Possible oil pump tick?

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Niko Jackson

Niko Jackson

Joined
Feb 17, 2021
Threads
11
Messages
88
Location
Jackson Wyoming
1995 FZJ80 1FZ-FE
For the life of me I cannot figure out this ticking noise coming from the front of my engine. There is a new short block with new oem timing chain and guides. I just had a valve job done on the original head and after driving the five hours home I started to notice the noise. It is most notable when cold. When I have the stethoscope I can hear it the most towards the front of the upper oil pan and on the timing chain cover. I have isolated it to just the engine (removed fan, belts, and ps pump). The fact I just had the head redone makes me want to think it is something in that assembly. Maybe scissor gear? The location of the noise also leads me to think maybe oil pump? That pump has 340k on it, I’ve heard that it is rare they start to fail but you never know I guess. Any and all input would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
Video here: Noise after cold start
 
Was the power steering pump gear removed/replaced during the engine work?
 
Kernal said:
Was the power steering pump gear removed/replaced during the engine work?
Click to expand...
Yes ps pump was replaced, same gear. I know if there is any damage on the gear it can cause a lot of weirdness. I pulled the pump and turned the engine over and the noise was still persistent.
 
Can we change the title to something meaningful?

“Help” threads should be for those who truly need help.
 
take the valve cover off and have a good look in there. Im hoping that if a valve job was done they have not forgotten to remove the service bolt on the exhaust cam ....
 
robnicko said:
take the valve cover off and have a good look in there. Im hoping that if a valve job was done they have not forgotten to remove the service bolt on the exhaust cam ....
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Forgot my mechanic sent me pictures on reassembly.
IMG_1064.webp

IMG_1068.webp
 

and what i found

Sounds similar
 
Niko Jackson said:
Yeah it does thank you! Do you know if you need to take the harmonic balancer to take the oil pump cover off?
Click to expand...
you do but it is easy. just lay on your right side and put your feet on the passenger side tire and pull. I don't think i even took the fan shroud loose the last time. but, it is likely easier if you do remove it or at least detach and pull it up a little out of the way. You will likely find the oil pump cover worn... i ordered a new one and a new impeller. I think it was under 50 bucks total with shipping. oh and get a new o-ring gastket too.

i have a thread some place where i originally posted these videos. I went a lot deeper before finding mine than you... finding mine was an accident becuase the sound was no where near the low end to my ears. I just happened to want to deal with a leak that didn't stay fixed and then found the loose impeller.

If you can find my other thread you will see the pictures where the splines on mine were worn out.

because of the noise i nearly didn't drive my 80 for a whole year thinking the engine was going.

found it:

clx16

Thread 'Engine rattle investigation'

So I have had a rattle that used to go a way after a few minutes. Then it got to the point that it was getting louder and not going away. Previous recordings made it hard to hear it over the sewing machine sounds but finally got a good recording.



Could never hear it with a engine stethoscope, no matter how many places on the block and assesories.

Changed out the timing chain tensioner, ran the bore scope in every direction thinking I had a broken chain guide and everyone looked fine but the sound didn't go away. Went up to a thicker oil and still nothing changed...
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clx16 said:
you do but it is easy. just lay on your right side and put your feet on the passenger side tire and pull. I don't think i even took the fan shroud loose the last time. but, it is likely easier if you do remove it or at least detach and pull it up a little out of the way. You will likely find the oil pump cover worn... i ordered a new one and a new impeller. I think it was under 50 bucks total with shipping. oh and get a new o-ring gastket too.

i have a thread some place where i originally posted these videos. I went a lot deeper before finding mine than you... finding mine was an accident becuase the sound was no where near the low end to my ears. I just happened to want to deal with a leak that didn't stay fixed and then found the loose impeller.

If you can find my other thread you will see the pictures where the splines on mine were worn out.

because of the noise i nearly didn't drive my 80 for a whole year thinking the engine was going.

found it:

clx16

Thread 'Engine rattle investigation'

So I have had a rattle that used to go a way after a few minutes. Then it got to the point that it was getting louder and not going away. Previous recordings made it hard to hear it over the sewing machine sounds but finally got a good recording.



Could never hear it with a engine stethoscope, no matter how many places on the block and assesories.

Changed out the timing chain tensioner, ran the bore scope in every direction thinking I had a broken chain guide and everyone looked fine but the sound didn't go away. Went up to a thicker oil and still nothing changed...
  • Like
Click to expand...

Copy that, only thing is I would have to pickup a new torque wrench since it’s like 300ftlbs or something. Did yours have an oil pressure issue? Mine has good pressure. I have been really nervous driving it. I’m not very familiar with the oil pump assembly, did you replace anything else while you were in there? Drive gear, relief valve, gasket for oil strainer?
 
i believe you need to get to 308ftlbs... so get the harbor freight one for 300 and then after the click give a little bit more ha.

Just the impeller, o-ring and cover is all i changed. if you look at that other thread you can see more pictures of what damage was there.

