Snap ring thickness

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agaisin

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How important is snap ring thickness on the driveshafts?
The FSM says:
"Pull out the drive shaft outside the vehicle and select the snap ring which ensures the clearance b/w the tip of the flange and the snap ring is less than .2mm (.008in.)."

I am chasing a wandering issue and wondering whether snap ring thickness could have anything to do with it.

On PS, snap ring is perfect fit (is it possible for snap ring to be too tight against flange?).

On DS, I haven't measured but I think there is excessive 'play' (let's say .2 or .3mm). Would this allow for wandering at high speed or am I completely offbase?

Either way I'd like to understand better - is >.2mm b/w tip of flange and snap ring a problem? How serious? And converse - is too tight fit a problem (no gap b/w snap ring and flange)?
 
FSM says to replace but I reused mine. I've got 10k on em with no issues.
 
I have no problem with reusing them, but my question is about the thickness and whether wrong thickness can cause any handling (or other) issues.

I assume the reason there is a variation in snap ring thickness is to account for the tolerance on driveshaft length when (re)packing the cv joints... In other words after reassembling the cv joints after a repack, it's possible the overall length of the driveshaft is off by a few mm and that's why there's different thickness snap rings.... and if the wrong thickness is used allowing too much or too little play what are the consequences...

Insight anyone?
 
Sorry to revive an old thread but I just finished ordering all of the parts for my passenger side axle install and the guy in the Marietta Toyota parts dept. told me that snap ring thickness can be different for each and every axle. Since I will not be using my original axle (no re-build), he told me that the proper procedure for installing a new axle is to measure the gap and order the properly sized snap ring accordingly. He also said that in theory, every 98-07 LC could have different snap ring gap measurements.

I get that Toyota wants their snap rings to fit with super tight tolerances but what I don't get is how you are supposed to order the parts correctly if you don't know your snap ring gap width until you see and actually measure the gap on the new axle?

Anyone?

So, I can't re-use my current snap rings b/c

A) They are bent and...
B) The new axle more than likely will have a different sized gap than than the one I am replacing.

I ended up ordering the size in the middle and then one size up and down for both axles so 6 snap rings in total.

How do I measure the snap ring gap? Is there another special tool I need to buy?
 
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I just put my front end back together with a new CV on the PS. 1.8mm on one side and 2.2mm on the other side. Over the course of working on my rig and replacing too many damn CV axles to count I have found the snap-rings can get "stretched". I am confident this is why Toyota has this as a single use item.

:hhmm: This could have led to Rohitash's snap-ring failure.

They're relatively cheap so I now adhere to Toyota's recommendation. They range in thickness from 1.8mm to 2.4mm in .2mm increments. And I always have a pair of the different sizes in my parts kit. After I'm sure I've got the CV solidly pulled into the hub flange I just fit the snap-ring thickness that just takes up the space.
 
spressomon said:
I just put my front end back together with a new CV on the PS. 1.8mm on one side and 2.2mm on the other side. Over the course of working on my rig and replacing too many **** CV axles to count I have found the snap-rings can get "stretched". I am confident this is why Toyota has this as a single use item.

:hhmm: This could have led to Rohitash's snap-ring failure.

They're relatively cheap so I now adhere to Toyota's recommendation. They range in thickness from 1.8mm to 2.4mm in .2mm increments. And I always have a pair of the different sizes in my parts kit. After I'm sure I've got the CV solidly pulled into the hub flange I just fit the snap-ring thickness that just takes up the space.
Click to expand...

^ Great advice. I too keep an array of thicknesses. And I at least end up tweaking the snap rings getting them off. Definitely wouldn't want to use/trust them.
 
I just had this problem, when they pulled the dust cap off to pull the cv, the snap ring was just sitting there not even attached. When they went to put it all back together the snap ring would not fit and we found out that there are three different sizes available. My passenger side apparently takes the smallest one and Toyota parts didnt have it in stock so they ground down the existing one and made it work.

What did I learn....Order all available snap rings before you pull the shaft so no matter what you will have the right part.
 
using proper snap ring pliers makes it easy to replace/remove without damaging them (or yourself). lol - i tore up my hand trying to get one off the first time without the proper tool.

i also ordered spares and a few sizes up and down for future jobs.
 
agaisin said:
using proper snap ring pliers makes it easy to replace/remove without damaging them (or yourself). lol - i tore up my hand trying to get one off the first time without the proper tool.

i also ordered spares and a few sizes up and down for future jobs.
Click to expand...

which one did you use? mine get it started just fine, but the ring is too stiff to come off with just the pliers. so it's a combo show of pliers then two small screwdrivers.
 
