Dual Battery Planning

[TomH]

I've been collecting parts for a dual battery setup for over a year now and I think I'm about ready for the install. I do have a couple questions though.

1. I plan on using a 150A fuse between batteries, at the second battery. The positive lead will run in the channel next to the radiator. Should I add a second fuse just past the Automatic Charging Relay (ACR) to protect the wire on that side or would that be overkill? Is 150A a reasonable choice for fuse size?
2. Any suggestions on how to get two 1/0 wires back to the rear for the inverter? I know the cable tray is there on the passenger side but I'm pretty sure two 1/0 wires won't fit (and the positive will be running in convoluted tubing). I'm thinking about routing the wire along the frame rail. Any suggestions? There wasn't much response to this thread on the same subject.
3. Anybody know the lug size at the starter?
4. Anybody have a spare lug crimper they want to loan me?

Also, I plan to run the second battery ground to the frame and the engine block (not shown on schematic).

Does anybody have any additional suggestions?

Thanks
Tom

 

[SALEH]

TomH

me 2 i am planning on dual battry after i saw my Friends (Siglo) the prof...... Experience he did his dual by these way using ACR and Fuse box with negative and switch with 380amp all would coast u less than $300 u can buy every thing from Ebay i recoomend to use ST* Blade Fuse Block With Cover - 12 Circuit witht Negative Bus and ACR 9112 (automatic charging relay).


check here

https://forum.ih8mud.com/showthread.php?t=49484&highlight=siglo

 

[Hants]

1. I plan on using a 150A fuse between batteries, at the second battery. The positive lead will run in the channel next to the radiator. Should I add a second fuse just past the Automatic Charging Relay (ACR) to protect the wire on that side or would that be overkill? Is 150A a reasonable choice for fuse size?
2. Any suggestions on how to get two 1/0 wires back to the rear for the inverter? I know the cable tray is there on the passenger side but I'm pretty sure two 1/0 wires won't fit (and the positive will be running in convoluted tubing). I'm thinking about routing the wire along the frame rail. Any suggestions? There wasn't much response to this thread on the same subject.

I'm currently acquiring the parts & tools to install dual batteries and a winch. Here are my thoughts (take 'em with a grain of salt -- no real-world experience attached):

1. Consider fusing the positive lead going across the radiator at EACH battery (more short/car-b-q protection). You want to fuse close to the batteries because they are the charge sources. Consider bumping the fuse size to 200A (starter could draw about 190; in a self-jump situation with the main battery dead, you could be pushing that or more across the ACR). A winch will change this picture -- some can draw 480A!!!

2. I don't think 2 1/0 cables will fit in the passenger side channel. Regardless, I wouldn't want welding cables running over the lips & corners to route through the cabin. Frame rail is what I would do -- primarily to ease routing for the long run and provide easy inspection.

 

[Cube Dweller]

Wow, too bad we aren't neighbors. I just did the dual battery install (very similar to Cruiserdrew's setup) and am planning to run 1/0 back to the cargo area as well for an inverter.

I used a 150A ANL fuse in between the 2nd battery and the block. I guess you could fuse the + lead, but in an accident, the positive will short to the body, the body has a #8(?) lead from the main battery to the body, so either that melts or the 150A fuse pops- I "think" it's a pretty safe way to go. I ordered most of my stuff thru Stella Maris(www.stellmar.com). No comments on the load for winching or starting, other than the HellRoaring BIC is rated to 300A intermittent. Both DCLee and CruiserDrew have winches and run the HellRoaring on their rigs, no issues.

As far as running the cable, I have the same debate, inside or out. I didn't see any clean routes for the cable on top of the frame rail. Plus, I'm not too inclined to drill holes in the frame to secure the cable. I plan to expose the recess in the cabin, inspect the recess and go from there. Welding cable is pretty flexible and has durable insulation. I'm guessing any sharp corners can be mitigated w/ hose or other. I plan to run flex loom as well.

Like I posted in the poll thread, I plan to run a 1/0 ground from the main battery to the frame, then run a ground from the inverter to the frame, probably thru the existing grommit for the trailer harness.

 

[tech_dog]

I went with a 400 amp fuse, and keep a 500 amp in the glovebox. This allows me to pull the full load of the winch through the battery interconnect if I need to.

I'll add that of all the mods I've done to date, doing the dual battery was the most fun. Good luck.

 

[Grench]

Be sure to check out the FAQ.

https://forum.ih8mud.com/showthread.php?t=104630

I did a bit different setup with manual switching so that I could pull either or both batteries through the winch at full winch loads. OO cables from winch to batteries. If I were to do it again I think I'd just use 2ga and take the current losses. I went with 300amp fuses on each battery. The cables have enough play in them to bypass the fuse if I get desperate. I also have 2 spares onboard.