I had no oil pressure change before or after, and i typically have decent oil pressure from what the gauge of the dash.

the only real difference was just how quiet it got after that.
 
clx16 said:
i believe you need to get to 308ftlbs... so get the harbor freight one for 300 and then after the click give a little bit more ha.

Just the impeller, o-ring and cover is all i changed. if you look at that other thread you can see more pictures of what damage was there.

I had no oil pressure change before or after, and i typically have decent oil pressure from what the gauge of the dash.

the only real difference was just how quiet it got after that.
Click to expand...
Copy that! I was just reading through your other thread, really great stuff. I will do more investigating with the stethoscope but I hope this is my issue.
 
fortunately it is cheap so even if it doesn't solve your problem, you are not out much. If this turns out to be your issue, it will be probably the 5th time this has been found to be the problem on mud. I wish others would have found it first so that the first time i was sealing things up, i could have just avoided the whole problem by replacing the stuff the first time since the parts are cheap.
 
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clx16 said:
fortunately it is cheap so even if it doesn't solve your problem, you are not out much. if this turns out to be your issue, it will be probably the 5 time this has been found to be the problem on mud. I wish others would have found it first so that the first time i was sealing things up, i could have just avoided the whole problem by replacing the stuff the first time since the parts are cheap.
Click to expand...
Yeah I hear that. Either way it’s an original part and replacing it is not a bad idea.
 
clx16 said:
fortunately it is cheap so even if it doesn't solve your problem, you are not out much. If this turns out to be your issue, it will be probably the 5th time this has been found to be the problem on mud. I wish others would have found it first so that the first time i was sealing things up, i could have just avoided the whole problem by replacing the stuff the first time since the parts are cheap.
Click to expand...
Thank you for posting this video!

I was on here today to do a quick search, not expecting to actually find a video describing my current noises.

My 96 LC with 387K on it has started making the same noise as yours for the past few months.
I finally got a good recording of it.
I placed a stethoscope on the AC, Water Pump, alternator, valve cover, other few placed and had not been able to find anything.

I was thinking idler pulley, but the AC idler is only about 6 months old, the alternator one is a couple years old, belts are about 6 months old.
I replaced the fan a couple years ago and had added oil to the fan clutch, so I started thinking maybe it was the blades on the fan may have cracked. It only makes noise for about 1 minute on first cold start up of the day.

I will now slide under it on first start with the stethoscope and see if it is loudest at the oil pump housing.

Right now, mine sounds exactly like yours.

However, I don't think @Niko Jackson 's engine sounds like yours. His has a lower and more rhythmic tone.
 
clx16 said:
i believe you need to get to 308ftlbs... so get the harbor freight one for 300 and then after the click give a little bit more ha.

Just the impeller, o-ring and cover is all i changed. if you look at that other thread you can see more pictures of what damage was there.

I had no oil pressure change before or after, and i typically have decent oil pressure from what the gauge of the dash.

the only real difference was just how quiet it got after that.
Click to expand...
I have a few quick questions. Did you use the SST to hold the crank pulley during removal? I think I might just weld up a custom tool. Does the impeller and ring go in a certain way? I see that there is an arrow on the ring and wasn’t sure what to line that up with, couldn’t find it in the FSM.
 
Niko Jackson said:
I have a few quick questions. Did you use the SST to hold the crank pulley during removal? I think I might just weld up a custom tool. Does the impeller and ring go in a certain way? I see that there is an arrow on the ring and wasn’t sure what to line that up with, couldn’t find it in the FSM.
Click to expand...
Nope just take a deepwell 14mm impact socket and put it on a bolt head via the transmission inspection hole... that will hold the crank shaft still for you. Those torque converter bolt heads are deeper than normal so that socket will stop the rotation of the engine as it gets pinned against the side of the inspection hole edge.
 
There's a few different methods you can use to remove the harmonic balancer/crank pulley 30mm bolt using the starter bump method.
Put a 3/4" drive breaker bar on the crank bolt using an impact rated 30mm socket then place the bar up under the frame rail and give the starter a quick bump (pull the wire from the distributor to the coil first or pull the EFI fuse)

If the crank bolt doesn't come off you can use a crank holding tool (pushed up under the frame rails) and a long section of 2" pipe (cheater bar/extension)
slid over the breaker bar and pull with everything you've got. Important to use a 3/4" drive breaker bar, anything less will break.
Protect the fender in case the breaker bar slips (or breaks) if using this method.

Or rattle it off using an impact wrench if you have one with enough torque but then the radiator will most likely have to come out.

Some discussions in this thread:

Zane

Thread 'How to Replace Oil Pump seal w/ Pics'

I recently noticed that I had an oil leak coming from the front of my motor. After cleaning up the front of the motor to determine where the leak was coming from it was easy to see that it was coming from where the oil pump cover mated to the timing chain cover. I crawled under the truck once running and oil was coming out in a slow but steady stream from the area shown in the attached picture below.
leak areas04.webp

After reading several posts on what others have done when they have had a bad oil pump seal I was concerned that I would end up having to pull...
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