keeping with OE form, but a modern drivetrain.
Readily available (assuming A343/HF2A converted), parts will be available until 2027, lots of grunt, with plenty of power for highway drives.
Can retain the 1FZ-FE PS and AC.
Not an easy swap to keep the auto, but an H151/HF1A equipped Cruiser ECU could simplify, although they're non-US and expensive due to.
I've been researching and scavenging earth for the proverbial holy grail BH and associated clutch tid bits to run an H55/split case behind the 1FZ.
It's been accomplished elsewhere and extremely attractive since H55/split case combos are easily sourced, new and used, in the US.
H55/split case compatibility, with a corresponding, dumbed down ECU, make the swap much easier a pill to swallow, since a new H55 and rebuilt split case can be purchased for less than an H151, by itself.
npulver
Metal Messager
I'm with Ron on this one, I personally have a decent amount of knowledge about the chevy products. So in a few years I'll be swapping in a chevy 5.3L into my pig. Their cheap engines, parts are plentiful, and you can do anything with the.
As far as the transmission goes, that gets trickier. Since the Toyota rear end is offset, it's more difficult to find a pairing transmission without changing the rear end. Not 100% sure what to tell you on that.
As far as the transmission goes, that gets trickier. Since the Toyota rear end is offset, it's more difficult to find a pairing transmission without changing the rear end. Not 100% sure what to tell you on that.
I would tear the truck down... think about it....loose interest....and then sell the parts you accumulate
- Thread starter
- #7
Haha Sawtooth that is pretty much where I am at. So I am looking for some ideas. I think the chevy way is probably the way I will go since it already has a tired sbc in it. I was hoping someone would say something cool about Toyota v8s and that it could be done easily and cheaply... I guess I will get out of fantasy land now
No one picked the Cummins? Htownfire? I imagine that it is because it can be loud?
Ideal for what? There's a ton of answers.
For power, parts availability, aftermarket, simplicity and power, (I like power) you can't beat a gen III LS type GM small block. You just can't.
Gen II Chevys are cheap and plentiful. That's about the only thing they have over the gen III motors.
For being toyota, being a straight 6 and having the right kind of power, a 1FZ is a great choice. 1UZ and 2UZ are also good, but not as right, IMHO. None are easy. There's little to no support, info, or aftermarket. They've all been done and there's some info out there.
I am not a fan of diesels. The domestics are too big (6BT, 7.3) or too crappy (6.2, 6.5) and the imports are too spendy and difficult, but if you want something no one else has that is about the best reasoning to do it. You'll never realize savings from longitivtiy or mileage to justify the cost of the swap.
I prefer to drive an auto. It makes the swap easier as well. Toyota stuff is easier to source with an auto. The domestics too. The modern GM autos are pretty damn bulletproof and there are plenty of adapters to whatever transfer you want.
I've done small block Chevys, gen IIIs and a 1FZ and even a 6.2. They all have benefits and I'd be happy to provide whatever further assistance I can.
All that being said, it's a beautiful day and I'm going to go blast around in my LQ4/TH400 FJ45. It's way more fun to drive than the 1FZ FJ45LV or the TBI350 pig.
For power, parts availability, aftermarket, simplicity and power, (I like power) you can't beat a gen III LS type GM small block. You just can't.
Gen II Chevys are cheap and plentiful. That's about the only thing they have over the gen III motors.
For being toyota, being a straight 6 and having the right kind of power, a 1FZ is a great choice. 1UZ and 2UZ are also good, but not as right, IMHO. None are easy. There's little to no support, info, or aftermarket. They've all been done and there's some info out there.
I am not a fan of diesels. The domestics are too big (6BT, 7.3) or too crappy (6.2, 6.5) and the imports are too spendy and difficult, but if you want something no one else has that is about the best reasoning to do it. You'll never realize savings from longitivtiy or mileage to justify the cost of the swap.
