12H-T clutch, etc...

[DanS HJ-45]

Just checking here. I see conflicting answers both from people I trust on this question when I search, so I'll ask it directly:

Does an HJ-61 (12H-T) use the same clutch as an FJ-60 (2F)?

I know the transmission has the same input shaft (10 spline), and the 12H-T in question is coming from a 5 speed HJ-61, going into a 5 speed FJ-60. In this case, the FJ-60 only has about 2000 miles on the H55f, including a new clutch at that time, so I'd love to reuse it if possible. But if they are different clutches, it's a dumb question anyway and I'll be ordering one anyhow.

I will, naturally, be resurfacing the 12H-T flywheel when we do the swap.

Other mostly unrelated questions:

• Does the boosted clutch master cylinder from the HJ-61 bolt up to the firewall of the FJ-60? Seems excessively luxurious not to use it, if it bolts right up...
• Throwout bearing: is it different between the 12H-T and the 2F? Since it goes over the input shaft, I'm guessing that they are the same, but would otherwise get a new one on order.
• Anything other than Rear Main Seal, pilot bearing, and front main seal to replace on the 12H-T while it's out? All indications are that it's a VERY healthy engine, and we weren't planning on doing much other than that stuff, and cleaning it up to install it in the 60.

Dan

 

[Henry James the 47th]

Does an HJ-61 (12H-T) use the same clutch as an FJ-60 (2F)?

Well, as far as Toyota is concerned, there are a few different clutches used with FJ/HJ engines, however it so happens that clutch sub assembly part number 31201-69026 works for both models, so the answer to your question appears to be, unequivocally, yes.

 

[DanS HJ-45]

Well, as far as Toyota is concerned, there are a few different clutches used with FJ/HJ engines, however it so happens that clutch sub assembly part number 31201-69026 works for both models, so the answer to your question appears to be, unequivocally, yes.

That's not just the clutch disc, right? That's for the whole shebang?

I see it listed as "Clutch and Release Fork"

Dan

 

[Dieseler]

What I find puzzling when I search this out....US market FJ did not offer the 5 spd where the HJ61 has the 5spd as standard equipment.
So when I search through the EPC I get a part number for a clutch for a 4 spd fj60 and no reference to a 5 spd which is an all together different number than that for a HJ61 5 spd clutch.
When I search the EPC for the FJ 62 JDM which has the 5spd standard equipment it is also a completely different number from the HJ61 so I am not sure where the cross referencing is from and is this a cross referrence in Toyota's EPC and not another source
Another thing puzzling is the JDM FJ 62 had a 3F motor 5spd as far back as 1984 and the FJ60 2F was from 81-84 with only the 4spd.

 

[Wheelingnoob]

I used a FJ60 clutch in a HJ60 (2H H55trans) bolted up and works great. Got 10k kms on it now no issues so far. Handles a 2H with a turbo at 12psi.

 

[DanS HJ-45]

What I find puzzling when I search this out....US market FJ did not offer the 5 spd where the HJ61 has the 5spd as standard equipment.
So when I search through the EPC I get a part number for a clutch for a 4 spd fj60 and no reference to a 5 spd which is an all together different number than that for a HJ61 5 spd clutch.
When I search the EPC for the FJ 62 JDM which has the 5spd standard equipment it is also a completely different number from the HJ61 so I am not sure where the cross referencing is from and is this a cross referrence in Toyota's EPC and not another source
Another thing puzzling is the JDM FJ 62 had a 3F motor 5spd as far back as 1984 and the FJ60 2F was from 81-84 with only the 4spd.

Glad it's not just me then.

This is an '87 FJ-60 that we installed the H55f into, but then none of that helps figure out what on earth Toyota is doing with all these different clutches.

I used a FJ60 clutch in a HJ60 (2H H55trans) bolted up and works great. Got 10k kms on it now no issues so far. Handles a 2H with a turbo at 12psi.

Very good. So at least it's worked for someone.

Worse comes to worse, we'll pull the engine and transmission apart, and immediately see if the clutch will work, and make a real quick order for a "correct" one if need be, I guess.

Dan

 

[OGBeno]

Check your email Dan.

 

[Henry James the 47th]

That's not just the clutch disc, right? That's for the whole shebang?

I see it listed as "Clutch and Release Fork"

Dan

Yes, that's for the whole shebang. Curiously though, if you go through the parts from the same diagrams listing the clutch sub-assembly 31201-69026 for both HJ60 and FJ60, and cross ref. the clutch discs, you get two different part numbers:

FJ60: 31250-60020
HJ60: 31250-60030

Just one digit apart so they are likely quite similar.

So, it would seem that while the same clutch sub assembly can be used, the clutch discs are slightly different. How different they are or how interchangeable they are is unknown to me.

 

[Dieseler]

DanS can you post up some pics of the HJ61 Clutch and pressure plate along with the fly wheel and also a comparison pic of the 60 clutch I am very curious if they are the same ....I am feeling sceptical on this but we all need to know especially me since I have both FJ62 and HJ61 with 5 spds and one needs a clutch soon.
I know the HJ60 and HJ61 share many parts it is just the sharing of the 60 and 62 part I need comfirmation on

 

[DanS HJ-45]

So, it would seem that while the same clutch sub assembly can be used, the clutch discs are slightly different. How different they are or how interchangeable they are is unknown to me.

DanS can you post up some pics of the HJ61 Clutch and pressure plate along with the fly wheel and also a comparison pic of the 60 clutch I am very curious if they are the same ....

One way to find out!

I'll be sure to take pics once we separate the two units to try and get a better answer for everyone.

