Sway bar end link relocation (or "how to fit 34s with zero rubbing") (1 Viewer)

[linuxgod]

I fixed my KDSS and passenger's side sway bar rub yesterday. zero rub now on 34s. (I say "I" but it was actually Rick @ ChiTown 4x4 that did the work since we had the truck on the lift to swap the diff fluid anyway).

KDSS relo kit + mounting the sway bar end links on the outside of the LCA cradle did the trick. Tons of clearance now. 34s fit without the dreaded rubbing at full lock now, even with caster pushed to the very top of the Toyota spec (3.3 deg DS, 3.7 deg PS). Previously I was hitting the KDSS arm at full right lock and the passenger's side sway bar at full left lock.

Parts required:

• Trail Tailor (or Slee) KDSS relocation kit (~$77)
• Two M14x1.5 (fine thread) 110mm bolts (~$15). These are hard to come by. The stock bolts are ~80mm. 100mm bolts (like those Toyota uses in the front diff mounts) only get maybe 4 threads to catch. boltdepot.com has 120mm bolts (Metric hex bolts, Zinc plated class 8.8 steel, 14mm x 1.5mm x 120mm - Bolt Depot - https://www.boltdepot.com/Product-Details.aspx?product=7276) which you can cut down to ~110mm. 120mm is a tad too long. (BTW Toyota marks these as grade "6T", whatever that means. The above link are grade 8.8 bolts, which I believe will be sufficient for this purpose.
• Two 1.5" (or 2", if you can find them) aluminum spacers, to fill the gap in the cradle (~$20). I ordered these (1-1/2" O.D x 1/2" I.D. Aluminum Spacers - Keyser Manufacturing - https://keysermanufacturing.com/product/1-1-2-o-d-1-2-i-d-aluminum-spacers/) and drilled the inner hole to 9/16" (~14.1mm). If you had some aluminum you could cut and drill your own. Note that these fit loosely into the cradle, but once you torque the bolt down they will tighten up.
• Ratchet strap and prying bar to move everything into position

Looking closely at the setup, he and I agreed that the end link does NOT rotate in the cradle once it's mounted. The cradle is just there to protect the end link and help ensure the bolt stays straight and rigid. So the only downside I can see to doing this is that if you took a big hit right on the bolt, you might destroy the head or bend the bolt slightly.

Note that the KDSS relo kit alone should let you fit 34s (and 35s, if your alignment is adjusted correctly), but without relocating your sway bar end links they will end up at a steep angle which will rapidly wear the rubber bushings inside them.

Thanks @Willy beamin for being the guinea pig on this and answering my (repeated) questions. If you're at the LCDC this year I owe you a beer.

Pics forthcoming

 

[linuxgod]

 

[TeCKis300]

I really hope this works well for the LC! More full fat tire fitments.

Linking some info from @Atwalz build thread where he has some pics of his setup

Builds - Atwalz 2013 TLC 200 Build Thread.

Diff and both cross members are done.

forum.ih8mud.com

 

[linuxgod]

Photos uploaded.

Looking closely my end links do angle a bit when the truck is on the ground. In the air it was spot on. The angle as mounted is not as bad as if you kept them inside the cradle, but they are not 100% factory angles either. If you look close you can see the bushings are stretched a bit and the cracks show. Mine *are* worn (111k on the truck now) so I may swap them in the near future as they probably need to be replaced regardless.

The KDSS relo kit pushes the sway bar 1” forward. Mounting the links outside the cradle sets them 1.5” forward. So they’re actually a bit tweaked in the opposite direction, not as bad as if the were mounted inside the cradle, but there is a bit of angle still. For some reason my passengers side seems a bit more angled than the drivers side. I may jack the truck up and see if maybe the sway bar is slightly misaligned.

An ideal design would be to get blocks of aluminum or steel bar and drill your own KDSS relo brackets 1.5” (or a bit more) forward instead of the normal 1”. At that point the end links would be straight. (I’d actually consider trying Tundra end links but I think they’d only fit on one side and would leave the sway bar misaligned). There’s definitely room to go at least another .5” forward, probably more. I think you’d have to do that if you were trying to run anything above 35s without some serious wheel offsets. (I’m at +25)

I saved my old 80mm bolts because I’m still hoping one day @TRAIL TAILOR or ARB or someone else will create an end link which works with the relo kit out of the box and do away with the angle completely

 

[Dixon Santana]

Same approach here to fit the 295/70R18 Yokohama’s. KDSS relocate brackets and BDS extended sway bar links for a tundra sitting outside of the cradle. Works great.

