Belt Confusion - 3FE, 8/1992 (1 Viewer)

Joined
Jan 8, 2005
Messages
507
Location
Crestwood, MO
Dayco online says 4 belts, which is what I have.
FSM maintenance section refers to tension on 3 belts.
If I only put on 3 belts, I have spare pulleys. Am I supposed to have spare pulleys?

Also, since the crank only has 3 pulleys, the 4th belt must NOT run from the crank.

I broke down the parts as follows:
8 Axles:
  1. AC, 1 pulley, rear position
  2. AC Idler, 1 pulley, rear position
  3. Fan, 2 pulleys, mid & front positions
  4. Alternator, 2 pulleys, mid & front positions
  5. Crank, 3 pulleys: rear, mid & front positions
  6. Idler, 1 pulley, front position
  7. Power Steering, 1 pulley, front position
  8. Air Pump, 1 pulley, front position

I went on Dayco's website and bought 4 belts.
2 for rear & middle position are easy to figure out:
1. REAR: Dayco #17465, AC, AC Idler, & Crank
2. MID: Dayco #22400, Fan, Alternator, & Crank

Last 2 I can't figure out. They have to go in the front possition. Online Dayco says:
3. Dayco #22528, Power Steering & Idler (I assume & Crank wouldn't turn without it), specs are 52-3/4" long.
4. Dayco #22655, Alternator, Power Steering, Air Pump, Idler, specs are 65-1/2" long.

Problem is they have Power Steering twice, but there's only 1 pulley. They have Fan once, but there's 2 pulleys.

I'm going to try and put on the large belt (65-1/2") across the crank, Alternator, Air Pump, Power Steering, & Idler. I'll see if the last belt will fill in the remaining open pulleys.

I'm in it deep, so took pictures with the fan & shroud off.

1st pic: DS - Air Pump (far right, 1 pulley); Alternator (Under Air Pump, 2 pulleys); Fan (left, 2 pulleys)
P1010128.jpg

2nd pic: PS - Power Steering (far left, 1 pulley, cut-off in pic); AC (left, 1 pulley, cut-off by Power steering); Idler (1 pulley, only for adjustment, see whole thing); AC Idler (1 pulley, can't really see it, it's new so clean black).
P1010127.jpg


Last is good pic of 3 pulley crank.
P1010129.jpg

Help please. I've been screwing with this for a few hours now.

Thanks,

Joe
P1010127.jpg
P1010128.jpg
P1010129.jpg
 

jynx

Turd Herder
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Joined
Apr 24, 2010
Messages
9,372
Location
Eagleville, TN
Might check the 3fe section for some pictures. I know that the alternator gets a double belt and I think one of them drives the air pump but does not go to the crank. I only remember that because if you eliminate the air pump you end up with a belt missing on the alternator.

Truck isn't handy or I would go look myself and post back.

Will try to later if it isn't too dark.
 
Joined
Jan 8, 2005
Messages
507
Location
Crestwood, MO
Does Fan have empty pulley?

Can you check to see if 1 pulley on the fan is empty?

That's the only way I can figure it works. The 65-1/2" is LONG and can ONLY go crank - Power Steering - Air Pump. Along the way it'll hit the Alternator & Idler.

Per the breakdown, there are 6 things in the front position:
  1. Crank
  2. Air Pump
  3. Power Steering
  4. Alternator
  5. Idler
  6. Fan

Last man out due to being in the middle is Fan. This is strange. I understand the alternator having 2 pulleys since it's pretty important. But I figured the Fan would have 2 also since it's REAL important.

YOU 3FE FOLKS! CAN YOU TAKE A LOOK AT YOUR FAN PULLEYS? ONE EMPTY?

One with response (can't see your name while posting), thanks for the feedback. I'll bet the folks who disconnected their air pump or bypassed it needed a special belt.

Thanks!

Joe
 
Joined
Mar 25, 2005
Messages
2,131
Location
Edmond, Oklahoma
Joe,
On our 92, the crank pulley has 3 grooves like yours. The closest to the block groove goes to the AC only. The middle one goes to the water pump and alternator. The one closest to the radiator goes to the PS pump, an idler pulley and water pump. We chose to use a shorter belt on that one to bypass the smog pump and outer alternator groove. The longer belt we are not using now is I believe a 70" belt (gates part # TR22657 and 15A1670).

Steve
 
Joined
Mar 9, 2012
Messages
1,091
Location
AZ
92 3fe.

