Need rebuilt or new 1FZ for 97 Cruiser

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I think others are helping me see my point more clearly and I like what Landy said above regarding a mechanic being open/interested in the problem. Honestly. An engine fails within a few operating hours of you bolting it back together - and the first words that come to mind are "It's not my fault - no way"? C'mon. Now that this whole tragic event has been able to settle a bit with you, FF, it must start to look a little absurd.

He did something wrong on assembly, and the only thing I can think of is when you're reinstalling the timing chain tensioner on a 93/94 it's OK to turn the engine backward. If you've never worked on this engine and don't have the proper factory manual information (say, you're a mechanic working from some generic engine data stuff that's not 100% accurate) you may not know that in '95 the chain tensioner was changed to a new design, but you cannot rotate the engine backward while installing it or you can break something.

There are some other guys who could chiming in here, but this engine does not have any weaknesses besides the head gasket material. The lube system is particularly bulletproof, so an oil system failure just reeks of an error.

DougM
 
Larry,

Yep, I know. It's just that in the old days of pushrod valve trains a 'thrown rod' was not uncommon and that kind of failure would damage the engine. Since the 80's engine has only connecting rods which are gigantic forged steel affairs a failure of the only 'rod' on this engine would essentially blow holes in it, I think it's worth noting. And I did.

DougM
 
So what happened? Is this just another thread from a newbie that dies without conclusion once the poster gets what they want?
 
um, before someone posts up to say how used they feel, maybe we should let him get on with figuring out how and whether to fix it.
 
OK so a completely diffent engine, etc but I replaced the cams in a MC engine (WR426) and when I reassembled I made a dumb mistake. The engine went back together fine and ran great for half a days ride until it jumped timing.

When it jumped timing things went very badly very quickly, as you would expect a engine running at 10K would.

In any event, in my situation I had slightly stretched my timing chain and the cam skipped time and then there was lots and lots of valve piston interface.

Your mechanic replaced a head gasket, therefore I'd start looking, like Doug said, at the oil for some plastic parts from the cam chain guides. There is no way your mechanic can wiggle out of horking up a timing problem after doing a head gasket. He was in there, if it's a problem, it's most likely his.

JMHO and $0.02

BTW If the 1FZ is shot, I'd go with a vortec V8 for about 1/3 the price.
 
Trouble is, getting the Vortec gets you - well, an engine lying on the garage floor. Then you need to mate it with the tranny, interface the electronics, cooling, etc, etc. It's not a pretty situation.

DougM
 
Current status of engine

I am having the LC flatbedded to Chicag for the post mortem. I am having it done by a three stall local mechanic or a dealership. My original mechanic refuses to do a post mortem without charging me. He stated, "Why spend more money when you know you are getting a new engine?" He can not accept the possibility they may ha done something wrong. I have only paid $500 of the $2,100 HG job. I told him it was important to determine who was at fault. I told him i would pay if it was not his fault. He still is doing everything to talk us out of a post mortem. A certain amount of responsibility, merchantibility, or warrantibility is included in the $2,100. I don't see him accepting any responsibility. Nothing is being done to assist me.

You guys are great. I still have to decide who does the post mortem. I think the ealer's opinion will carry more weight if the fault is the original mechanics. I may have to defend myself in a court of law. Any thoughts? Thanks again
 
The original mechanic probably wants the bill paid before he reopens it. If I were you, my willingness to do it this way would hinge on his attitude in demonstrating a willingness to consider its his fault when it happened. If you do not get that sense of trust, you are faced with two risks:

1 - he will take your remaining payment and not reopen it
2 - he will reopen it but conceal the mistake he made

Since you are getting enough feedback that you don't trust him, I would not pay the bill, or trust him to reopen it. You lose with both strategies and he has given you no reason to trust him on either. So you need a different strategy.

I'd pay a Toyota Dealer to pull the valve cover and inspect the timing chain/guide/slipper area, then call you. At that point, you've not spent too much money (what - $200?), and whatever's found will be written on stationary that says Toyota on it if you end up in court (vs Ted's Car Emporium and Power Washing Service). If all looks normal then you'll have another decision to make. Naturally, the Toyota mechanic should be paid enough to eyeball the engine to see if anything else obvious is wrong like the original mechanic loosened the crank pulley for some reason, etc.

