Torque converter rebuild/replacement

[Steep n deep]

I have taken my truck to a local mechanic to do some work that I was hoping was going to get the torque converter to lock up again but to no avail. It hasn't been locking up for a while now. They have since told me that I need to get the torque converter rebuilt as it is slipping.

I called a transmission shop, they said about $1700 for the rebuild. I have found on the link below a new TC for about $200- there are 3 listed (TC-TO34, TC-TO46, TC-TO50). Any ideas which one I would buy. I have a 92 HDJ81 with a A442F transmission. I think it should be TO34 or To46- the only difference on those two is the pilot size. Ideas on which one would be best for my truck or does the pilot size even matter?

http://www.makcotransmissionparts.com/A440.html

There could be other issues with the transmission but I am unsure of those at this point in time. If I was just going to replace the TC would I have to buy any other parts to facilitate this replacement?

Also, would I be alright just buying that torque converter and having it replace the old one or does it or should it be modified so it doesn't break again? If I can buy the parts without having them rebuild the TC I can save a lot of time I figure, as they just replace it instead of taking it out sending it to be rebuilt and then installing it, which would also save me money. Also someone said to look into a kevlar clutch which will make the TC very strong. Anyone have experience with this?

Another thought, should I go manual? Is that even a possibility? How much would that cost?

Cheers.

 

[Dieseler]

have you tried ATEBI in Vancouver I think that is their name they do Quality work from the word on the street the guys over in the Clubhouse section under Coastal Cruisers that probably can stear you right.
A few shops locally.
EBI
RADDS
G&S

 

[wrongway around]

Hey you never told me it wasn't going into overdrive ,that's a different story . I'd say take it to Benz for a flow test.or to lees transmissions on Hastings if its closer. Benz is land cruiser specialty though. If you don't have look up after cable adjustment with a proper idle. You might get lucky with just a tc . I would think the full hydro tc is the bigger pilot though. I'll call tcs for you on cost and turn around,it would be a lot cheaper than I said if their not changing the stall or reinforcing the fins. Still they do the heavy setup for stock power. Wheelingnoob might be able to help you out with your wows too. I don't think he'd mind helping a young cruiser guy; out like yourself. There will be a wealth of info to be had at cruiser days this weekend too.

 

[Wheelingnoob]

As wrongway round said there are a few options. Benz is a great source for rebuilding Toyota transmissions. It maybe the converter, there is a clutch surface in there that can wear out (lockup clutch). There is another possibility as well, there are bushings in the pump that seal on the converter to supply pressure to the lock up clutch. If those bushings are worn out the converter will not lock since the pressure on the lock up circuit is bleed off not locking the converter. The way to check the bushings is to grab the pilot of the trans and see if there is play. Unfortunately you need to have the trans out to do this.

Depending on your downtime i know of a place that can rebuild the converter for a reasonable price. Not sure that is your problem though, hard to know 100% with out getting into it.

ATEB locally is highly respected but do not think they do transmissions.

 

[Steep n deep]

Hey you never told me it wasn't going into overdrive ,that's a different story . I'd say take it to Benz for a flow test.or to lees transmissions on Hastings if its closer. Benz is land cruiser specialty though. If you don't have look up after cable adjustment with a proper idle. You might get lucky with just a tc . I would think the full hydro tc is the bigger pilot though. I'll call tcs for you on cost and turn around,it would be a lot cheaper than I said if their not changing the stall or reinforcing the fins. Still they do the heavy setup for stock power. Wheelingnoob might be able to help you out with your wows too. I don't think he'd mind helping a young cruiser guy; out like yourself. There will be a wealth of info to be had at cruiser days this weekend too.

I thought we did discuss it not going into overdrive/torque converter not locking up. Thats what alerted me to this whole problem- one day it just stopped going into overdrive. The burnt fluid and shavings in there were obviously a problem. Will the flow test be able to diagnose the problem conclusively? Let me know what TCS says. I can't got to cruiser days, got a wedding.

 

[Steep n deep]

As wrongway round said there are a few options. Benz is a great source for rebuilding Toyota transmissions. It maybe the converter, there is a clutch surface in there that can wear out (lockup clutch). There is another possibility as well, there are bushings in the pump that seal on the converter to supply pressure to the lock up clutch. If those bushings are worn out the converter will not lock since the pressure on the lock up circuit is bleed off not locking the converter. The way to check the bushings is to grab the pilot of the trans and see if there is play. Unfortunately you need to have the trans out to do this.

