Knocking somewhere in serpentine belt system?

[OteyCrisman]

I have a 2004 LX470. Cranked it up last night and heard awful knocking sound from engine. It's my wife's car so I asked when the hell it started sounding like that? "I don't know, today?" was her response, smh.

I popped the hood and was looking over into the fan/belt area and honestly felt nervous like something was about to break off and hit me in the face..that's what it sounded like. Thinking back on it now, seemed like the fan might've looked a tad wobbly?

Just took the belt off and cranked it, no issues. Upon removing the belt, I see a pile of metal shavings behind the fan pulley. See pics. I also found a bigger piece of flattened metal down lower that looked as if it had sheared off from somewhere, probably from above and same place as the shavings were found.

So what should I be looking at and checking now? Something wrong with the fan? I never cranked it again after last night, except for just now with the belt off. The belt is still currently off.

Need to get this figured out as we're supposed to be taking that car on the road Tuesday for Christmas..worried I may need a new something or another and will end up having to rent a car for the week. I don't want to do that.

Any help greatly appreciated, I don't know a whole lot about mechanics!!

 

[OteyCrisman]

In reading some older threads on here, I'm thinking fan bracket needs replacing. I can grab a fan blade and lift up and watch the pulley move with me.

 

[RapidRob]

Yes, it's at least your fan bracket. Confusing name as it is the bracket,bearing and pulley.
Some of the bolts are about halfway into a timing belt job, it's worth doing the whole job if it hasn't been done recently.
Not something you should tear into right before a trip if you're not comfortable wrenching on it.
Get out your credit card to pay someone competent to do it quickly and correctly, or rent a car for that trip.
Don't drive it any more than to a nearby shop. you can do lots more expensive damage.

 

[Aracobuilt]

Yes, my guess is also the fan bracket. You are lucky to have caught it on time. I have heard on this forum of people suffering a broken bracket while driving causing the fan blades to destroy the radiator and other components in the engine bay. Don't use it until the issues is taken care of.

 

[OteyCrisman]

Yes, it's at least your fan bracket. Confusing name as it is the bracket,bearing and pulley.
Some of the bolts are about halfway into a timing belt job, it's worth doing the whole job if it hasn't been done recently.
Not something you should tear into right before a trip if you're not comfortable wrenching on it.
Get out your credit card to pay someone competent to do it quickly and correctly, or rent a car for that trip.
Don't drive it any more than to a nearby shop. you can do lots more expensive damage.

I'd come to the same conclusion this afternoon that the move is to get the timing belt and water pump done now as well. Previous owner estimated he did tb service around 140-145k..I'm sitting at 235k now so it's time.

Debating whether to drive it to mechanic shop about 4-5 miles away or have him come tow it. He's got a wrecker. Or could I still drive it over there on a cold night without the belt? I realize it'd be missing those components the belt is responsible for, idea being the cold weather could keep the engine cool enough just to get there...is it drivable like that?

Thanks guys

 

[2001LC]

If you run engine with belt on. You risk the fan bracket shaft shearing off. The fan, fan shroud, radiator, etc. may then be damaged.

You can take off serp belt and drive, short distance. With as few stops as possible. Start driving the moment cold engine started. Before starting cold engine. Make very sure while engine cold, coolant to top in radiator under cap.

Your water pump is still running. But radiator isn't shedding heat from coolant effectively. Other than air passes through rad fins as you drive. Faster you drive, the more air passes through, but engine heats up more the high the RPM. 25 to 45 MPH is sweet spot on level ground. Run cabin heat, full hot, fan high, out side air (fresh air) at least rear wind wing windows open. Will help shed some heat. It would be best, if you monitor engine coolant temp (ECT), via tech stream. Stop and shut down engine, as you get over ~200f. ~200f since when you shut down, ECT will still climb for up to 20 minutes.

Also note: The cabin fan, as will any accessory that's on, will run down battery. If voltage drops to low, engine will die. So spare using even HVAC fan, until after engine temp start to raise.