 

[linuxgod]

Same approach here to fit the 295/70R18 Yokohama’s. KDSS relocate brackets and BDS extended sway bar links for a tundra sitting outside of the cradle.

These are Tundra links used on an LC? I’d totally try these on my LC if they worked for you. Anything special required on the drivers side?

 

[JcrewLC]

Same approach here to fit the 295/70R18 Yokohama’s. KDSS relocate brackets and BDS extended sway bar links for a tundra sitting outside of the cradle. Works great.

View attachment 2667279

To fit 295/70/18 there’s no way around not doing the KDSS relo?

would +25 offset, bp51, spc uca be enough to avoid the rub?

 

[Dixon Santana]

These are Tundra links used on an LC? I’d totally try these on my LC if they worked for you. Anything special required on the drivers side?

They are designed for BDS's lifts they offer on Tundra's. The only thing I've done is shave down the top of the sway bar slightly. The links being much longer than stock would sometimes make contact with the tie rod end jam nut. Right now I have no contact with anything, but I'm contemplating shortening the link some by cutting a section of the link off. Both ends are on a threaded rod with a jam nut so it should be relatively simple, in theory. I've had these end links for three months now and I have not noticed any change in handling.

 

[Dixon Santana]

To fit 295/70/18 there’s no way around not doing the KDSS relo?

would +25 offset, bp51, spc uca be enough to avoid the rub?

You have to do the KDSS relocating brackets. There's no way a 295 would fit. Tried at first, but full lock the tire would lock itself into the KDSS arm on the driver side. The SPC UCA give just enough clearance on the OE +60 offset wheels. I'm not running wheels spacers and no rubbing on the UCA.

 

[linuxgod]

To fit 295/70/18 there’s no way around not doing the KDSS relo?

would +25 offset, bp51, spc uca be enough to avoid the rub?

If you want to fit a 295 you'll need the SPC UCA and lower offset wheels (at least +35 offset, IMO... +25 is generally good too). A lift is of limited help since your suspension travel is still the same, you're just starting at a different point in the suspension arc.

You *might* be able to get it to fit by doing a lot of alignment adjustments, but I think you'll sacrifice handling to do that. Case in point:

I have 285/75R17 (33.8") which is basically equivalent to 285/70R18. My caster was previously set around +4.0 deg, utilizing the SPC ball joint to set +2 deg instead of the normal +1. I would ever so slightly kiss the inside of the KDSS arm at full lock.

A 295/70R18 would be slightly taller and would almost certainly hit the arm, and the nut on it. However if you reduced your caster to the lower end of the spec, maybe around +2 degrees, and/or made some adjustments with the SPC UCA ball joint, you might get it to fit without the KDSS relocation kit. You will almost certainly rub the KDSS arm and sway bar at full lock, and you run the risk of hitting the body mount (so you might need a body mount chop), but it's *probably* doable with some careful effort.

That said... why? Either run 285/70R18 (which can be made to fit with minimal rubbing), or spend $100 and do the KDSS relo kit and go with the size you want.

 

[linuxgod]

They are designed for BDS's lifts they offer on Tundra's. The only thing I've done is shave down the top of the sway bar slightly. The links being much longer than stock would sometimes make contact with the tie rod end jam nut. Right now I have no contact with anything, but I'm contemplating shortening the link some by cutting a section of the link off. Both ends are on a threaded rod with a jam nut so it should be relatively simple, in theory. I've had these end links for three months now and I have not noticed any change in handling.

Yeah it seemed like they were designed for either 4.5" or 7" lifts. If the upper and lower parts separate (I assume they do) then so long as there's enough thread I'd be comfortable cutting off an inch or two of threads to make them the correct length.

I wouldn't expect much difference in handling between end links, inside or outside the cradle, standard or longer length, etc. I would think any difference on road will be subtle, and bigger differences will appear when you're offroad and trying to maximize suspension travel up or down.