I prefer to drive an auto. It makes the swap easier as well. Toyota stuff is easier to source with an auto. The domestics too. The modern GM autos are pretty damn bulletproof and there are plenty of adapters to whatever transfer you want.
I've done small block Chevys, gen IIIs and a 1FZ and even a 6.2. They all have benefits and I'd be happy to provide whatever further assistance I can.
All that being said, it's a beautiful day and I'm going to go blast around in my LQ4/TH400 FJ45. It's way more fun to drive than the 1FZ FJ45LV or the TBI350 pig.
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Loud, tall, expensive, heavy, requires a lot of modifications. Great motor. At least the 6BT.
1UZ or 1UZ-FE would be the easiest swap, with more aftermarket support than any other, but, as Gumby put it, may not have the right kind of power.
2UZ-FE is a killer engine, but there's nothing simple about swapping even with non-US part options.
1HZ would be a relatively straightforward affair, after sourcing.
1FZ-FE just makes the most sense, though. From a numbers perspective, it's very close to the 2UZ-FE and is the pinnacle of the long history in the F series.
It's not the complete dog it's portrayed as. Mine's pushing a heavier chassis on 37s, and I can still (kinda) hang with my wife's 3UR-FE, when we line 'em up.
It's a kick ass engine and I hope to figure a way to make a swap easier in a part time, manual form.
I'd like to take you up on the offer.
I'm looking at the 1FZ for two very different projects, although the hurdles appear to be similar, but one is dependent upon maintaining that particular Cruisers H55/BF1A, to be viable, and the Pig repower could benefit from the same, 1FZ marriage to H55/BF1A.
My question is, how does one go about commissioning a custom bellhousing?
It'd literally be an H151F front with an H55 rear, looking just like this.
2UZ-FE is a killer engine, but there's nothing simple about swapping even with non-US part options.
1HZ would be a relatively straightforward affair, after sourcing.
1FZ-FE just makes the most sense, though. From a numbers perspective, it's very close to the 2UZ-FE and is the pinnacle of the long history in the F series.
It's not the complete dog it's portrayed as. Mine's pushing a heavier chassis on 37s, and I can still (kinda) hang with my wife's 3UR-FE, when we line 'em up.
It's a kick ass engine and I hope to figure a way to make a swap easier in a part time, manual form.
I'd like to take you up on the offer.
I'm looking at the 1FZ for two very different projects, although the hurdles appear to be similar, but one is dependent upon maintaining that particular Cruisers H55/BF1A, to be viable, and the Pig repower could benefit from the same, 1FZ marriage to H55/BF1A.
My question is, how does one go about commissioning a custom bellhousing?
It'd literally be an H151F front with an H55 rear, looking just like this.
I'd say you need both bell housings and a very competent fab shop. That kind of stuff is why I try to stay with what the manufacturer used as much as possible. I can tell you from experience, both myself with a 6.2l 60 series and a student teacher of mine putting a 5.0 ford in a fiero, you don't have be off much more than a few thousandths and you will eat clutch disks at a pretty amazing rate. It is far harder than just lining up the bells and burning them together. Better to make a plate adapter and space the flywheel to match.
If you get one to work, you might be able to find a sand caster to make more.
Now that I say all that, A fab shop with access to a 3d scanner and printer is not too uncommon now. It should be possible to scan both bells, put them together constrained to the centerline on the clutch shaft and print a full size ABS housing, then have somebody do a sand casting from that.
Theoretically I have that technology, but I'm quitting this week.
If you get one to work, you might be able to find a sand caster to make more.
Now that I say all that, A fab shop with access to a 3d scanner and printer is not too uncommon now. It should be possible to scan both bells, put them together constrained to the centerline on the clutch shaft and print a full size ABS housing, then have somebody do a sand casting from that.
Theoretically I have that technology, but I'm quitting this week.
