HELP! WEIRD STARTER ISSUE? (1 Viewer)

[kindoflikerambo]

Hey Cruiser Bro's and Broette's,

I have a 1966 (likely a 1964) fj40. Stock (except) HEI mechanical advance ignition from Man-a-Fre. I think it's called a lightning strike or something like that for our purposes. Any help, thoughts or directions would be helpful.

Symptoms:
1) No power to starter through igniton key switch.

2) When I "jump" my starter from solenoid to starter it does not engage and just spins but seems to be getting power.

Attempted diagnostics:
1) Replaced starter and new starter did the exact same thing. Had old starter tested and test came back that original starter was OK.
2) Battery is good.
3) Fuses are good
4) Old ignition switch (at the key) tested and has continuity when I turn the key.
5) Rolled it in gear to see if flywheel would do something with no response.

Help: Are these two problems related? No power to turn it over from ignition switch but even when jumped from solenoid starter doesn't engage and just spins.

Any tips troubleshooting tips would be helpful. Thank you!

Gene

 

[kindoflikerambo]

The starter ground wire goes to the frame as mentioned above. See the two red circles on the left, and red line tracing the wire below. The red circle on the right is obviously the positive from the battery.

Loving these pics! Thanks! I'm going to try to troubleshoot this week and will report back. Will this effect my key not turning the ignition though? (See full write-up above) Thanks everyone!

 

[kindoflikerambo]

The bendix could be stuck too, a few taps with a hammer might get it going in the short term.

Tried this to no avail. Both new starters so... ? Thanks!

 

[73FJ40]

@kindoflikerambo .

The picture in post 3. You have to jump from the spade to the battery cable post. That provides 12 volts to the starter solenoid. The starter solenoid has to be energized to push the starter drive gear into the flywheel teeth, and connect power to the starter motor.

When you jump the battery cable directly to the starter, all you do is spin the motor since the solenoid isn't activated.

 

[kerplunk]

Jump the starter from the spade terminal!!!

The drive gear not popping out when the motor engages is news to me, but sure sounds like exactly what's happening.

If that works...

Pull the cover off the steering column by the ignition switch, there are 4 wires going to the switch, 1: 12v hot, 2: accessories, 3: ignition (coil, regulator and idle thingy on the carb) and the fourth is the other end of the wire to the spade terminal on the starter. Check the starter wire is getting 12v there when you turn the key to make sure the switch is working. (on mine, there is nothing covering the end of the wires soldered to the switch, can poke a test lead right onto them).

Checking and cleaning the grounding on a 45 year old vehicle is always a good start for any issue... But if the starter turns the engine when you apply voltage to the correct terminal, the ground is probably good enough for now...

 

[73FJ40]

@kerplunk @kindoflikerambo

You guys should consult the factory service manual (FSM) when you have a problem.....

The solenoid provides two functions: Closing the circuit to activate the motor, and move the lever to push the starter drive into the flywheel teeth. In the illustration below, the "50" terminal is the spade terminal on the solenoid.

 

[kindoflikerambo]

You all are awesome! It's been super cold here and I'm in the process of moving so I haven't tried these recommendations yet but I really think you guys are getting me closer to the info I need. Thabks again for taking time to post up diagrams and providing meaningful explanations to me. Give me some heat! I want to get this bad boy back on the road!

Thanks!

 

[Living in the Past]

Outside change a tooth is broken or worn on the ring gear on the flywheel. Only if this happened all of a sudden and hasn't been started since. The small gear in the starter slides and engages the ring when starting. If the old starter tested good mechanical issue not electrical could be the problem. Easy way to test this is put the transmission in third gear. Push while someone pushes in the clutch. While moving have them release the clutch to move the flywheel gear enough to have the starter engage different teeth on the ring gear. Most likely not the issue but it is something easy to check. I have actually had an old starter and old F135 engine that had this problem.

 

[FJ40newmechanic]

These might help show what is going on with the Starter wiring and inside the unit.