 

[1Maverick]

@linuxgod I read your helpful install notes for the KDSS relo. Thank you! I am having 295/70r18 installed this week and running the 1.25” spidertrax spacers with my heritage wheels currently. Will I still need to run the spacers with the relo kit? My local shop has never done a kdss relo on the 200 but they are a very good custom off-road shop. Should I just refer them to your previous post with the install notes or is the relo kit from TT all I need? I am a little concerned about hurting my bushings. Any idea how much it will shorten the life of them? Thanks

 

[linuxgod]

@linuxgod I read your helpful install notes for the KDSS relo. Thank you! I am having 295/70r18 installed this week and running the 1.25” spidertrax spacers with my heritage wheels currently. Will I still need to run the spacers with the relo kit? My local shop has never done a kdss relo on the 200 but they are a very good custom off-road shop. Should I just refer them to your previous post with the install notes or is the relo kit from TT all I need? I am a little concerned about hurting my bushings. Any idea how much it will shorten the life of them? Thanks

It depends on up alignment. I think it’s possible to not need them but caster has to be set kinda low to avoid rubbing the KDSS arm at full lock. Even rubbing it’s only at full lock, if you back off like 1/8th of a turn of the wheel you don’t contact.

No idea how much more wear the relo kit creates. I assume a lot from the little I’ve read, probably cuts the bushing life by 3-4x?

 

[1Maverick]

It depends on up alignment. I think it’s possible to not need them but caster has to be set kinda low to avoid rubbing the KDSS arm at full lock. Even rubbing it’s only at full lock, if you back off like 1/8th of a turn of the wheel you don’t contact.

No idea how much more wear the relo kit creates. I assume a lot from the little I’ve read, probably cuts the bushing life by 3-4x?

Thanks. I may try and have the wheel pulled back a enough to barely rub at full lock before tackling a relo or just getting a +25 offset wheel from Icon as I don’t want to add anymore wear to the bushings or effect the sway bar angle.

 

[100kiwi]

Thanks. I may try and have the wheel pulled back a enough to barely rub at full lock before tackling a relo or just getting a +25 offset wheel from Icon as I don’t want to add anymore wear to the bushings or effect the sway bar angle.

It's possible with the spc upper, I just made it work. I have about an 1/8" clearance on the KDSS and the same at the back on the mud flap.
I was able to keep caster at 3.4.
I'm on factory wheel with 25mm spacers, so 31mm offset

 

[1Maverick]

It's possible with the spc upper, I just made it work. I have about an 1/8" clearance on the KDSS and the same at the back on the mud flap.
I was able to keep caster at 3.4.
I'm on factory wheel with 25mm spacers, so 31mm offset

Good to know. Sounds like you’re running bora spacers. I’m going to see if an alignment will be enough to do the trick and it just might if you’re able to get it to work with a smaller spacer then my 1.25”.

 

[linuxgod]

Thanks. I may try and have the wheel pulled back a enough to barely rub at full lock before tackling a relo or just getting a +25 offset wheel from Icon as I don’t want to add anymore wear to the bushings or effect the sway bar angle.

If your happy with your wheels I don’t think the difference between your spacers and a +25 offset will matter. I have +25 offset and I still scrubbed the kdss arm. Maybe +18 would work but even then you might rub. And as your offsets get lower you risk hitting the fender if you’re turning hard and you flex.

 

[Yuri]

I ended up buying Jomax's Tundra's sway bar end links, link below, to eliminate the bushings as a whole. I'll keep my old links in the truck in case I have issues but I feel better not having the bushings fail on a trip. I did not have to relocate the mounting as the links pivot without the bushings.

Couple of weeks in since the install and so far so good.

Jomax Customs

TRD PRO SWAY BAR END LINK KIT TUNDRA

jomaxcustoms.com

 

[linuxgod]

I'd love to see pics of the angles once you're done. I thought someone used extended links and had some interference with the tie rod nuts but these look shorter so hopefully they'll clear it. TBH I'd love to remount my end links back in the cradle one day if there's a viable solution

 

[Yuri]

I'll try and take some pics tonight when I get home.