The big tritium dial manual switches necesitate running both batteries in parallel most of the time or switching back and forth every week or two to keep both charged. I'm not using an electronic isolator because I couldn't find one that could handle a continuous 400 amp load that the winch is capable of pulling.

I was thinking about running something MUCH lighter duty to the rear. A refrigerator, subwoofer and a compressor... 6ga would actually be adequate if I understand it right. I plan to keep the inverter under the hood and run AC back as another run. AC transmits with less loss, so I think there may be an advantage to having the inverter up front with the batteries. I have another fuse block and a 50 amp fuse for the rear setup (planned).

I found that relocating the truck's old connections to the back side of the stock battery tray to be one of my better mods. It cut down significantly on the clutter on top of the battery.

YMMV

 

[TomH]

TomH

me 2 i am planning on dual battry after i saw my Friends (Siglo) the prof...... Experience he did his dual by these way using ACR and Fuse box with negative and switch with 380amp all would coast u less than $300 u can buy every thing from Ebay i recoomend to use ST* Blade Fuse Block With Cover - 12 Circuit witht Negative Bus and ACR 9112 (automatic charging relay).


check here

https://forum.ih8mud.com/showthread.php?t=49484&highlight=siglo

Saleh

I'm planning on using the Blue Sea 9112 ACR but won't be doing a fues block at this time. I wish I could do this for under $300 but I'm going to be a little north of $1K by the time I'm finished.

Tom

 

[TomH]

I'm currently acquiring the parts & tools to install dual batteries and a winch. Here are my thoughts (take 'em with a grain of salt -- no real-world experience attached):

1. Consider fusing the positive lead going across the radiator at EACH battery (more short/car-b-q protection). You want to fuse close to the batteries because they are the charge sources. Consider bumping the fuse size to 200A (starter could draw about 190; in a self-jump situation with the main battery dead, you could be pushing that or more across the ACR). A winch will change this picture -- some can draw 480A!!!

2. I don't think 2 1/0 cables will fit in the passenger side channel. Regardless, I wouldn't want welding cables running over the lips & corners to route through the cabin. Frame rail is what I would do -- primarily to ease routing for the long run and provide easy inspection.

Hants

Thanks for the advice. I've been debating using a fuse at each battery and think I'll just go ahead and do it. It's a small cost overall. I still haven't decided what to do with the cable routing to the back - I haven't actually investigated a path outside the truck yet. I agree that 2 1/0 wires won't fit the cable tray.

Tom

 

[TomH]

Wow, too bad we aren't neighbors. I just did the dual battery install (very similar to Cruiserdrew's setup) and am planning to run 1/0 back to the cargo area as well for an inverter.

I used a 150A ANL fuse in between the 2nd battery and the block. I guess you could fuse the + lead, but in an accident, the positive will short to the body, the body has a #8(?) lead from the main battery to the body, so either that melts or the 150A fuse pops- I "think" it's a pretty safe way to go. I ordered most of my stuff thru Stella Maris(www.stellmar.com). No comments on the load for winching or starting, other than the HellRoaring BIC is rated to 300A intermittent. Both DCLee and CruiserDrew have winches and run the HellRoaring on their rigs, no issues.

As far as running the cable, I have the same debate, inside or out. I didn't see any clean routes for the cable on top of the frame rail. Plus, I'm not too inclined to drill holes in the frame to secure the cable. I plan to expose the recess in the cabin, inspect the recess and go from there. Welding cable is pretty flexible and has durable insulation. I'm guessing any sharp corners can be mitigated w/ hose or other. I plan to run flex loom as well.

Like I posted in the poll thread, I plan to run a 1/0 ground from the main battery to the frame, then run a ground from the inverter to the frame, probably thru the existing grommit for the trailer harness.

Cube Dweller

I think I am going to stick with positive fusing on the batteries. Is there any reason you chose an ANL style fuse over a Mega style fuse. I've been a little confused on the difference between the two.

I've been collecting parts from various sources but am fortunate to live in Seattle where there is Fisheries Supply about a mile from my house as well as a couple West Marine's and SeaMar that aren't much farther. Fisheries supply is pretty well stocked and seems to have the best prices.

If you come up with a good solution on the cable routing, post it up. I'm still undecided.

Tom

 

[TomH]

I went with a 400 amp fuse, and keep a 500 amp in the glovebox. This allows me to pull the full load of the winch through the battery interconnect if I need to.

