fj80 high steer anyone? (8 Viewers)

[sleeoffroad]

Billy, not knocking anything or picking on you. I was just under the impression that you said the setup would be cheaper than what is out there current (ie ours or OTT's). With setup I understood that to mean the knuckles and arms together.

I still don't see the obsession with keeping the ABS. If you really want to do that, it would be easy to machine the existing knuckle in a different spot to accept the ABS sensor. In most cases these are going under trucks that are not requiring ABS.

i just want to make some parts to help people like myself make the best of their toyotas.

That is the right attitude, essentially exactly the same reason why we made the arms. We wanted them and we could not find them. We put them out for sale to those that want them. This market is not big. We all know that.

 

[1000-oaks]

I suspect the market might be MUCH bigger than ih8mud users realize, if we consider the vast number of '84-'95 pickups and 4Runners.

If 80-series high-steer knuckles and arms were in the same neighborhood price-wise as Trail-Gear's 6-shooter knuckles and arms for mini-trucks, why would ANYONE use an '85 mini-truck axle (with &%#$ wheel spacers that move the wheel way out from the trunion bearings) when they could have a nice wide, STRONG 80-series axle? The only limitation would be the number of 80-series axles available, and given the age of these trucks there will be plenty more available every year.

Toyota, Suzuki Samurai, and Jeep Off Road Parts

And an 80-series equivalent wouldn't cost any more to manufacture, maybe they have a pound or two more steel but that's it. Seriously, $299 for the whole kit (studs excluded)...talk about a lot of wheeling benefit per dollar.

 

[billy138]

i dont think that trail gear sells the arms and knuckles for $299, it's higher.
keep in mind that production costs in china are waaay lower than here in the U.S.

our parts will have a higher production cost, but it will be worth it considering the better metals and the better quality control than we would get from overseas production. i'm not trying to make anyone else look bad, and i'm not going to pretend that i don't own anything from china. i even have some trail gear parts on my rig that are doing their job just fine.

without saying too much more, we are doing everything possible to keep costs down so that these will be affordable. i don't want to charge you any more than you're willing to pay.

 

[baxter650]

Would you be doing the same '' ONE CASTING FITS EITHER SIDE'' like the TG units?
I would think that would also help keep the costs down.

 

[Dan Fredrickson]

Market size?

I believe the 80 axle will be much more common than the mini in the very near future.

There were quite a few made for more years than the mini's and just in normal use the mini's are pretty much used up, 25 years will make the axle sag (bend) just from normal driving. I doubt many original mini housings are still straight by now, I mean truly straight...

The 80 is stronger out of the box and straighter due to the relative newness with only 1 issue left to resolve after the steering....

 

[1000-oaks]

See the link above the photo, the Trailgear Kit Includes everything but the studs for $299.

•Knuckles (2)
•Steering Arms (2)
•Shims
Fully Loaded Six Shooter Knuckle Kit, $299

Maybe you could form some kind of partership with them, since they already have a source for everything required?

Could be huge, and not just for first-time solid-axle swaps. Make the arms high enough to fit trucks with leaf springs and I'm sure lots of guys will dump their mini-truck axles and upgrade. 80-series Longfields in a mini-truck has to be an awesome strength to weight ratio, would probably hold 40's no problem and be a whole lot lighter/better clearance than a Dana 60.

 

[ToyRoverlander]

Billy, awesome that you're doing this! I'm currently prepping a pair of 80 axles to fit to my leafsprung Land Rover and there was only one thing that stopped me from going spring over and that's the steering.It will be SUA for now, but perhaps in the future, with your kit, I might just go SOA. I've looked at Slee's steering arms but (Slee, correct me if I'm wrong here) they look to have reverse Ackerman angles. Which is not very good for a street driven vehicle.

How will your arms be in that respect?

 

[CreeperSleeper]

See the link above the photo, the Trailgear Kit Includes everything but the studs for $299.

•Knuckles (2)
•Steering Arms (2)
•Shims
Fully Loaded Six Shooter Knuckle Kit, $299

Maybe you could form some kind of partership with them, since they already have a source for everything required?

Could be huge, and not just for first-time solid-axle swaps. Make the arms high enough to fit trucks with leaf springs and I'm sure lots of guys will dump their mini-truck axles and upgrade. 80-series Longfields in a mini-truck has to be an awesome strength to weight ratio, would probably hold 40's no problem and be a whole lot lighter/better clearance than a Dana 60.