Duckbill style snap ring pliers. And I'm sure the Toyota engineers, when they decided to make these snap-rings a one time use only part, assumed the mechanic would be installing/removing them properly with the correct tools ;p

https://forum.ih8mud.com/100-series-cruisers/116630-100-lx-brakes-3.html#post1552972

The cost-benefit equation for the snap-rings just doesn't make sense to be cheap here IMO. Too much damage can be at stake for a couple bucks spent on snap-rings every once in a while.
 
spressomon said:
Duckbill style snap ring pliers. And I'm sure the Toyota engineers, when they decided to make these snap-rings a one time use only part, assumed the mechanic would be installing/removing them properly with the correct tools ;p

https://forum.ih8mud.com/100-series-cruisers/116630-100-lx-brakes-3.html#post1552972

The cost-benefit equation for the snap-rings just doesn't make sense to be cheap here IMO. Too much damage can be at stake for a couple bucks spent on snap-rings every once in a while.
Click to expand...

Those in the link would be better. Mine are like these. They can get a purchase on the opening, but tend to slide off as the ring flexes.

Sears: Online department store featuring appliances, tools, fitness equipment and more
 
Dennis,
Yes the snap-ring pliers you are currently using are nearly useless for the CV/axle end snap-rings. The difference between your current pliers and the pliers I linked is night and day. I started out with the same type as your current pliers too...no good.
 
Spress is right. This morning I went out and bought four different kinds of snap ring pliers. All were worthless. I wish I would have seen these posts earlier.

Re: the snap rings, it all makes perfect sense now. As soon as I had my passenger side axle pretty much buttoned up, all I did was clean the snap ring groove, take my assortment of different sized snap rings and set them into the groove. The most snug one got placed on the axle. I am going to re-purchase the ones I used and place one of each size in my recovery gear.

Thanks for the phone help again Dan!
 
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Just to add: When you are installing the new snap-rings be sure to open the snap ring as minimally as possible with the snap-ring pliers to help insure the snap-rings maintain their original springiness. I generally, with the duck bill snap-ring pliers referenced above, just flex the snap-ring enough to get it on the CV end shaft "ramp" (at the end of the splines) and then push, with my fingers, the snap ring up into the snap-ring groove on the end of the CV shaft. The goal is to not stress/deform the snap-ring...


You're welcome Paul...glad it all worked out for you.
 
Let's get back to the original question from months back. I too have had some questions about fitment.

I think there's a slight play or vibration in my steering wheel after rebuilding my hubs. Really hard to explain the feel in the steering wheel. The LX isn't wondering, per se, but the steering wheel has a different wobble to it. . . if that makes sense. It feels like there's shaking/wobbling feedback in the steering wheel but when you let go of the wheel it doesn't move. It's almost like you have to build up the first bit of tension in the steering components (rack, steering column, etc) to feel the wobble/shaking feedback).

During the hub rebuilds, I had a lot of trouble getting the DS snap ring into place. To resolve a super tight fit, I got it barely into place and actually tapped it (with a rubber hammer and tap tool) in order to seat it deeper into it's groove. The PS just popped in with no restrictions of any kind and seems to be rather flush with it's groove. I used the original snap rings and both are seated in their groove but ... how do I know how thick the thicknesses should be? I didn't push/pull the axles with any type of tool to give more or less slack. I just tapped with the hammer and pushed/leaned on it with arm strength. But using some type of pulley or other tool might have allowed me to control the amount of slack in the axle for the snap rings.
 
I use the same snap ring pliers as shown in Spressomon's link and I slide a large washer over the nose with a hole size just large enough to allow the jaws to open far enough for the snap ring to fit on or off. This prevents accidently opening the ring open too far and stretching it - which is very easy to do, I have done it. The hole size in the washer I am using is .555 in diameter. I keep it attached to the pliers with a twist tie so I don't loose it. As far as clearance goes, I would feel more comfortable with a fit that was a little loose over one that felt too tight. I'd be paranoid of it cracking or popping off from too much pressure on it. I don't think a little looseness will do any harm and is much safer IMO (just my opinion).
But as far as the OP's question of will the wrong clearance affect steering: I would say not at all. I would expect a wheel bearing, balance or alignment issue to be the culprit.
 
badlander said:
I use the same snap ring pliers as shown in Spressomon's link and I slide a large washer over the nose with a hole size just large enough to allow the jaws to open far enough for the snap ring to fit on or off. This prevents accidently opening the ring open too far and stretching it - which is very easy to do, I have done it. The hole size in the washer I am using is .555 in diameter. I keep it attached to the pliers with a twist tie so I don't loose it. As far as clearance goes, I would feel more comfortable with a fit that was a little loose over one that felt too tight. I'd be paranoid of it cracking or popping off from too much pressure on it. I don't think a little looseness will do any harm and is much safer IMO (just my opinion).

But as far as the OP's question of will the wrong clearance affect steering: I would say not at all. I would expect a wheel bearing, balance or alignment issue to be the culprit.
Click to expand...

There shouldn't be any risk of a tight ring popping off - there's no lateral load (unless the CV is binding) and when it's on there it's on there solid. Conversely, a loose ring would allow for slop and noise (I would think).
 
FWIW, found the OTC version of Dan's 'duckbill' pliers...

Amazon.com: OTC 714 Horseshoe Lock Ring Plier: Automotive

IMG_3432.jpg
 
Can someone help me with the process for checking the gap? Do I need to have tire off and a tool to pull axle through as far as possible?
 
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