Depending on your downtime i know of a place that can rebuild the converter for a reasonable price. Not sure that is your problem though, hard to know 100% with out getting into it.

ATEB locally is highly respected but do not think they do transmissions.

I have been working with ATEB and you are right they don't do transmissions.

I would be interested to know the name of the other local place you are referring to. Do they just rebuild or do they instal it also?

It is to my understanding that TC problems are very hard to diagnose as so many other parts of the engine work with it. If I can rule out other potential problems without pulling the tranny than I think I should do that first. But if it is clear that it is the TC or the bushings then that doesn't leave too many options.

Do you think there is any risk or further damage that could be done if I decide to leave it for the time being?

 

[wrongway around]

No lockup= heat. = burning glazing the rest of the tyranny. Sorry I bad I thought your shifting was just screwed up because of the inability to adjust properly do to a bad acsd , high idle issue. I'll call you in a bit.

 

[Wheelingnoob]

I have been working with ATEB and you are right they don't do transmissions.

I would be interested to know the name of the other local place you are referring to. Do they just rebuild or do they instal it also?

It is to my understanding that TC problems are very hard to diagnose as so many other parts of the engine work with it. If I can rule out other potential problems without pulling the tranny than I think I should do that first. But if it is clear that it is the TC or the bushings then that doesn't leave too many options.

Do you think there is any risk or further damage that could be done if I decide to leave it for the time being?

Sorry to place I have used is not local, they are in AZ. The cost of a lower stall, HD lock-up and reinforced fins with all new bearings was Sub $200. But you would need to remove and send to them (about $30 each way) with a 1 day turn around.

I do not know of a way to diagnose it any further with out dropping the trans and starting to dig around to see where the issue is. It sounds like you had quite a bit of contaminants in the fluid as well? Lock up issues are very hard to nail down there is a lot of variables and systems involved.

I would not be driving it any further at the risk of truly messing something up, a converter that does not lock and releases metal contaminants into the fluid has the potential to lead to a costly rebuild if driven.

Also if it does turn out that the trans needs ot be rebuild make sure the converter gets done as well. I have head of some horror stories from guys just rebuilding the trans and leaving the converter only to wipe out the trans again because of it.

 

[Steep n deep]

Sorry to place I have used is not local, they are in AZ. The cost of a lower stall, HD lock-up and reinforced fins with all new bearings was Sub $200. But you would need to remove and send to them (about $30 each way) with a 1 day turn around.

Alright thanks for the info. Looks like I need to get on this repair than. Is it necessary to get the TC rebuilt. I posted a link that has new ones for about $200 also. This would greatly reduce time and transit. I assume the new one doesn't have the lower stall, HD lockup nor reinforced fins and thats why you suggest a rebuild instead of a new one?

 

[Wheelingnoob]

Alright thanks for the info. Looks like I need to get on this repair than. Is it necessary to get the TC rebuilt. I posted a link that has new ones for about $200 also. This would greatly reduce time and transit. I assume the new one doesn't have the lower stall, HD lockup nor reinforced fins and thats why you suggest a rebuild instead of a new one?

If you where to get one from them I would wait to get yours out and measure it first so you get the right one the first time. Having said that have you called TCS (local) to see what they want to rebuild yours?

 

[Steep n deep]

If you where to get one from them I would wait to get yours out and measure it first so you get the right one the first time. Having said that have you called TCS (local) to see what they want to rebuild yours?

No I have not spoken to TCS yet, I have just spoken with Benz who said about $1700 for the rebuild and I believe they use TCS he said to rebuild the converter and then they will install it. About a 3 day job he said to pull it, ship it, rebuild it and reinstall it.

 

[Steep n deep]

If you where to get one from them I would wait to get yours out and measure it first so you get the right one the first time. Having said that have you called TCS (local) to see what they want to rebuild yours?

I spoke with TCS and they said the modified converter was about $750, unmodified about $600 or $650. I called a couple trans shops and they all say labour is about $600.

Is that place in the AZ that you mentioned really able to do it for $200 plus shipping? Do you know any mechanics who would pull the converter, allow it to be rebuilt by someone else and then reinstall it?

 

[Wheelingnoob]

Here is there web site.

http://www.roadrunnerconverters.com/

Give them a call and tell them what you have.

They did my converter and it looks good, have not run it yet but I know a few others have used them with good results.

