PTO Spooling problem (1 Viewer)

[Mark W]

Mark & Poser
I've been looking around on the web. Seems to be two types of gearboxes. One has one drive gear extending outside the housing (this is what I have and is just engaged or disengaged) and a box with two drive gears showing. I presume the box with the two gears extending outside the top of the housing has the forward-neutral-reverse and is the one I need to fix the problem I outlined in my first post.
Thanks
Peter

The PTO drive box for the non-split case has two gears which protrude from the unit, one of which engages the PTO gear in the T/C. It is always engaged.

The box for the split case has a single gear which protrudes. It slides forward and backward and is only engaged when the PTO drive box is engaged.

A box for a split case will not mount on a non-split case nor will it work the other way.


Mark...

 

[Mark W]

IIRC the TEQ PTO had High and Low gears but I could be wrong.

You are.

Forward, neutral, reverse. No multiple speeds within the PTO system. Just the choice of tranny gears.


Mark...

 

[peterb]

Mark
I've been thinking about your response. I have a 5/75 FJ-40 that has the stock drive train as far as I know. I removed the T/C from the tranny to install the PTO drive gear and everything looked like it should per my FSM. The OEM PTO gearbox (that has one gear protruding and only has engaged and unengaged settings) fits on the side of my T/C and I can reel cable in with my winch with the gearbox engaged and the tranny in reverse.
My plan was to replace the PTO gearbox with one that had two gears protruding so I could reel in cable using the forward gears. According to your post, I need the gearbox with F-N-R settings.
After reading your resonse, I'm wondering if the PTO gearbox I need to make my winch work properly will fit my T/C? Will I have to keep the gearbox I know fits my rig and buy a winch that will work with it?
Thanks in advance for your thoughts.
Peter

 

[honk]

Peter,

The winch only does what the PTO gearbox instructs it to and all it can do is go forward or backward. You can see this by turning the drive coupling by hand - it only goes clockwise or counterclockwise, and all of the stuff on the right side of the winch is associated with it's drum brake. All this to tell you that buying another winch won't help you in obtaing variable operation of a winch.

I currently have three PTO winches from different manufacturers each and the above is true of all of them. They're really very simple mechanical devices.

 

[warrior_1515]

Mark
I've been thinking about your response. I have a 5/75 FJ-40 that has the stock drive train as far as I know. I removed the T/C from the tranny to install the PTO drive gear and everything looked like it should per my FSM. The OEM PTO gearbox (that has one gear protruding and only has engaged and unengaged settings) fits on the side of my T/C and I can reel cable in with my winch with the gearbox engaged and the tranny in reverse.
My plan was to replace the PTO gearbox with one that had two gears protruding so I could reel in cable using the forward gears. According to your post, I need the gearbox with F-N-R settings.
After reading your resonse, I'm wondering if the PTO gearbox I need to make my winch work properly will fit my T/C? Will I have to keep the gearbox I know fits my rig and buy a winch that will work with it?
Thanks in advance for your thoughts.
Peter

Are you able to post a pic of your winch and pto unit. It sounds to me like you have the correct pto unit that has F-N-R.

If the parts you have are OEM, then yes, in theory everything should fit just fine. However, I am having a blast trying to get mine to fit right now.

Also, with the pto unit out, you will be able to see if it does have a forward and reverse by playing around with it.

Anyways, there is one on ebay that has all the parts. (not mine)
If all your parts look exactly like this one, then you are good to go.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Comp...011QQitemZ320021983271QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW

HTH

Dave

 

[Mark W]

Mark
I've been thinking about your response. I have a 5/75 FJ-40 that has the stock drive train as far as I know. I removed the T/C from the tranny to install the PTO drive gear and everything looked like it should per my FSM. The OEM PTO gearbox (that has one gear protruding and only has engaged and unengaged settings) fits on the side of my T/C and I can reel cable in with my winch with the gearbox engaged and the tranny in reverse.
My plan was to replace the PTO gearbox with one that had two gears protruding so I could reel in cable using the forward gears. According to your post, I need the gearbox with F-N-R settings.
After reading your resonse, I'm wondering if the PTO gearbox I need to make my winch work properly will fit my T/C? Will I have to keep the gearbox I know fits my rig and buy a winch that will work with it?
Thanks in advance for your thoughts.
Peter

A '75 rig, if stock, will have the non-split case. The default PTO box for this case is the F-N-R box. However it doesn't sound like youhave this drive box (both from how it acts of course and your description of only one gear which protrudes from the mating face, into the T/C. I have never seen one of these early style engage-disengage boxes. I have heard reference to these being the only ones that specter is able to supply, but I don't know if that is accurrate.

