Fuel efficiency.

[GojiraFJ60]

Hi fellas.

I saw a video on YouTube just a little while ago that got me thinking, and the video was discussing how the EPA is upping the allowance of ethanol in the fuel that we will inevitably be using in our old trucks, to 15% from 10% and the potential issues that may be coming along with that.

I suppose my question is this: What are guys doing in the community to “circumvent” these changes if anything, or how do we go about navigating these modern fuels? Is it something we can manage with regular maintenance?

Let’s discuss, I’d like to hear from you guys with experience and what you guys have to say to guys like myself who are new.

 

[Lead Head]

Can't speak for a 60, but an FJ62 will probably be fine. O2 sensor will be able to compensate enough. Fuel efficiency will suffer of course. The rubber fuel lines (if original) may also suffer a bit. For a 62, the only real efficiency gains to be had would be to increase engine compression and modify the valvebody so the torque converter locks up at a lower speed.

Of course the biggest gain to efficiency will simply be to drive slower. It takes 8x the power to push through the air for every doubling of your speed - so fuel economy drops off rapidly as speed increases. ICE vehicles have an interesting quirk where engines/transmissions gain efficiency as load increases. So what that means is that any ICE vehicle typically gains fuel economy as speed increases, up to a certain point, then the aerodynamic load starts increasing at a rate faster than powertrain efficiency goes up causing an overall drop in fuel economy.

The long story short: Older vehicles like a 62 series will typically achieve peak fuel economy around 50-55 MPH (probably 53 MPH when the converter locks on a 62). Fuel economy will start rapidly drop once you go over 60-65 MPH.

Personal Example: I've been driving a Chevy 2500HD 6.0. It will genuinely pull about 17 MPG at a steady 55 MPH. Going 75 plunges it down to around 13-14.

 

[Devils Paw 80]

It should be simple enough to just not choose this option. Some gas stations even sell ethanol free fuel. Of course it's significantly more expensive. I personally wouldn't run the 15% in an old carbureted truck like the FJ60.

 

[AndersBror]

It's only a temporary measure to help with the higher cost of fuel....and will only last 20 days.
EPA Fortifies Domestic Fuel Supply, Provides Americans with Relief at the Pump by Approving Nationwide E15 and Removing Boutique Fuel Markets for E10 | US EPA - https://www.epa.gov/newsreleases/epa-fortifies-domestic-fuel-supply-provides-americans-relief-pump-approving-nationwide

The emergency fuel waiver will temporarily waive the summer low volatility requirements and blending limitations for gasoline to provide additional flexibility to the fuel marketplace. This will increase fuel supply and provide a variety of gasoline fuel blends to choose from without changing environmental protections already in place. E15 is currently offered at over 3,000 gas stations nationwide, where it serves as a more affordable choice for Americans. Without this action, E15 gasoline cannot be used by roughly half of the country this summer. Additionally, EPA is also waiving federal enforcement of all state “boutique” fuel requirements for gasoline, allowing the production and distribution of gasoline with 9 to 15 percent ethanol content at a single common Reid Vapor Pressure (RVP) standard of 10 psi across the nation. EPA’s actions will go into effect on May 1, 2026, for most states, and will initially remain in place through May 20, 2026. This 20-day window is the maximum number of days allowed under the CAA.

 

[GojiraFJ60]

It should be simple enough to just not choose this option. Some gas stations even sell ethanol free fuel. Of course it's significantly more expensive. I personally wouldn't run the 15% in an old carbureted truck like the FJ60.

Oh yeah for sure. And I was speaking with a mechanic that I know about it yesterday as well and he even relayed to me that there are some gas stations that sell ethanol free; I actually didn’t even know that, but I’m definitely gonna start looking more closely.
If I can avoid it, I’ll definitely try to.

 

[1911]

Oh yeah for sure. And I was speaking with a mechanic that I know about it yesterday as well and he even relayed to me that there are some gas stations that sell ethanol free; I actually didn’t even know that, but I’m definitely gonna start looking more closely.
If I can avoid it, I’ll definitely try to.

Murphy (Wal-mart gas stations) sells ethanol-free gas here in Texas.

 

[albert110]

I had a question relating to this: What mods could be made to this engine to make it more robust & suited for ethanol-supplemented fuels? replacing the flexible fuel lines are the obvious step one, thinking more along the lines of taking advantage of some of the good things about ethanol additives that are known risk factors on the 2F engine. As far as I understand ethanol supplemented fuels run better at higher compression ratios than standard gas, are protective against knocking and detonation, and have better engine cooling properties from the ethanol. My 60 has almost 340k on it and I'm noticing a miss that I am fairly certain comes from worn cam lobes so I've been throwing around rebuilding the engine (vs. driving another 100k on it, which I can also do). wondering what other changes would make sense if running ethanol fuels was an objective

 

[CJF]

I had a question relating to this: What mods could be made to this engine to make it more robust & suited for ethanol-supplemented fuels?

