4bta

[red_dirt_okie]

Okay, I have been trying to figure "the best engine" thing and have read a plethora of post. I would like to focus on the differences between the Chevy 6.0 and a 4bta. The general consensus is that the 4bta is more expensive. It would seem to me that a mid mileage (150K) 4bta with a Chevy bolt pattern adapter, lets say from a step van, wouldn't be that more expensive then a low mile (70k) 6 liter truck engine. I have been pricing them and the 4bta with the inner cooler is, lets say approximately 2500 more then the 6 liter. SO.

Lets assume that there is enough lift to clear the 4bta, oil pan.

1) As far as I can tell you still have to get a ranger or a mark's adapter to mate either to the stock FJ60 standard tranny.
2) you still have to get engine mount for both.
3) There is no catilitic converters for the 4bta. And you could run only one exhaust pipe with one muffler.
4) The wiring seems les complicated with the 4bta and it would seem that you could use the existing harness.
5) There are no emissions and no fly by wire with the 4bta.

Okay so here you go.. It looks like by the time you bought all the aditional items for the chevy conversion the prices would be close to comparable. I said close.

Here are my questions:

1)What am I missing on the cost, or are they comparable?

2)COST ASIDE, which is the easier conversion? Heck you can start the 4bta on the garage floor, no emission stuff, less sensors, mechanical throttle linkage......so on

 

[Devils Paw 80]

I think you should ask this guy, or maybe just buy his truck. Sounds like a great deal.

1984 Land Cruiser converted to straight veggie oil- never pay for gas (North east portland)

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Reply to: sale-978833613@craigslist.org [?]
Date: 2009-01-03, 11:33AM PST



1984 Land Cruiser converted to straight veggie oil- never pay for gas
1984 FJ60 Landcruiser with Cummins 3.9 liter (these guys love biodiesel), (4bt) turbo diesel, intercooler, Ranger Overdrive for 8 forward and 2 reverse manual speeds, engine has about 86k on it, like new. Lifted 4 inches, 33 inch Toyo all terrains like new, runs and drives well. Top speed is about 80 mph with the Ranger O/D per GPS. Needs some body work, but not to serious. Slight surface rust where paint is damaged but zero rust bubbles, holes etc. Interior could use seat cover on drivers seat and front carpet. General cleanup would be a good idea. Converted by Lovecraft to run on Straight Veggie Oil using a two tank system- (which cost about a grand). This is a very good solid truck, and when the detail work is done will be a steal at $15k or more. Has a very interesting paint job as a couple of grafitti artists hooked me up with a SVO on the back...Also has tinted windows (not pictured- recently done and as black as the law allows) and a six speaker stereo with detacheable face cd player with ipod attachment. This truck is incredible! between 18-20 MPG with biodiesel. about the same with straight veggie oil.

asking $8500 but will consider serious offers, damage is shown in photo.

 

[Grease Cruiser]

It all depends on how you set the 4BTA up. What kind of AC do you want to run? How do you want to deal with the braking system...... vacuum pump or hydroboost?

The 6.0L should always come out cheaper. More than likely, you will get an AC system with the engine. Also, no lift is required.

I work for a shop that does a lot of 4BT swaps into Cruisers. We also do a lot of 5.3L and 6.0L swaps and the Vortec swaps will always come out about $2K cheaper than a Cummins swap.

Parts add up quickly doing a Cummins swap. We prefer to use the original braking system which requires the purchase of a new power steering pump as well as a new vacuum pump. Total cost.... $500+ We prefer to do a completely new AC system that is incorporated into the serpentine drive belt. It is a one belt system. By the time you buy the new AC compressor, new idler, new pulley, and serpentine belt, you are over $800 in parts.

As far as easier, well that's a toss up. I'd say the 6.0L is less work as you don't have to do suspension mods. However, the Cummins is easier coming from an installation point of view. Just a few wires to the 4BT compared to a new engine harness for a Vortec.

I consult people daily on 4BT swaps. I talk about 75% of people out of the swap because they are not exactly what the customer is looking for. Once I explain to them that the Cummins is a loud, obnoxious diesel that requires a significant amount of lift, most people back away. Then there are others that drool at the thought..... and then I know that they are ready for a 4BT.

Hope that helps some. I'd be glad to consult more if you care to listen.

 

[Grease Cruiser]

I think you should ask this guy, or maybe just buy his truck. Sounds like a great deal.

