Cracked Birfield

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Victor, didn't mean to imply you weren't using your truck, just that as the way you've built your truck you are probably outside of the original design specs Toyota was using when designing their birfield. Since they tend to overbuild, maybe that's why you don't have any problems. Still, with your setup I personally think you are gambling a bit on when and where one will go and from experience it's not pretty - or cheap!
Mike
 
clownmidget said:
Victor, didn't mean to imply you weren't using your truck, just that as the way you've built your truck you are probably outside of the original design specs Toyota was using when designing their birfield. Since they tend to overbuild, maybe that's why you don't have any problems. Still, with your setup I personally think you are gambling a bit on when and where one will go and from experience it's not pretty - or cheap!
Mike
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Mike, I agree in a sense I am gambling thats why I always keep a spare birf in the back just in case-picked it up at a junk yard real cheap. I figure there is no sense in tempting faith. :D
 
The chromo longs are the way to go. I agree with the posts that OEM are fine for hard wheeling on 33s. But if you wheel hard you'll eventually want to step up to bigger tires and harder trails. At that point, the added comfort that the Longfields provide is well worth the hastle of pressing on the ABS ring or just going without it (as I am doing.) If you compare a stock Birf with one from Longfield side by side you won't hesitate to chose the Longfield.

:beer:

Curran
 
Thanks everyone I have ordered the the Longfields just the Birfs. I will save the good one for a spare on the trail. They will be here tomorrow.

Our truck gets driven a lot everyday both on and off-road as we live in the hills and it is a daily driver. It is very heavy over 7.000lbs and I am not afraid to see what it can do sometimes I have pushed it to its limits. But I always drive very slow and I'm only running 33s. Most say that the OEMs are good for 285s but the fact is it failed with 285s. And yes I have tested it pretty good run many class 2 to 4 short trails and or obstacles. And a couple of months ago I climbed Moab type very steep hill and short trail that wiped the smerk off of a couple of modified heepers faces. They were totaly laughing at me probably thinging that soccer mom SUV cant go up there. "where locked up front and rear" they said with that smerk. My daughter said "dad if thoughs jeeps can do it, we can. Its a LandCruiser." So up we went and did not slip a bit. Both jeeps strugled and one of them had new ARBs and new tires aired down. HA HA.
 
Pictures Sam, Pictures....
:)

Alvaro
 
Alvaro, Dennis is doing the job while were at work so I don't think pics of that are to promising. We are having him save the busted parts.
Teresa
 
NorCalSam said:
But I always drive very slow and I'm only running 33s. Most say that the OEMs are good for 285s but the fact is it failed with 285s. And yes I have tested it pretty good run many class 2 to 4 short trails and or obstacles. .
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It will be interesting to see what the conditions are inside the knuckle. If there is a lack of grease or if it is soupy thin this may have lead to the birfield failure. You mentioned it already made noise under certain turns.
 
Tapage said:
Teresa did you ordered the knocle rebuild parts . ?
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I have forwarded all of your great suggestions but now it is sort of out of my hands. The longs are all that have been ordered. However, I hate to be a nagging wife but I keep nagging. I just want my truck fixed right and want to take advantage of everything being torn apart and fix or rebuild at that time. But I've said what I can say. Will let you know the outcome.
Teresa
 
Teresa .. don't worry, I'm sure that your TLC willbe fine soon .. nagging .. ? sometimes is one way to get all things that you want .. ! :D
 
landtank said:
hopefully your significant other is different, but this is a sure fire way for my wife to get a marginal job out of me. I do my best work when it's on my schedule and at my pace.
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My previous comment was in regards to the knuckles. No parts ordered at this point so my intention on nagging comment was that I have asked and reminded and asked and now I am done because I found that I was nagging about it. I agree, if you want the job done properly and efficiently, there is a point where you just be quiet. :doh:
Teresa
 
NorCalSam said:
We bought it at 146,000 It had just had a tune-up . I changed all the fuilds to syn. I have done a tune -up 164,000 I rebuilt the front brake calipers and repacked all the bearings. It was not worn .....It cracked.
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When were the birfields repacked. At 164,000 miles there should have been 1 or 2 repacks to keep everything well lubed and in top condition. If not, then you have the reason it cracked. See the pics of Klunky Kris' birfield to see the effects of neglected maintenance.

-B-
 
Beowulf said:
When were the birfields repacked. At 164,000 miles there should have been 1 or 2 repacks to keep everything well lubed and in top condition. If not, then you have the reason it cracked. See the pics of Klunky Kris' birfield to see the effects of neglected maintenance.

