Steering components

[skyshark186]

So i got to thinking after Woody so aptly stated that he wouldnt waste histeer and hyro assist on an SUA what to do with my crappy steering. The feel to it isnt so bad, it turns easily enough and seems to have just about the right amount of resistance for my taste. But its got about a three inch lag in the middle, which makes it kinda fun to drive on uneven roads. Actually it scares the crap out of my passengers. But who needs em anyway.

I was thinking crossover. Just cus if i do ever decide to go SOA, which i doubt it would be nice to have a good system already set up. I would like something thats easy to steer, responsive, and not a PITA to replace once a year when i break it and cost me 500 bucks a pop. Any thoughts.

 

[woody]

and the steering system you are running now is....???

if stock, simply hooking up a Scout/GM/60-series PS conversion eliminates a couple links in the system.

Other than having too many links/ends because of the center arm, stock cruiser steering can ALREADY be considered crossover....

 

[skyshark186]

I have saginaw. I also have five rods running here there and everywhere. I want something simpler, more durable, and welll........functional. That slack in my wheel bothers me.

 

[Mace]

What sag do you have that uses 5 rods?


Most use a Draglink and a tierod..

 

[skyshark186]

Well. Im glad you asked. Cus it makes no freekin sense to me either. Its like, they took out the center arm and left everthing else stock in place. It goes back and forth and back and forth. Now maybe you can understand why i would like crossover or Histeer.

I would take a pic, but my only digital is a camera phone and the pics suck when its in a dark area. All i know is i bought the factory rod end kit and replaced em all and only had one left over(Ie center arm).

So yea, who wants to tell me what to buy?

 

[skyshark186]

By the way. I failed to mention the guy who built the truck a long ass time ago, was a geniously smart moron.

Logic behind that being, he had to be helatiosly smart to figure this crap out and make it work the way he had it, but retarded to do it the way it is.

 

[woody]

a pic would help hugely....a guy I know has a goofy saginaw setup on his 4-link where the stock center arm was moved to the passenger side and reused.....way too many links....

Sounds like starting over would be easiest, but I don't see where hysteer is gonna do anything

 

[skyshark186]

Crossover.

 

[skyshark186]

Couldnt get a pic cus its too dark. Mine runs from the box, over to the passenger side and connects with the second rod in front of the axle that travels the entire distance between the two wheels. It actually looks like my steering stabilizer has been touching my diff cover, have to measure that out and fix it.

Anyway, the front tie rod is slightly bent and way to small for my personal preferance, and i would like to move the drag link behind the axle. Both are way to small, and beat to hell. And they apparently arent doing a very good job with how much slop and wander my steering has.

 

[woody]

drag link = connection front steering box to the passenger-side steering arm

TIE rod = connection between both front steering arms

You want the tie rod behind the axle, and Luke's pic above is the way to go for that

 

[skyshark186]

Sorry, its been a long few days. To many college reports and not any sleep.

But is it possible to use a system like that on an SUA drum braked 40?

To hijack my own thread. Would i be making my 33s look like 29s if i did a spring over and used the same springs. That would give me what, and aditional 3 inches or so? I didnt really wanna go SOA for cost reasons, but if it would allow me to use a better steering system id be all for it.


Thanks for all the help.

 

[Isotel]

your starting to see how things will snowball.. Bacicly you need to decide how big you want your truck and how much you want to wheel it.. if you want to stay with 33's and not do too much wheeling, then stay sprung under, and replace your steering with a bacic stock like setup.. If you want to do a SOA and make it a big ass truck that flexes good, eventualy put a locker in ECT.. you need to get rid of the drum brake crap, do a mini truck disk conversion, Longfilds, locker, cut and trun, Hy-steer and beefy tie rod and drag link.. $1000+ later and its sweet!!.. you can get the Hysteer kit from 4x4labs for a spring under, but if you go SOA later, you may need to get new arms and such, because i belive he will custom make arms different depending on your setup..

 

[Pighead]

But is it possible to use a system like that on an SUA drum braked 40?

To hijack my own thread. Would i be making my 33s look like 29s if i did a spring over and used the same springs. That would give me what, and aditional 3 inches or so? I didnt really wanna go SOA for cost reasons, but if it would allow me to use a better steering system id be all for it.


Thanks for all the help.

O.K., I just finished the SOA/Scout PS/Hi-steer thingie on my Piggie.
Yes, 33s look WAY too small. 35s don't even look too big.
The improvement in steering is phenomonal. Well worth dropping a couple grrr.
Also, noticed when trying to fit the tie-rod (behind front axle), that my (2F) oil pan was perilously close to it. Like, the tie rod was just a couple inches below the oil pan. I had to go with the other 4x4 labs steering with the tie rod out in front. Luke said he's used the rear tie rod with sixes before, but may have moved the front axle forward a few inches too...