AI, so take it with a grain of salt:

Key Reasons Ethanol Damages Older Vehicles:

• Fuel System Degradation: Older rubber hoses, fuel pumps, and carburetor gaskets (accelerator pumps) are not resistant to ethanol, leading to hardening, cracking, and eventual leaks.
• Corrosion:Ethanol attracts moisture, leading to "phase separation" where water and ethanol sink to the bottom of the tank, causing corrosion of aluminum, magnesium, and steel components.
• Rust & Varnish: Water absorbed by ethanol causes rust inside metal tanks. It can also cause gasoline to degrade faster during storage, creating fuel tank sludge and varnish that clogs carburetors.
• Performance Issues: Ethanol has less energy than gasoline, causing older vehicles to run "lean" (less fuel, more air), which can cause overheating and poor fuel economy.
• Filter Clogging: Because ethanol is a solvent, it can clean out years of varnish in an old tank, resulting in clogged fuel filters.

 

[albert110]

Yup - direct experience with most of those issues. Nice thing is most of that can be solved for without messing with the heads or anything. Replacing the flexible lines, adjusting the mixture, recurving the dizzy, and if you're really worried about clogging in the carb you could add a fuel cutoff. I don't run my 60 too often any more so I worry more about varnish in the carb.
I was thinking more along the lines of increasing the compression ratio and porting the heads to compensate for the decreased energy density of E15 fuels and whether that could be done in a way that retains the robustness of the motor & sets it up for long term exposure to a different fuel type. I guess the biggest question is whether any combination of mods could actually make the 2F run better on E15 or if it would be a waste of time. More out of curiosity's sake than anything.

 

[GojiraFJ60]

Murphy (Wal-mart gas stations) sells ethanol-free gas here in Texas.

I hadn’t even thought of that (I usually go to Speedway for my daily), but I did a google search and found a few RaceTracs, QuikTrips, and Shells have it either labeled on pumps or a sign; and still relatively close.

 

[sogafarm]

If you’re really concerned about it, there are several youtube videos showing how to separate the ethanol from the gasoline using water. Pour a set amount of water in a see through container, then add the ethanol gas. Shake it up and the water separates the ethanol from the gasoline. Siphon the water from the bottom and your left with pure gasoline.

 

[kody472]

This app works pretty well. It’s sourced through the public. I’ve added my share of stations around me that sell ethanol free gas.

Pure Gas App - App Store

Download Pure Gas by Jeffrey Jackson on the App Store. See screenshots, ratings and reviews, user tips, and more apps like Pure Gas.

apps.apple.com

 

[GojiraFJ60]

If you’re really concerned about it, there are several youtube videos showing how to separate the ethanol from the gasoline using water. Pour a set amount of water in a see through container, then add the ethanol gas. Shake it up and the water separates the ethanol from the gasoline. Siphon the water from the bottom and your left with pure gasoline.

Yeeeeeah I saw a YouTube short about that exact thing. It’s a good thing to keep in my “back pocket” if I find myself in a situation somewhere.

 

[GojiraFJ60]

This app works pretty well. It’s sourced through the public. I’ve added my share of stations around me that sell ethanol free gas.

Pure Gas App - App Store

Download Pure Gas by Jeffrey Jackson on the App Store. See screenshots, ratings and reviews, user tips, and more apps like Pure Gas.

apps.apple.com

Nice looking out I’ll be downloading that.

 

[ceylonfj40nut]

Clicked eagerly thinking you broke the code of fuel efficient land cruisers. Ah there’s my ice cream on the counter. Carry on.

 

[Chamba]

I run non-ethanol 'marine gas' in all my carburetted engines. It's easy to find in Florida (all Wawas have it and many independent stations as well), but I did that in New Mexico as well where many of the rural stations offer it.

Once you find a station in your area with non-ethanol, just plan your fueling around that. Using ethanol occasionally when you're travelling won't damage it too badly.

Since running non-ethanol 90% of the time, I've not had to rebuild a carb yet (as opposed to probably every other year running ethanol).

 

[GojiraFJ60]

Clicked eagerly thinking you broke the code of fuel efficient land cruisers. Ah there’s my ice scream on the counter. Carry on.

 

[GojiraFJ60]

I run non-ethanol 'marine gas' in all my carburetted engines. It's easy to find in Florida (all Wawas have it and many independent stations as well), but I did that in New Mexico as well where many of the rural stations offer it.

Once you find a station in your area with non-ethanol, just plan your fueling around that. Using ethanol occasionally when you're travelling won't damage it too badly.

Since running non-ethanol 90% of the time, I've not had to rebuild a carb yet (as opposed to probably every other year running ethanol).

Once I get around to doing my carb rebuild, I imagine it might be a little gunky. I don’t know at all what kind of fuel has been run through it with two prior owners. But I just want to give it proper treatment as best I can.

 

[bhsdriller]

Non existent here

Anything with a carb just have to run often

 

[TheBussman]

If you’re really concerned about it, there are several youtube videos showing how to separate the ethanol from the gasoline using water. Pour a set amount of water in a see through container, then add the ethanol gas. Shake it up and the water separates the ethanol from the gasoline. Siphon the water from the bottom and your left with pure gasoline.

sure that does work BUT now you have no octane improver in your fuel and it's probably 80 octane or less now. it's going to knock like crazy unless your going to add lead or MTBE to it.