1984 Land Cruiser converted to straight veggie oil- never pay for gas (North east portland)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Reply to: sale-978833613@craigslist.org [?]
Date: 2009-01-03, 11:33AM PST



1984 Land Cruiser converted to straight veggie oil- never pay for gas
1984 FJ60 Landcruiser with Cummins 3.9 liter (these guys love biodiesel), (4bt) turbo diesel, intercooler, Ranger Overdrive for 8 forward and 2 reverse manual speeds, engine has about 86k on it, like new. Lifted 4 inches, 33 inch Toyo all terrains like new, runs and drives well. Top speed is about 80 mph with the Ranger O/D per GPS. Needs some body work, but not to serious. Slight surface rust where paint is damaged but zero rust bubbles, holes etc. Interior could use seat cover on drivers seat and front carpet. General cleanup would be a good idea. Converted by Lovecraft to run on Straight Veggie Oil using a two tank system- (which cost about a grand). This is a very good solid truck, and when the detail work is done will be a steal at $15k or more. Has a very interesting paint job as a couple of grafitti artists hooked me up with a SVO on the back...Also has tinted windows (not pictured- recently done and as black as the law allows) and a six speaker stereo with detacheable face cd player with ipod attachment. This truck is incredible! between 18-20 MPG with biodiesel. about the same with straight veggie oil.

asking $8500 but will consider serious offers, damage is shown in photo.

"Never pay for gas" That's funny! Because it's a diesel, you wouldn't pay for gas anyways. I don't have to pay for gas in any of my diesels either

He should be getting better mileage than 18-20 mpg with the 33's. The Fritota, my old 4BT powered FJ60 was averaging 25-26 mpg on 33's. Also, I have heard some not so kind things about Lovecraft.

 

[Devils Paw 80]

Also, I have heard some not so kind things about Lovecraft.

Mudders should be thankful for the heads up. Perhaps you could mention some of the problems that can occur with a less than excellent conversion, without specifically indicting Lovecraft. Or go ahead and let'em have it. HP Lovecraft will be rolling over in his grave.

 

[grant5127]

I've driven several 4bt powered 60s and the whopping 110 hp just doesn't do it for me........

 

[Grease Cruiser]

I've driven several 4bt powered 60s and the whopping 110 hp just doesn't do it for me........

The 4BT is not for everyone. The stock 105 hp is not a rocket ship by any means but turning up the fuel definitely makes a siginificant difference in power.

Mudders should be thankful for the heads up. Perhaps you could mention some of the problems that can occur with a less than excellent conversion, without specifically indicting Lovecraft. Or go ahead and let'em have it. HP Lovecraft will be rolling over in his grave.

By no means am I an expert on the VO conversions. The general consensus is that the VO needs to be heated to 160+ degrees F before it is run through the injection pump. When it is 160 degrees or hotter, it will combust more like petroleum diesel or bio-diesel. If it is less than 160 degrees and it is burned, there will be carbon deposits left in the cylinder walls due to incomplete combustion. Over time, this engine coking can cause premature wear on the rings and lead to engine failure.

The jury is still out whether or not Lovecraft's system is heating the VO sufficiently. Some people say their particular system is not and it is doing major engine damage. I have no personal experience with their products, this is just what I have read and talked to people about.

 

[boots4]

...but turning up the fuel definitely makes a siginificant difference in power.

x2, I've played with my fueling and it does make a difference. Turning up a 4bt is pretty dang easy. I've got the 120hp version that I currently have slightly turned up and I have no problem keeping up or passing traffic. Once I get a few bugs worked out specific to my build I'll give it a little more fuel and let the torque do the work. You can get insane power from cummins engines.

The cummins 4bt is not for everyone and it is loud, but I think it is great for what I'm trying to accomplish with my rig. I DD it, wheel with it, and tow with it. We've even taken long trips ~1600mile with it. That little engine just purrs right along.

I originally bought my 60 with the plan of swapping in a v8 but once I got the diesel bug plans changed.

 

[Kief]

Hey Grease...
I am doing research on the 4BT swap, just curious, does the 60 series need a SOA/ 4" SUA and as for the 80's which lift does your outfit install on the 80 series?

From what I have found so far most who have taken the swap on comment on how all the extras such as the lift, vacuum pump/electric vacuum pump, hoses, brackets, throttle linkage, etc, all add up.

 

[Acadia]

ok if the 4 cyl cummins doesn't have enough hp what about the 6 cyl cummins? or is it to heavy to get into a 60 or 80?