I'm pretty sure that is $299 each, not for a pair...

 

[Cruiserdrew]

I'm pretty sure that is $299 each, not for a pair...

From the TG website:


Kit Includes:

Knuckles (2)
Steering Arms (2)
Shims


I got the trail gear knuckles and the 4x4 labs high steer. It's a very nice combo. I hope this 80 knuckle is similar.

 

[1000-oaks]

Why would their site say "Knuckles (2)" and "Steering Arms (2)" if the kit only included one (1) of each?

 

[sleeoffroad]

I've looked at Slee's steering arms but (Slee, correct me if I'm wrong here) they look to have reverse Ackerman angles. Which is not very good for a street driven vehicle.

No they are not. We had them on our Blueberry solid axle 100 that is driven on the street.

 

[got cope?]

No they are not. We had them on our Blueberry solid axle 100 that is driven on the street.

How bad is it? How far off the factory spec is it? I am personally looking to run your arms on a dd sooner or later.

Arent the factory lower steering arms unmodified and you arms are built to line up with the factory TRE hole. How does that change the ackerman?

 

[sleeoffroad]

How bad is it? How far off the factory spec is it? I am personally looking to run your arms on a dd sooner or later.

Sorry, I think I expressed that wrong. The ackerman angle is correct with our arms. I meant they are NOT reverse ackerman angles. That is what happens if you try to flip the left and right arms.

Arent the factory lower steering arms unmodified and you arms are built to line up with the factory TRE hole. How does that change the ackerman?

That is correct. It does not.

 

[ToyRoverlander]

Is it so that when you keep the trackrod behind the axle, where it's supposed to be from the factory, that the Ackerman angle is as it should be. But when the trackrod gets moved to the front of the axle, using those arms, that the Ackerman angle changes?

The bit of the steering arm that's behind the axle bends inwards, the bit that's in front of the axle points straight ahead so there's zero Ackerman angle. Correct?

 

[CreeperSleeper]

From the TG website:


Kit Includes:

Knuckles (2)
Steering Arms (2)
Shims


I got the trail gear knuckles and the 4x4 labs high steer. It's a very nice combo. I hope this 80 knuckle is similar.

Why would their site say "Knuckles (2)" and "Steering Arms (2)" if the kit only included one (1) of each?

Huh... I stand corrected. I am amazed that it is that much cheaper to buy the kit then to buy them seperately.

 

[sleeoffroad]

Is it so that when you keep the trackrod behind the axle, where it's supposed to be from the factory, that the Ackerman angle is as it should be. But when the trackrod gets moved to the front of the axle, using those arms, that the Ackerman angle changes?

Not sure I am following.

 

[ToyRoverlander]

From Wikipedia:

A simple approximation to perfect Ackermann steering geometry may be generated by moving the steering pivot points inward so as to lie on a line drawn between the steering kingpins and the centre of the rear axle. The steering pivot points are joined by a rigid bar called the tie rod which can also be part of the steering mechanism, in the form of a rack and pinion for instance. With perfect Ackermann, at any angle of steering, the centre point of all of the circles traced by all wheels will lie at a common point. Note that this may be difficult to arrange in practice with simple linkages, and designers are advised to draw or analyze their steering systems over the full range of steering angles.

Now. When that trackrod is in front of the axle, with the arms pointing straight ahead (not bend inwards like in the pic above), the imaginary line between the kingpin and the track rod end would run front to back in a straight line. It would not point to the centre of the rear axle as in the first pic above.

I hope this helps, I've never been that good in translating thoughts to words.

 

[sleeoffroad]

Yes, I understand that part. Just not sure what you were asking. But I will try to explain. Does not matter if tierod is in front or behind. It matters on the angle of the arms. Our arms are done such that the ackerman angle is retained. It might not be exactly what it was, but it is not opposite of what it should be.

 

[Baja Dan]

Hey Billy hurry up and get this thing done bro we are all anxious to see them. I hope it all works out. it be real cool if a good ol boy from san diego county got this on the map. best of luck

 

[ToyRoverlander]

Our arms are done such that the ackerman angle is retained. It might not be exactly what it was, but it is not opposite of what it should be.

All good then
So the arms bend outward in front of the axle, just like the arm bends inward behind the axle?