Dan

 

[DanS HJ-45]

I got the clutches out of both the HJ-61, and the FJ-60 to compare...

Other mostly unrelated questions:

• Does the boosted clutch master cylinder from the HJ-61 bolt up to the firewall of the FJ-60? Seems excessively luxurious not to use it, if it bolts right up... Not really. You would have to grind the boosted clutch master bracket to clear the rib on the firewall that is above the clutch master. Also, would need a spacer on the top bolt to give a level mounting surface. Lastly, new clutch lines would need to be fabricated.
• Throwout bearing: is it different between the 12H-T and the 2F? Since it goes over the input shaft, I'm guessing that they are the same, but would otherwise get a new one on order.YES, the Throwout bearing is the same on the 12HT and 2F. The Koyo number on the bearing is the same, and everything fits together nicely.
  

DanS can you post up some pics of the HJ61 Clutch and pressure plate along with the fly wheel and also a comparison pic of the 60 clutch I am very curious if they are the same ...

That is the clutch from the 2F bolted directly to the 12HT flywheel. Fits perfectly. That is the Toyota clutch we bought new when we installed the H55f in the FJ-60 maybe 2000 miles ago. I literally removed it from the 2F, and walked it right over to the 12HT flywheel to see if it mated up.

The comparison pics for me wouldn't be too useful, because the 12HT had a non-Toyota clutch in it, but for all intents and purposes it's the same.

Dan

 

[Dieseler]

Can you tell me if the depth of the pressure plate is the same.
I am experiecing a problem with my 89 FJ62 setup when I pulled the inspection cover I discovered that the clutch lever rests up against the bearing case on the trans and there is zero adjustment to back off the clutch.
I am trying to sort out why this is like this and wondering if it may have the 12ht clutch in it or possibly throw out bearing.
Also are the throw out bearings for both the same depth.

 

[DanS HJ-45]

Yes. I can measure that stuff for you.

Will take a couple weeks, but no sweat.

But, for sure the throwout bearing depth is the same. It is the same from the aftermarket throwout bearing that was in the half cut, and the removed 2F throwout bearing, and the new throwout bearing in the box from Toyota.

Dan

 

[DanS HJ-45]

Just following up on this a bit more...

In a nutshell, the pressure plates are the same depth.

I measured both, and the difference in height was probably accounted for by wear on the clutch fingers on the more used pressure plate. The difference between the two was 0.011" which I believe is more due to wear than a difference in design.

Dan

 

[Dieseler]

Thanks Dan ...hmmmm I am still stumped why my fork is resting on the trans bearing cover either way I have a new clutch ordered after an hour at the parts counter running preceding numbers through the data bank till we came up with the one I need.

 

[cholznag]

I am working on a similar problem that you are having-I have an fj62 that I converted to a manual H55 transmission with 10 tapered splines (not square), and put a 6.2 turbo diesel in. I am replacing the Toyota clutch after about 50k because it slips. This clutch plate and pressure plate looks perfect, hardly even worn, but it slips. It may be because the clutch fork is bottoming out on the tranny before releasing the pressure plate diaghram springs--just like your picture shows. I am getting a Centerforce 1 clutch kit to put in it, thinking that maybe the engine is overpowering the clutch. But the Centerforce clutch has 10 splines with a square profile (also like your picture shows I think???). I was told by Man-a-Fre that it will fit the tapered input shaft and that they have never had a problem with the spline shapes being different. The power being transferred through the root of the spline is apparently okay according to the tech guy. Have you done that and had good results? It seems like I would get a burr on the input shaft or clutch hub.no longer slide freely and basically fail? Any comments are welcome, as I do not want to have to tear the tranny out again--
Thanks-Carlos

 

[ozwallaby]

I am working on a similar problem that you are having-I have an fj62 that I converted to a manual H55 transmission with 10 tapered splines (not square), and put a 6.2 turbo diesel in. I am replacing the Toyota clutch after about 50k because it slips. This clutch plate and pressure plate looks perfect, hardly even worn, but it slips. It may be because the clutch fork is bottoming out on the tranny before releasing the pressure plate diaghram springs--just like your picture shows. I am getting a Centerforce 1 clutch kit to put in it, thinking that maybe the engine is overpowering the clutch. But the Centerforce clutch has 10 splines with a square profile (also like your picture shows I think???). I was told by Man-a-Fre that it will fit the tapered input shaft and that they have never had a problem with the spline shapes being different. The power being transferred through the root of the spline is apparently okay according to the tech guy. Have you done that and had good results? It seems like I would get a burr on the input shaft or clutch hub.no longer slide freely and basically fail? Any comments are welcome, as I do not want to have to tear the tranny out again--
Thanks-Carlos

I wouldn't think the tapered splined shaft in the square splined clutch would be good for wear as you suggest... the driving force being concentrated at the root of the input shaft splines and not spread over the full faces of the splines would surely cause premature wear/failure.....

 

[cholznag]

It was suggested to machine the exterior flywheel step back further. Maybe by 20/1000 (twice what is recommended? That would place the pressure plate closer to the clutch disk, and keep the tranny in the same location. That would mean the diaghram springs would put less (or ideally no) force on the throwout bearing/clutch yoke, which may be my problem as well as Dan HJ-45's.

 

[HueyDriver]

Reviving an old thread here, but wondering if anyone has put in the Aisin CKT-032 clutch kit (for fj60) in a manual hj61 with h55?

 

[roma042987]

Reviving an old thread here, but wondering if anyone has put in the Aisin CKT-032 clutch kit (for fj60) in a manual hj61 with h55?

I did