I'll add that of all the mods I've done to date, doing the dual battery was the most fun. Good luck.

tech_dog

Right now I'm thinking about going with 200 amp fuses and maybe a higher amp spare. I don't see a getting a winch anytime in the near future so the highest loads should be coming from the starter. One of the nice things about doing the dual batteries is the flexibility of the system. It's not hard to make changes to match future needs.

Tom

 

[TomH]

Be sure to check out the FAQ.

https://forum.ih8mud.com/showthread.php?t=104630

I did a bit different setup with manual switching so that I could pull either or both batteries through the winch at full winch loads. OO cables from winch to batteries. If I were to do it again I think I'd just use 2ga and take the current losses. I went with 300amp fuses on each battery. The cables have enough play in them to bypass the fuse if I get desperate. I also have 2 spares onboard.

The big tritium dial manual switches necesitate running both batteries in parallel most of the time or switching back and forth every week or two to keep both charged. I'm not using an electronic isolator because I couldn't find one that could handle a continuous 400 amp load that the winch is capable of pulling.

I was thinking about running something MUCH lighter duty to the rear. A refrigerator, subwoofer and a compressor... 6ga would actually be adequate if I understand it right. I plan to keep the inverter under the hood and run AC back as another run. AC transmits with less loss, so I think there may be an advantage to having the inverter up front with the batteries. I have another fuse block and a 50 amp fuse for the rear setup (planned).

I found that relocating the truck's old connections to the back side of the stock battery tray to be one of my better mods. It cut down significantly on the clutter on top of the battery.

YMMV

Thanks for the input. I've been planning this mod for over a year now (I'm a little slow) so I've probably read every dual battery thread on Mud at least five times. It would probably be better to just buy everything all at once and then do the install.

I have considered mounting the inverter in a different location but I just can't think of any better options. The under hood temps scare me with an inverter that states a 32 to 105F operating range and further states the lower end of that range is preferred. Do you have a spot under the hood selected for the inverter?

I am considering doing something like you did to move all the stock wires off the top of the battery.

Tom

 

[Grench]

I was considering putting the inverter between the DS headlight and battery. I am debating between the inverter or moving the M12K solenoid box there. I want to keep it as close as possible to that + post stud. I'm more worried about these cheapo inverters with fans & stuff getting wet. How do I seal it and get good airflow? I haven't figured that out yet. I may end up giving up and putting it inside the truck. Maybe I'll put it where the rear heat used to run and wire the heater switch to the inverter & keep the heater fan.... That might actually be kind of cool.

I moved the wire placements back using a 5/16" stud. Use 1/4" instead so the stock wire lugs fit. I had to ream mine out just a bit in order to get them to fit. I got them from www.defender.com. Their prices are a bit better than West Marine and I pay shipping with either option as nobody in their right mind puts an ocean marine supply store in Nebraska.

 

[Cube Dweller]

Cube Dweller

I think I am going to stick with positive fusing on the batteries. Is there any reason you chose an ANL style fuse over a Mega style fuse. I've been a little confused on the difference between the two.

I've been collecting parts from various sources but am fortunate to live in Seattle where there is Fisheries Supply about a mile from my house as well as a couple West Marine's and SeaMar that aren't much farther. Fisheries supply is pretty well stocked and seems to have the best prices.

If you come up with a good solution on the cable routing, post it up. I'm still undecided.

Tom

I went w/ ANL since it was $10 at Stella Maris w/ a fuse, boots, etc. Replacement fuses were ~$2.50 and they had fuse choices up to 350A I think. Plus the local custom audio shop stocks ANL fuses so I have a local source if need be. To me, West Marine seemed very pricy and my local store had a poor selection.

I plan to run the cable this weekend so I'll report back!

 

[Cube Dweller]

Check out the Stellmar link too- their website is a bit of a challenge to navigate but they have great pictures showing each of their components. I'm pleased with the quality of the components. I ended up placing my order as a group buy for 3 of us, plus I bought enough to rewire the single battery in my 4Runner.

On the main battery I was concerned w/ cutting the main zip tip that secures the cable to the driver fender well. It seems to provide some strain relief for the heavy cables. So I made 3" extensions for the factory cables to connect to the military style terminals I used on the Optima. I'll try and get some pictures and do a write up.

 

[Cube Dweller]

Update until I create my own install thread:

I ran the 1/0 + cable along the passenger fender well, inside the engine compartment, thru a hole in the grommit, into the well along the door sill and into the cavity in the cargo area. One 1/0 awg cable barely fits in the well/channel to the back.

For a ground cable I ran a 1/0 from the main battery to the frame, using the same bolt that holds the brakeline bracket. It's just forward of the left front tire, under the flap. In the rear I ran another 1/0 cable through the same grommit the rear light harness runs through and bolted it to the frame as well. I need to measure the resistance, but they were both clean connections.