My 2H is trashed

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vwluv10338

vwluv10338

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I am so screwed. This engine needs a full rebuild and its just not worth it. I had a post here about needing pistons : https://forum.ih8mud.com/diesel-tech-24-volts-systems/459710-source-2h-pistons.html

I got alfin pistons from Australia, a gasket kit, replaced one rocker arm that was pitted, and just ordered rod bearings because one bearing was starting to delaminate. Everything was all good I thought. I finished ridge reaming the cyclinders and honed a few of them.

Today I was cleaning off the rest of the headgasket and found that my #1 liner is trashed. Some of the protrusion above the block by the precup is worn away. Its strange becuase its really jagged. I had thought of pulling the engine and doing liners but they are another $400, plus I called a machine shop and they want $500-600 to install them. I dont know what to do now. I have allready spent $1000 in parts. Now a full rebuild is going to be $2-3K. I'm just screwed at this point. I only drove the truck for two weeks before I diagnosed it. I dont know what to do now. Caveat emptor!!

IMGP1177.jpg

IMGP1179.jpg
 
vwluv10338

vwluv10338

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I mean how does this happen? Did I do it with the head off and not notice it? I would think I would remember breaking off the ridge.
I took this pic with my Iphone, I think its the best one. While I was outside I noticed the marks in the precup area, I dont see that on any other cyclinder.
liner.jpg
 
amaurer

amaurer

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I'm surprised that the thickness of the "ridge" poking up from the liner, in the undestroyed regions - I thought it should be as thick as the liner itself???
 
R

RufusTheDufus

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Judging by the color of the steel and the carbon built up around it I doubt you cracked it off removing the head.

What does the block look like around the other precups? That area in your photos is very discolored.
 
vwluv10338

vwluv10338

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Judging by the color of the steel and the carbon built up around it I doubt you cracked it off removing the head.

What does the block look like around the other precups? That area in your photos is very discolored.

The precups all have small cracks. All cylinders look the same.

I have a theory now. This cylinder is the one I had problems with. I had a problem with the ridge reamer and it cut the cyclinder a little. I honed it with a ball hone and it took the scratches out but I think I took too much metal off. I was pushing the cylinder wear limit anyway and I think the bore was a little egged. I think that part of the cylinder was worn and I blew through that ledge with the hone. If you look at the last pic you can see the ridge seems thicker on the left side of the pic and it tapers to where it cracked off.
 
rchalmers3

rchalmers3

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I don't think you did that and I agree that the material looks fragile.

$3k for a fresh motor does not sound like a hosing. It might if you only wanted to spend a few hundred, but from where I am sitting it sounds like a good investment.

Rick
 
V

VTCDN

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Ridge REAMER is a rude tool, and it does damage.
Ball hone is NOT that , It is a de-glazier only. =
images


This is a hand held hone or a hone that is not driven from a machine.
It makes the circle round.
AN-8156750.jpg



Yes you have created a larger job. Just a WAG , overheated ,caused low comp on the cyl due to leaking gasket.

Either way , that liner protrusion is damage ,it sits on the inside of the headgasket's fire ring. It kinda looks like the precup was not held in place tight enough (pre-load) and it did the major movement damage.

VT
 
vwluv10338

vwluv10338

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Ridge REAMER is a rude tool, and it does damage.
Ball hone is NOT that , It is a de-glazier only. =

This is a hand held hone or a hone that is not driven from a machine.
It makes the circle round.


Yes you have created a larger job. Just a WAG , overheated ,caused low comp on the cyl due to leaking gasket.

Either way , that liner protrusion is damage ,it sits on the inside of the headgasket's fire ring. It kinda looks like the precup was not held in place tight enough (pre-load) and it did the major movement damage.

VT

From what I can tell this was my low compression:
IMGP1175.jpg


I swear that ridge was fine after I reamed it. I did that a few weeks ago while I was waiting for parts. I have sat in that engine bay and measured that bore so many times I swear I would have noticed that. I honed it last wednesday at night using a light and didnt notice it till today. I have this pic but I cant tell since the headgasket it still on. That flex hone is what I used. I just wanted to clean up the cylinder for the new rings to seat.

IMGP1170.jpg
 
H

haryv

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It depends on your budget. Also, consider the fact, how long would a full engine rebuild for 2-3 last? 10 years? 15? 2-3k is not alot of money especially for a diesel. A diesel is a very very good investment that has a very good rate of return. My truck with its 3b is 24 years old, original engine 400km plus.
 
V

VTCDN

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The head gasket is a major tell all.
Just looking at the now posted picture , #1 precup land area is not the same as the rest back till #4 .

Whatever you do , and your past doing "I only drove the truck for two weeks before I diagnosed it."
Get the RAD to a real rad shop for cleaning and a heat transfer test/checking.

VT
 
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derelict

derelict

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I dont think that you did that with a ridge reamer. Having personally had to replace a liner on a V8 due to a bad reaming job (eccentric), I know it is true that a ridge reamer can do some damage but unless you spun the reamer at the top of the bore and didnt move it anywhere and then wedged the reamer out, I dont see how you couldve done that. Whats also interesting is how the liner itself is so much thicker than the bit that is sticking out.

Having personally seen his truck, I agree that the low compression in number 1 is the result of worn rings. The number one pistons ring lands were completely beaten open and way out of spec.