-B-
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Beo,
Since weve had the rig they have not been repacked. Who knows what the previous owners had done with it. Front end done now. The birfield bell was actually intact, only had some minor scarring on the inside, however the cage was completely grenaded however intact until pulled it out a which time it fell apart. Greese definately broke down and very much like used motor oil with small metal granules throughout. Everyone has their opinions, Dennis as well as other techs I have talked to feel that they will break regardless of the condition of the grease. However I think this definately could have contributed to overheating, along with the weight of the vehicle increased the stress on these parts. According to Dennis (our tech) the splines, knuckles, and seals were in good shape. We decided not to rebuild the origional birfs, and decided to install the new longs beings everything was torn apart and make the truck more strong. After all of everybodies comments and seeing the condition of the grease (oil) were going to have him repack the rear tommorow. Included some pics of the grenaded cage.
cage1.webp
cage2.webp
 
For those of you who aren't mechanics, and especially for people like my wife Teresa who has for the last 1 1/2 months asked me, "what is a birf", "people keep talking about birf's and rebuilding them", thought we'd post up a pic of an intact cage from an issue of 4wd toyota owner magazine, featuring bobby long. This shows what a cage should look like.
cage3.webp
 
NorCalSam said:
Greese definately broke down and very much like used motor oil with small metal granules throughout.
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You are correct, that birfield broke because it did not have proper lubrication.

-B-
 
Beowulf,

I hope you don't take me the wrong way. I respect your opinion, however, I am a little perplexed. I disagree with your statment that the birfield broke because it did not have proper lubrication. I never said that, and I don't think that any one thing is the sole cause of anything. This complicated fact demonstrated throughout history, but that is a philosophical discution that we can have on another day the another thread. First of all I am not one to eglect preventive maintanace of anything. What has me thinking is this; Most of the trucks that I have own with the exception of a ford truck that was only temporary I have wheeled and driven for over 300,000 and the CV joints in the front went but never ther rear axle. This includes many other tucks of friends and family never have I seen or heard of anyone doing prevenative manatince on the axle parts and all trucks have gone 200,000 to while over 300,000 miles. Also there is no mention of this service in the owners manuals that I have see. And the first time that I hear of this is on the forum. And I had a Nissan which I found out the hard way does not have that same build quality of a toyota not to mention a LandCruiser. The Nissan metal is much weaker that the toyot stuff. Based off this experiance I did not really think that I needed to do this anytime soon.

Another thing is and this comes from a finish carpenter that get crap all that time because I am so anal. Some of you guys are unrealistcal and down right anal about your truck maintenance. Some guys probably city slickers or people that have crusiers for fun and somthing else for daily driving talk about how they are going to change all there diff fluids before and after a little 300 mile trip to the sand or they need to change them and repack there bearings because they made a large pudle crossing etc.


If I followed this I would have to do these things almost every day.

I am not trying to be an ass, just realistic and am quite shocked that this part broke with 180,000 miles on it. I think I could safely say its had a problem since we got it but nobody could identify it for us., because it was to intermittent.

I also still wonder why the front locker cable was missing when we bought it. Why would that have been removed.? The locker worked fine when we installed it.
 
NorCalSam said:
Greese definately broke down and very much like used motor oil with small metal granules throughout. [ ... ] However I think this definately could have contributed to overheating, along with the weight of the vehicle increased the stress on these parts.
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This was your statement that I was agreeing with. The birfield needs moly grease. Yours had a diff oil + grease mixture which is a classic case of a knuckle in dire need of a repack. You've got 164k miles and were wheeling it with locked axles and the birf didn't have proper lubrication. I'm not at all surprised that it grenaded.

Don't take it personally. You were speculating on why it broke and I was giving you my opinion. It's just one guy's opinion and no big deal.

:cheers:

-B-
 
The birfields are not strong enough to take the full torque that can be produced by the drivetrain. They are especially stressed when steering is turned to the stops. Locked front axle is worst case, as it is then possible that all driveline torque can be directed through a single birfield. No doubt worn birfields break easier than new, but new are not immune.

Sam, your cage could have been damaged when you bought your
truck; it also could have been fine until you took your snow run. Driving in the snow, stuck, axle locked up, turning wheels from side to side, it is possible that your front wheel momentarily got good traction, and the torque load that resulted is what did it in.

From a lubrication standpoint, I would think as long as the birfs are lubed by either grease or gear oil, they will be ok from that standpoint.
 
Beowulf said:
This was your statement that I was agreeing with. The birfield needs moly grease. Yours had a diff oil + grease mixture which is a classic case of a knuckle in dire need of a repack. You've got 164k miles and were wheeling it with locked axles and the birf didn't have proper lubrication. I'm not at all surprised that it grenaded.

Don't take it personally. You were speculating on why it broke and I was giving you my opinion. It's just one guy's opinion and no big deal.

:cheers:

Beo- I think it's obvious that the break down in grease has diminished the quality of lubrication ultimately leading to the destruction of the inner-cage of the birfield. I think the point from sam was that this was not the sole cause, but obviously a large contributory factor. Moreso, we have owned other 4x4 vehicles with double the mileage and never have done maintenance on these parts and never had problems. We're probable just lucky, or maybe they would have never broke considering they didn't weigh close to what the 80 weighs, and they weren't locked. I think all of the factors lead to the problem (grease, weight, wheeling, lockers, etc...) Not just grease.
Teresa
:princess: LOL
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