 

[longbow]

I'm running two torque converters from Roadrunner in both of my diesel cruisers and they do great work for an amazing price! You won't be disappointed in their converters. I've paid twice as much for a standard converter build and it was just ok and these guys will build a HD converter that will last for decades for $200!!! Money well spent!

Don

 

[wrongway around]

Longbow one of the shops he is referring to is a friend of mine. And he said he can't get the proper info for extreming the v/b for more pressure. You did yours and had excellent results. Anyway I could set you up for a briefing with him so he could dial in these v/b here locally. I'm thinking steeps v/b is weak too. I bet every coastal cruiser guy would kiss you for that tec. I've got access to a couple cores he could play with.

 

[longbow]

Wrongway,

No problem at all. I am about to install my 3rd tranny with all of the performance mods that I have figured out and when I do I'm going to do a full build thread for building your own extreme tranny with extra clutches and steels and all of my valve body improvements. I am reluctant to give out the info for 3rd gear lockup yet as I haven't tested it in my truck to make sure it all works as planned. It will probably be 1 to 2 weeks before I get it all in and tested because I am finishing up building my spare transfer case to mount to the new tranny and I'm waiting on some seals.

I would be happy to talk to your friend and tell him how to increase line pressure and flow etc.. in the valve body to improve shifting and clamping of clutches. All of my experience is with the A440F trannys but this one sounds like it is one of the Hydraulic A442s that they put behind the diesels. If it is an electronic controlled tranny then that complicates things some but there are still some mods I can help with.

Like I said, once I get this tranny installed and confirm my calculations of 3rd gear lockup, I will be doing a big build thread for advanced tranny building and all of my info I have learned over the last 2 years will all be layed out so anyone who wants a heavy duty tranny can build it themselves without paying $6000 for one from Australia.

Feel free to have your buddy call me 520-250-9053

Don

 

[wrongway around]

Steep give it a bit ,I'll talk to Walter at lee's,and see if he can work some things out with longbow about the v/b and internals just in case you have to do the complete transmission. Sounds like for the price savings for you might want to go with road runner,I'll check out what converter you have
In the full hydro a442f( do you have cruise control)? Of coarse I'm sure someone here can answer that with a correct part number. On another note the price from tcs might be retail ,and I'm not sure how much over the counter sales they do. Being that they probably haven't done that many and in two days they get three inquiries from three of there steady customer's for the same thing..and a big thank you longbow.

 

[Steep n deep]

Steep give it a bit ,I'll talk to Walter at lee's,and see if he can work some things out with longbow about the v/b and internals just in case you have to do the complete transmission. Sounds like for the price savings for you might want to go with road runner,I'll check out what converter you have
In the full hydro a442f( do you have cruise control)? Of coarse I'm sure someone here can answer that with a correct part number. On another note the price from tcs might be retail ,and I'm not sure how much over the counter sales they do. Being that they probably haven't done that many and in two days they get three inquiries from three of there steady customer's for the same thing..and a big thank you longbow.

Yes, I have cruise control. I was thinking the price from TCS probably would be retail. Ok we will wait a bit for you to see what you can work with Walter. I did call road runner and they gave me a price of about $250 but need a core as he doesn't have any currently. He said shipping is about $150 each way.

Yes, big thanks to all you guys for helping me out. It is greatly appreciated.

 

[Wheelingnoob]

Yes, I have cruise control. I was thinking the price from TCS probably would be retail. Ok we will wait a bit for you to see what you can work with Walter. I did call road runner and they gave me a price of about $250 but need a core as he doesn't have any currently. He said shipping is about $150 each way.

Yes, big thanks to all you guys for helping me out. It is greatly appreciated.

If you can ship it from Blaine to them its about $40-50 each way (that's is what I did). They needed mine as well to rebuild and mod, was not a big deal with there 1 day turn around. I cant see spending 2.5 x that to get the same thing done locally

I use Mail Boxes International for my shipping and receiving in Blaine.

 

[Steep n deep]

If you can ship it from Blaine to them its about $40-50 each way (that's is what I did). They needed mine as well to rebuild and mod, was not a big deal with there 1 day turn around. I cant see spending 2.5 x that to get the same thing done locally

I use Mail Boxes International for my shipping and receiving in Blaine.

Yah, I was thinking that as a good option also. Shipping across the boarder always adds a large price tag, so easy to just pick it up. The problem with that is getting a mechanic who is willing to take it out and get it rebuilt and then reinstall. They refuse to do that as they can't make money off parts then and the part quality is out of their control.

Did you pull yours out yourself or did you get a mechanic to do it?