 

[Mace]

Couldnt get a pic cus its too dark. Mine runs from the box, over to the passenger side and connects with the second rod in front of the axle that travels the entire distance between the two wheels. It actually looks like my steering stabilizer has been touching my diff cover, have to measure that out and fix it.

Anyway, the front tie rod is slightly bent and way to small for my personal preferance, and i would like to move the drag link behind the axle. Both are way to small, and beat to hell. And they apparently arent doing a very good job with how much slop and wander my steering has.

So you have two rods that connect everything right?? Not 5 links like you said?

One from the box to the PS (and connects directly to the rod that runs from the PS knuckle to the DS knuckle) Right???

Have someone rock the steering wheel back and forth.. Look for play in the steering arm and everywhere.

For some reason if you have new TRE's I honestly think that your box might be flexing the frame..

Pics are definately good..

 

[CruisinGA]

Can't a box itself develop slop? Maybe a worn u-joint in the steering shaft?

I'd worry more about making your steering safe, and not what kind of steering you are running....
Changing suspension to have tight steering seems like the hard way to kill a cat....


Everyone makes fun of the old stock steering with it's links and center arm....


I just changed a rag joint and the ends, and it's tight as can be, I had the center arm rebuild kit at the time, but never bothered cause the steering is plenty tight as it is. I've had people get in and drive it for the first time without really looking hard, and ask me what sort of P/S i was running. That was with the 33" swampers I have now.

Do what you have to in order to get some pics up here, until we see one we are all speculating on a not-too-specific description.

 

[Mace]

Yes the steering box can develop slop..

There are way too many variables the he has to consider. Most issues can be resolved by getting your girlfriend to hop in the truck and wiggle the steering wheel while you look to see where the slop is.

 

[bustanutley]

Ummm ok, the only thing that High steer arms do for you is make your steering angles correct for a highly lifted truck, ie SOA and maybe even a truck with 4” springs. By angles I mean that your drag link and your tie rod are as close to being collinear as possible. This eliminates bump steer. This can also be adjusted by the drop of your pitmit arm.

I agree with Mace in that you already have a Xover steering system 4 TRE correct?

So like Mace said your problems could be:

Frame flex
Sloppy TRE
Sloppy Box
Worn/loose joints in steering shaft

Things that I have never heard of happening and extremely unlikely because you would most likely be dead but just thought of

Loose steering arms, well I know people brake the studs occasionally
Broken knuckle bearings

Note, if your setup is not Xover I have no idea WTF is going on with your setup, and pictures would be clutch in understanding this madness. Is your steering box mounted at the front of the frame? When box is it?

NUT

 

[skyshark186]

Not sure exactly what box it is but it is saginaw. No, the 5 links was exadgeration from no sleep and frustration.

I dont think its frame flex. The shaft running to the box itself is loose, and has mass amounts of play. Which is probably a huge part of the problem. Whats really great is, powersteering is obviously not my specialty, and no one wants to touch my cruiser cus of all the conversion work.

The SOA thing was a matter of simplicity as odd as that sounds. Kinda like, if you can buy a mansion or a two bedroom for the same price...... Its gonna cost me some change to make the steering i have safe and worthy, so if im spendin it anyway i want it to be the best possible.

Locker for sure in the plans. I dont know how much bigger persay i wanna make it. I like the 33s, i might do 35s after i wear these out. I hate rocks, so flex isnt a big thing with me. I like running mountain/desert trails and admiring the view and throwing the beast in mudholes, so flex aint a problem.

I will get pics up tomorrow(today but its wayyyyyy to early)

 

[Mace]

Not sure exactly what box it is but it is saginaw. No, the 5 links was exadgeration from no sleep and frustration.

I dont think its frame flex. The shaft running to the box itself is loose, and has mass amounts of play. Which is probably a huge part of the problem. Whats really great is, powersteering is obviously not my specialty, and no one wants to touch my cruiser cus of all the conversion work.

The SOA thing was a matter of simplicity as odd as that sounds. Kinda like, if you can buy a mansion or a two bedroom for the same price...... Its gonna cost me some change to make the steering i have safe and worthy, so if im spendin it anyway i want it to be the best possible.

Locker for sure in the plans. I dont know how much bigger persay i wanna make it. I like the 33s, i might do 35s after i wear these out. I hate rocks, so flex isnt a big thing with me. I like running mountain/desert trails and admiring the view and throwing the beast in mudholes, so flex aint a problem.

I will get pics up tomorrow(today but its wayyyyyy to early)

So basically you are looking at replacing the entire steering system because your steering column is sloppy...



Cool..

 

[skyshark186]

Actually mister sarcastic. Im looking at replacing my entire sytem because it is overly light and bent to hell. The column will be replaced as well. It was an old hack job that i dont trust, so its gonna be replaced. All i wanted to know was if crossover, or more specifically the type shown in the picture above was the way to go.