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You could find Blowproof Bellhousing that’s close and re-drill, any machinist with a mill and DRO should easily be able to find center and redrill your new pattern or worse case cut the flange off and have one laser cut and welded on.
At any rate most of the work is done and they are relatively cheap as a starting point.
In my opinion starting out with a steel bellhousing will likely yield a stronger modified housing verses modifying a cast aluminum unit.
tucker74
Moderator
Really depends on what you want to do, I've gone the diesel route but would not say it's for everyone. Best options IMO...
V8/Auto:
1) Toyota 2UZ/A343F/HF2A - easiest since you could source from a UZJ100, kits, parts, details available.
2) GM5.3/6.0/4L60E - lots of kits/info/wiring kits ... stay away from the 700R4 POS!
V8:
1) Toyota 1/2/3UZ mated to H55 - kits (bellhousing/flywheel/clutch) and wiring out South Africa, amazing setup
2) GM5.3/6.0 mated to H55/NV4500/NV5600
Diesel:
1) Toyota 1HD-T mated to H151F/H55 - Ultimate quiet and reliable but $$ and hard to get parts
I wouldn't go to a Cummins, I think they are awesome but are just too loud and vibrate too much for a 55 IMO.
My $.02 -
Tucker
V8/Auto:
1) Toyota 2UZ/A343F/HF2A - easiest since you could source from a UZJ100, kits, parts, details available.
2) GM5.3/6.0/4L60E - lots of kits/info/wiring kits ... stay away from the 700R4 POS!
V8:
1) Toyota 1/2/3UZ mated to H55 - kits (bellhousing/flywheel/clutch) and wiring out South Africa, amazing setup
2) GM5.3/6.0 mated to H55/NV4500/NV5600
Diesel:
1) Toyota 1HD-T mated to H151F/H55 - Ultimate quiet and reliable but $$ and hard to get parts
I wouldn't go to a Cummins, I think they are awesome but are just too loud and vibrate too much for a 55 IMO.
My $.02 -
Tucker
More input need more input on this......
tucker74
Moderator
1UZ-FE "kits" that I've seen are to R15Xs and, as far as I can ascertain, the 2UZ-FE shares a block bolt pattern with the 1FZ-FE, not the passenger car 1UZ-FE.
I'd assume that a BH for a 2UZ-FE is the same as the 1FZ-FE, since they do share the H15Xs and A343Fs, and there's no BH option for the early Hs (H41,42,55) nor can I find one for the A44Xs, or R15Xs to either the 1FZ or 2UZ.
H15X was the only manual offered for the 2UZ-FE or 1FZ-FE and the same HFXA transfer case limitation applies.
Please correct me were I err, because I've not been able to substantiate claims of an H55 mated to any 1FZ or 2UZ, beyond the one spliced bell housings.
I'd assume that a BH for a 2UZ-FE is the same as the 1FZ-FE, since they do share the H15Xs and A343Fs, and there's no BH option for the early Hs (H41,42,55) nor can I find one for the A44Xs, or R15Xs to either the 1FZ or 2UZ.
H15X was the only manual offered for the 2UZ-FE or 1FZ-FE and the same HFXA transfer case limitation applies.
Please correct me were I err, because I've not been able to substantiate claims of an H55 mated to any 1FZ or 2UZ, beyond the one spliced bell housings.
tucker74
Moderator
I have a quote for a complete kit to mate a 1UZ-FE to a H55 for ~$2k shipped, included the bellhousing, flywheel, clutch, pilot and throwout bearing, and a Spitronics ECU with a basic program that would make the engine run (needs final dino-program). This was for the non-vvti 1UZ, but could be purchased for any of the *UZ (4.0/4.3/4.6/4.7) series engines and for vvti for a bit more. There is a 40 thread that a guy in SA did this, I pinged him and he put me in touch with the mechanic who did the conversion.
Tucker
Tucker
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- Thread starter
- #20
This is why I love this site. You guys have so much information. Thanks this will give me something to mull over until I get the funds