 

[OteyCrisman]

If you run engine with belt on. You risk the fan bracket shaft shearing off. The fan, fan shroud, radiator, etc. may then be damaged.

You can take off serp belt and drive, short distance. With as few stops as possible. Start driving the moment cold engine started. Before starting cold engine. Make very sure while engine cold, coolant to top in radiator under cap.

Your water pump is still running. But radiator isn't shedding heat from coolant effectively. Other than air passes through rad fins as you drive. Faster you drive, the more air passes through, but engine heats up more the high the RPM. 25 to 45 MPH is sweet spot on level ground. Run cabin heat, full hot, fan high, out side air (fresh air) at least rear wind wing windows open. Will help shed some heat. It would be best, if you monitor engine coolant temp (ECT), via tech stream. Stop and shut down engine, as you get over ~200f. ~200f since when you shut down, ECT will still climb for up to 20 minutes.

Also note: The cabin fan, as will any accessory that's on, will run down battery. If voltage drops to low, engine will die. So spare using even HVAC fan, until after engine temp start to raise.

Thank you for the instructions. I think it'll be easiest to just have him come tow it to his shop tomorrow. Will definitely be renting a car this week.

At first I thought this was a terribly unlucky time for this to happen, but I'm so glad we didn't get out on the interstate Tuesday and have the fan break off and destroy a bunch of other stuff!

Any other recommendations to replace other than the timing belt, water pump, and fan bracket? Have mechanic check all the other pulleys, stuff like that? Also do you have a ballpark number what kind of cost I'm looking at for this job as it is now? I haven't been to this guy before but he comes highly recommended by a few different people I know and he knows his stuff apparently. So I feel good about him.

 

[2001LC]

Thank you for the instructions. I think it'll be easiest to just have him come tow it to his shop tomorrow. Will definitely be renting a car this week.

At first I thought this was a terribly unlucky time for this to happen, but I'm so glad we didn't get out on the interstate Tuesday and have the fan break off and destroy a bunch of other stuff!

Any other recommendations to replace other than the timing belt, water pump, and fan bracket? Have mechanic check all the other pulleys, stuff like that? Also do you have a ballpark number what kind of cost I'm looking at for this job as it is now? I haven't been to this guy before but he comes highly recommended by a few different people I know and he knows his stuff apparently. So I feel good about him.

Are your sure you want to ask me that, just after holiday expenses.

Every thing depend on condition, and when last done.

If he uses the Aisin T-belt kit w/tensioner. It comes with all T-belt stuff.
One thing I do thing nobody else does. See video below

If serpentine belt tension pulley bearing, at all questionable. Have the whole serp belt tensioner replace, which comes with pulley.
We typically will replace fan clutch, if older and run on wobble fan bracket for very long. Which yours has very likely been wobbling for some time.
Serp idler pulley.
Serp belt, if aged or damaged in any way.
Coolant service (Heater tees, thermostat, rad cap & Coolant flush). Also hoses, leaks or pitting where hose attach..
All vacuum lines loose, hard or cracking
Spark plugs. along with Coil boots & seal. Nice to time every 90k or 10 year.
Head cover bolt, retorque to 54INCH-lbf.
Throttle body, MAF and battery post clean up (Yearly).
OF&L. 5K or 1 yr
Power steering flush and weeping hose service.
Transmission flush.

Should at least inspect:
Rack & pinion, TRE inner and outer.
Wheel bearings (any play)
Ball joints.
Brake fluid condition. Flush with Toyota fluid.
Brake pads.
Brake master control wire/leads. (inside boot at bottom of ABS unit (black box on brake master))
Breathers.
Gear lubes and any leaks.

Should I go on!

About 1 billion dollar with current hyper inflation.
Seriously prices vary by location. What to have done and when. Depends if damaging other components or reliability concern if not done, safety related is at top of list. Then look at time and funds..

 

[2001LC]