alaskacruiser said:
AMEN, I miss Thirsty, my trusty 60
Talk about straight forward simple construction.
what the heck is going on with the 80 head gaskets? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter e9999
- Start date
This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate
links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.
AMEN, I miss Thirsty, my trusty 60
Talk about straight forward simple construction.
landtank said:
Sorry, Rick, but you can't compare timing chain replacement with HG replacement. The HG is definitely a bigger and more serious item. The timing chains on those had an upgrade, it's relatively easy to change, and quite a bit cheaper than a HG. Most do the initial timing chain replacement on those as they would a timing belt- as PM, and they don't have to worry about the chain again once they get the upgrade. It's easy, it's cheap, it's a relatively minor maintenance item. The same cannot be said for FZJ80's head gasket, and nobody has put 150K+ on the upgraded head gasket to see if it is still a weak point, everyone's just speculating / praying that it's not.
Last edited:
alaskacruiser said:
Older vehicles really don't count as the gov't hadn't mandated the outlawing of certain materials that was used in HG design. The 93+ engines had to do without these enviromentaly hazardous materials and forced engineers to redesign all their HGs.
Also apple to apples a little bit here, 4+ liter gas engines and basically a truck design, after all that is what we are talking about here.
alaskacruiser said:
When the timing chain let go it took out all kinds of crap on the front of that engine. I have to beleive it cost more than my gasket set.
landtank said:
Not if done as PM (as any owner here would). In that case, it's a much simpler, cheaper, less serious item than a HG. Like I said, most owners thought of it as a timing belt before the upgrade. You can reasonably call the timing chain a maintenance item. You cannot reasonably call the HG a maintenance item without also stating that it is a major design flaw.
OEM parts to put a chain in a 20-22R cost more than does a 1FZ valvegrind gasket set. The timing chain alone is over 125 bucks. Of course attermarket copies are cheaper. To replace the chain "properly" on a 20-22R you are supposed to remove the cylinder head and the oil pan. Often a loose chain will saw into the timing cover, add a couple hundred more for that.
I was likely the first one to do a HG as a PM item. I recognized the need to address this issue a long time ago. I'll admit that the original gasket needed improving, but to say it had a major design flaw is a little over the top.
Agree the HG is an issue and it's only a matter of time. Knowing that, I'm trying to find a used SUV for my bro in law. He has a casually maintained 93 he bought when I got my 93 and it has 297,500 miles and runs as smoothly as either of mine. My top choice at the moment? A 165,000 80 series we'll be looking at tomorrow. So, yeah this is an issue but knowing all that I know I still believe it's an excellent choice for a durable low cost of ownership vehicle. Sure, if he gets it I'll recommend $500 worth of PM (shocks, front nd rear axle repacks, all hoses, flush, all fluids, maybe the HG). But when that's done I'd put it up against a 30,000 mile domestic SUV in terms of "get in and drive it" reliability.
DougM
DougM
- Thread starter
- #29
the one thing about this is that we should definitely add the Replaced HG item as a big plus when buying a used rig...
https://forum.ih8mud.com/showthread.php?t=52531
should we do a poll of HG failure by year?
https://forum.ih8mud.com/showthread.php?t=52531
should we do a poll of HG failure by year?
Last edited by a moderator:
I have seen 22Rs that took out the head when the chain went.
And I think that was one of the best engines ever built.
People spent 30-50,000 on Cadillacs with 4.1, 4.5 and 4.9L motors too. They were giant pieces of s*** that rarely made 100,000 miles. Big money does not equal reliability. Jaguar and Ferrari owners can attest to that.
The 2F didn't blow HGs, but it was limited big time because of it's cast iron head. The aluminum head on the 1FZ-FE allows it to make good hp, but puts the HG under a lot of stress.
That and I personally have never had a 150,000 mile 2F. I've had four lunched before that. There's no way you can compare the reliability of a 2F to a 1FZ with a straight face.
I also believe the only way for a Benz or Volvo to be trouble free as a Toyota is to do crazy amounts of preventative maintenance.
And I think that was one of the best engines ever built.
People spent 30-50,000 on Cadillacs with 4.1, 4.5 and 4.9L motors too. They were giant pieces of s*** that rarely made 100,000 miles. Big money does not equal reliability. Jaguar and Ferrari owners can attest to that.
The 2F didn't blow HGs, but it was limited big time because of it's cast iron head. The aluminum head on the 1FZ-FE allows it to make good hp, but puts the HG under a lot of stress.
That and I personally have never had a 150,000 mile 2F. I've had four lunched before that. There's no way you can compare the reliability of a 2F to a 1FZ with a straight face.
I also believe the only way for a Benz or Volvo to be trouble free as a Toyota is to do crazy amounts of preventative maintenance.
Cruiserdrew
On the way there
Gumby said:
This is suprising. I have 180k on my 76 and 210k on my 84. Both still run pretty strong, especially the 84. The 76 could use a rebuild, or at least a valve job. This whole 1FZ head gasket thing has me bummed, but the more of these stories I read, the closer I get to doing the HG as PM. Maybe at 100k, I'll treat it to a new HG. That should be shortly after Cruise Moab.
BOUNDER said:
I lobbied quite strongly to get Toyota's attention on the 1FZ-FE head gasket issues about 3 years ago (SOR days.) You will get a polite reply for bringing your concern to their attention. That is all.
Most of us agree that it is disappointing that we can't get 300k miles out of the original HG. I believe that most of us would also agree that 1 replacement HG (hopefully as PM) to get the engine to 300k miles is acceptable.
-B-
Last edited:
Cruiserdrew
On the way there
Beowulf said:
I don't necessarily disagree, it's the unknown aspect of the whole thing. My 80 is used almost exclusively for long trips like Death Valley, Moab, Anza Borrego (this week!) and so the idea that the HG might last for another 100k or might blow in the middle of nowhere, sucks.
My 60, with twice the miles, I never give a second thought, and figure whatever breaks, I can probably fix on the side of the road.
Cruiserdrew
On the way there
IdahoDoug said:
Doug-You sold another one. Paypal inbound...
semlin
curmudgeon
i've been with landtank on this issue for a while now and doug's expeience within 5k of my mileage on the same year truck sealed the deal. if i had a garage i would have done it as pm a while ago. trouble is doing it on the street in a town where it rained (hard) 55 out of the last 60 days requires a level of motivation i don't possess. yesterday it was blowing 90kmh and sleeting on me as i fixed the rad hose.
and no i can't build a garage. we love our house but no rear yard access and only 15 feet of frontage. the perils of living in the city. i would buy a house nearby and rent it just for the garage.
and no i can't build a garage. we love our house but no rear yard access and only 15 feet of frontage. the perils of living in the city. i would buy a house nearby and rent it just for the garage.