Without seeing your winch I can not guess if it is somehow different than all of the others that I have seen. I doubt it though. More likely these engage-disengage drive boxes were not meant for use with the winches.

The only other box like this that I have seen (on a split case T/C) also spins the winch backwards. However it is an early vintage winch, so one possibility that is not ruled out is that the later model winches were dsigned to use the opposite direction rotation. I have never had a chance to completely rule this out. Or rather, when I've been arond the later model rigs with PTOs, I've had other thin]gs on my moind than inspecting the winch rotation direction... If it's getting the rig out of the mud, I haven't really cared which direction the input shaft was spinning...

Sounds like you need a different gearbox.


Mark...

 

[peterb]

Okay
Thanks everyone! I'll buy another gearbox (one with the two gears protruding and the F-N-R shifting). When I pull the one that's installed now, I'll put the two side by side and take some pics and post them. Maybe that will help explain my problem and clarify things for other confused PTO winch owners.
Thanks again!
Peter

 

[BigRedFJ40]

It is possible that someone has turned the worm gear around in the winch itself...... Doing this will bypass the need for shear pins and will also reverse the direction of the winch operation......

just a shot in the dark.... I have seen this up here in the NorthEast on a couple of rigs

Chris

 

[peterb]

Eureka!
Chris this is great. Not sure if someone has turned the worm gear around (here in Kentucky we would call this procedure swapping it end for end) but I could do it. That would let me keep the gearbox I have and use the forward tranny gears to reel in the cable. Great!
Anyone have familiarity with worm gears? Would turning around the drive gear cause the spool to spin in the opposite direction?
Thanks
Peter

 

[BigRedFJ40]

Eureka!
Chris this is great. Not sure if someone has turned the worm gear around (here in Kentucky we would call this procedure swapping it end for end) but I could do it. That would let me keep the gearbox I have and use the forward tranny gears to reel in the cable. Great!
Anyone have familiarity with worm gears? Would turning around the drive gear cause the spool to spin in the opposite direction?
Thanks
Peter

Yes, the worm gear is made of brass or bronze...... you can simply disassemble the winch, remove the worm gear and flip it end for end. By doing this, you will need to adapt your PTO driveshaft to fit the other end of the gear. Not too big of a deal......


Chris

 

[honk]

Hmmmm.

 

[peterb]

Chris
I don't think turning the worm around is going to work. I tried it with a bolt last night and the threads moved the nut the same way despite which way the bolt faced.
Looks like I still have to get another gearbox.
Thanks
Peter

 

[Living in the Past]

A worn gear is like a bolt it's either right or left hand thread. Post up some pictures of your PTO box. Does it have the TEQ stamped into it?

John

 

[Coolerman]

I have a small worm and mating gear here in front of me. Flipping the worm will NOT change the direction of rotation. Sorry Peter :-(

 

[BigRedFJ40]

well, like I said...... it was a shot in the dark.

 

[peterb]

Photos of both Boxes

Hello All
I finally tracked down a gearbox with the F-N-R settings. I've cleaned it up and taken pics of it next to my engage-disengage box. I have a Toyota winch and a stock drivetrain on my 5/75 FJ-40.
The box on the left is the F-N-R. The box on the right fit my stock T/C but would only reel the cable in when the tranny was in reverse. It has Asano stamped on it. What do you guys think the box on the right is for, a split case application?
Thanks
Peter

 

[peterb]

More Shots

A couple more pics.

 

[Mark W]

That's not for a split case. The bolt pattern would be different.


Mark...

 

[Coolerman]

Sure looks like you could just add the F-N-R gear into that other box if you could find one?

Mark W. , would that be possible?

If so then you could sell it and get some of your money back. If that is possible I might be interested in that box.

 

[desertpat]

Re-Spool

I am wondering if you can't put it in a forward gear ..... it will spool out until it's all off the spool ..... then continue turning - it begins to spool in (while still in a forward gear).

After this process, you will use reverse to spool out and your forward gears to spool in (am I missing something here?)
good luck