DougM
 
Legalities aside, I would not pay him because his attitude reeks of ignorance. If he can not see (or is unwilling to admit) the coincidence of the engine failing within a few miles of him doing some pretty major service work then he is competely unworthy of full payment until his work can be ruled out as a factor in the engine not working. In other words, he needs to recognize the paying customerès perspective. He appears, from what you describe of his comportment, to be a pr*ck. He will recognize that when you explain why he will not be paid until his work can be found NOT AT FAULT. In my opinion, based on what youève said of this man, he is not trustworthy and I would now NOT give him the opportunity to open back up your cruiser. I also agree that its best to take this engine in to a Toyota dealership and get one of their mechanics to check it out.

A good mechanic would investigate a problem like this even after he has been paid in full. It is clear this individual is not likely to.

There are many people in life you need to trust and have mutual respect for. A mechanic is one of them.

Man whats up with my new ÈapostropheÈ and question markÉ

CHeers.
 
Given the syptoms 'a couple of hours after the delivery' sounds to me like this is the culprit:

Distributor Cap 17.99
Distributor rotor 6.51
Spark plug wire set 121.77]/quote]

Ignition timing / advance could have produced this mess.

M
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pretty hard to screw up the dizzy, rotor and wires.

the guy is a jerk. it is obvious his fault can't be ruled out without checking. don't pay him any more and move on. reverse the credit card for what you have paid if you can. do pay for the diagnosis work both because you ain't necessarily done and because you will need the report in case he sues you.
 
ffahey said:
...I still have to decide who does the post mortem. I think the ealer's opinion will carry more weight if the fault is the original mechanics. I may have to defend myself in a court of law. Any thoughts? Thanks again
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If the intent of the post mortem is to build a case to recover damages from the mechanic and or not pay the bill, then you should have the examination performed by someone that 1) is an expert, 2) is willing to prepare a signed written report of their findings, 3) is willing to testify in court. You need to discuss all of this up front before you hand over the truck to be torn down.
 
The post moretem is being done by my local toyota dealer. So far, we know the problem is not in the blcok. It is in the head. Hopefull i won't need a new engine. The oil pressure is at 5lbs when idling and high teens under acceleration. Will know more tomorrow. Thanks for the help
 
Tell them to VERY carefully note the position of the timing gear BEFORE they remove it. It can be improperly put into the wrong notch and bolted up normally. This is in the HG DVD and I learned it from Robbie.

DougM
 
For whatever reason I just read this thread and I'd like to say that THIS RICK didn't turn the crank backwards!!

I hit my slipper with my left elbow while getting the high pressure line off of the PS pump. My hand slipped when that bolt finally broke free. Still a bone head move for sure but not as bad as turning the crank backwards!
 
ffahey said:
Gasket Sealer 36.45
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This is the one real strange item on this list of your's. Yes it is used but only for the plugs on the front of the head. Most mechanics would simply sub in some permatex or something as it's not a critical leak area.

NOW, if something was accidentally dropped down into the engine where the timing chain runs then the oil pan would have to be removed. This would definitely require a tube of this stuff as there is no gasket on that pan but FIPG is used. Also the sump pickup is actually drawn through the pan via a passage up into the pump and there is am elaborate o-ring gasket between the pan and that front cover to seal this channel.

Take a look at the oil pan / block interface. The factory FIPG is grey I believe (Dan?) and the parts stuff is black. If where that stuff has squeezed out between the two is something other than grey than that pan has been off.
 
landtank said:
For whatever reason I just read this thread and I'd like to say that THIS RICK didn't turn the crank backwards!!

I hit my slipper with my left elbow while getting the high pressure line off of the PS pump. My hand slipped when that bolt finally broke free. Still a bone head move for sure but not as bad as turning the crank backwards!
Click to expand...

what would happen if you turned the crank backwards?
 
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