This sucks man. Im guessing that the H55F for the 2H is different than the one in the 3B? There is a rebuilt 3B in the classifieds section for less than $3k. You wouldnt be missing out on much power with the switch.
 
R

RufusTheDufus

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This sucks man. Im guessing that the H55F for the 2H is different than the one in the 3B? There is a rebuilt 3B in the classifieds section for less than $3k. You wouldnt be missing out on much power with the switch.

Not only are the input shafts different, the exhaust exits on the other side of the engine so you have to relocate things like the vacuum tank. The engine mounts are different as well. It can certainly be done but it's almost as much work as switching to a V8.
 
canucksafari

canucksafari

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Sorry to hear about this. I did try to warn you a few times in the other thread that a full rebuild would be likely, but it really is the pits to hear you have already outlaid some good money $ in parts before you knew the extent of the problems. I think you would be best off to buy a second hand 2H or a 12HT. Then just try to return the parts you haven't used or sell them on MUD. It takes some time but deals continue to come up all the time. A whole running HJ61 (12HT) just sold here last week. It was listed at $4500 on CraigsList. EBI in Port Moody has a 2H for sale. I am sure Steve would love to sell it. Good luck.
 
vwluv10338

vwluv10338

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Sorry to hear about this. I did try to warn you a few times in the other thread that a full rebuild would be likely, but it really is the pits to hear you have already outlaid some good money $ in parts before you knew the extent of the problems. I think you would be best off to buy a second hand 2H or a 12HT. Then just try to return the parts you haven't used or sell them on MUD. It takes some time but deals continue to come up all the time. A whole running HJ61 (12HT) just sold here last week. It was listed at $4500 on CraigsList. EBI in Port Moody has a 2H for sale. I am sure Steve would love to sell it. Good luck.

I know I know. You also said go 12HT but I don't see that in the cards. The last one on this forum sold for $6k. Even if I get a 12HT or a used 2H I am still looking at a used engine with hundreds of thousands of miles on it. The only one I would have considered was that 2H for $1300 or so with videos of it starting at -15 degrees. Even then, its used.

I already have alfin pistons and a gasket kit. $600
Still need:
I was quoted $395 AUD shipped for Jap liners.
Liner install and bore/hone $600
Add a bearing set, ~$500?
precups ~$350 ($50-60 each right?)
My head looks ok but I guess I should tear it down and at least magnaflux.
~$2400 so far
 
canucksafari

canucksafari

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Yes, a used engine is just a used engine. But a rebuilt engine is also an unknown until it has been proven. I know this guy in the UK who had his TD4.2 rebuilt and like you some bits done by himself and some bits done by a shop. I can't remember exactly what got messed up but something went wrong and he had an expensive rebuild that didn't work. He still ended up going and buying a used engine. Shops only stand behind an engine rebuild if they do all the work themselves. IMO, both used and rebuilt are gambles. Often a used engine is quicker and less expensive in the long run.
 
vwluv10338

vwluv10338

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That engine is for sale in this board as well. Believe me I have looked at most 2Hs currently FS. That one has 450k on it in unknown condition except that is was supposed to have been running well when it ws pulled 8 months or so ago. That falls back to the used engine debate. Is it worth spending $1500 after shipping for an engine that may have problems. I bought this truck under the info that the truck ran fine and everything was ok.
 
canucksafari

canucksafari

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That's why I was also suggesting you consider buying from a business that parts out Cruisers. At least they take the time to check condition and give you some data such as compression. Also consider that if you buy a used engine, you either have a bunch of spare parts on hand or spare parts to sell to off-set your costs. For instance, most injector pumps sell for atleast couple hundred dollars or more.
 
vwluv10338

vwluv10338

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That's why I was also suggesting you consider buying from a business that parts out Cruisers. At least they take the time to check condition and give you some data such as compression. Also consider that if you buy a used engine, you either have a bunch of spare parts on hand or spare parts to sell to off-set your costs. For instance, most injector pumps sell for atleast couple hundred dollars or more.

It's funny. The engine in my truck came from cruiserparts.net with a supposedly 167k km. It was purchased with a new H55 for $6500. It smoked since the first time it was installed. I guess the first owner of this truck that did the swap was the first to get screwed.

I am looking into donor vehicles. I have no way to tow them. I thought about the one in Toronto but again I'm not sure how that would work at the border since it's an 87 and again can't tow it.
 
canucksafari

canucksafari

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I see Dan, one of our associate club members is parting some of his rigs in Kamloops. He might have a 2H.

Just checked Used Victoria for you too and found two HJ60 and the seller is asking $6K for them both. 1987 Toyota landcruiser Sooke, Victoria Not sure if you have room; but with older vehicles, it sure is nice to have a parts rig, especially if the vehicle was never sold in your country.

If you are searching don't just stick with Craigslist. Try some of the other classified sites and focus on searching major Canadian cities. Also, try different search terms: 2H, HJ60, HJ61, 12HT, Land Cruiser, LandCruiser, Landcruzer, etc. Many people selling their old Land Cruisers in Canada don't have a clue on what they are selling and often misspell the key words themselves. Take the used Victoria ad as an example. Land Cruiser was spelled as Landcruiser. No where did it say HJ60 or 2H. But it did clearly say "1987 Toyota landcruiser" and "six cylender diesel", so you know they are HJ60s with 2H engines.
 

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