There are three belts,

1: the big one goes toward the front of the crank pulley around the idler pulley around the power steering pulley over to what I think is the air pump then around the front of the alternator pulley.

2: the next smallest belt is the fan belt, it goes around the alternator around the crank pulley and around the pulley that attaches to the fan clutch.

3: then there's the AC belt which is I believe on the backmost position of the crank pulley and then goes around the AC compressor.

Don't forget the tension pulleys on the power steering belt and the AC belts.

And good luck.
 
Joined
Jan 8, 2005
Messages
507
Location
Crestwood, MO
Ding, ding, ding, we have a winner. Alleycats!

Note you only say "fan" once, even though it's a double pulley. So the front Fan/Waterpump pulley will be empty. To reiterate (clockwise starting with the crank):
1. FRONT: Crank, Idler, PS, AP, Alt.
2. MID: Crank, Fan, Alt
3. BACK: Crank, AC Idler, AC

All 8 axles have been hit (Crank, PS, AP, Alt, Fan, Idler, AC, & AC Idler).
Only 10 of the 11 pulleys have been filled leaving one of the Fan's pulleys empty.

Hints:
1. PS: My PS line was hitting the AC when trying to loosen to get the belt on. Simply loosen, rotate pipe out of the way, & tighten. Give much more slack to get belt on.
2. Alt: After loosening tensioner, there is still adjustment space. I took the "tensioning bolt" out to get more slack which made installing the belt easier. Bolt is pretty easy to put back on.
3. AC belt: Skinnier than the other 2 as is the AC idler. I put the AC Idler in the Idler spot & luckily noticed this when putting the belt on :)doh:).They are the same diameter, so easy to make a mistake.
4. Idlers: Check bearings & replace if necessary.

Now in about 8 years when I throw a belt and go to replace ALL belts, I'll have a reference to make the job quicker.

Thanks!

Joe
 
Joined
Sep 11, 2012
Messages
8
Location
Denver, CO
I had similar problems finding good pics and info for replacing belts on a 3FE / FJ80 cruiser when I was attempting it a couple months ago. I made this diagram mostly for the benefit of people who, like myself, hadn’t found an Owner’s Manual yet and thought the Haynes Repair Manual was not very helpful.

I know that some have said you don’t need to remove the radiator shroud or fan, but I found it MUCH easier to access some of these bolts (especially the locking bolt on the alternator bracket) after I had unscrewed the plastic radiator shroud and taken the fan off. I just let the fan sit on the bottom of the shroud and I was able to move it around to give me more room. I didn’t have to remove them completely from the engine bay and I didn’t need to touch the battery or its tray either (although I’m sure it would have given me more room).

To get the longest belt on and off (purple one in diagram), I had to slide both the PSP reservoir all the way down (see 3rd photo), loosen the air pump (whatever is above the alternator?) bolt and push it down, and push the alternator all the way inward on its bracket. Even then, I had to get under the truck and pull on it with everything I had in order to slip it off / on the lowest pulley. Not sure if there is an easier way.

As others have recommended, I loosened the a/c compressor locking bolt from the top (having a long breaker bar / special drive belt ratchet is essential to reach this) and I accessed the adjustment bolt by popping out the inner splash guard to the front passenger tire wheel well (see 2nd photo).




Drive Belt Diagram.JPG

ac compressor pulley.JPG

psp pulley.JPG

Belt Parts Nos:
90916-02141(alternator belt)
99332-11180 (A/C belt)
90916-02193 (air/steering pump belt)
Drive Belt Diagram.JPG
ac compressor pulley.JPG
psp pulley.JPG
 
Joined
Dec 8, 2006
Messages
9,895
Location
New Jersey
No Cruiser motor I know of ever had 4 belts.
The AC compressor belt is thinner than the other 2 and can only go on one way.

For the life of me I still don't get why people trust anything but the FSM.
Belts.JPG
 
Joined
Jan 8, 2005
Messages
507
Location
Crestwood, MO
Jon, I have the FSM and looked through it. Didn't find a diagram like this, maybe I missed it.

The confusion comes from extra pulley slot on the WP (or fan) pulley which isn't used.

Without this extra pulley, it would be idiot proof or ALL belts would ONLY go on one way. Like you said the AC is thinner as is the idler pulley (IP) for the AC belt, first one you put on (in the back), no brainer. Middle one is pretty idiot proof since there are ONLY 3 pulleys in the middle position. Front one is confusing with an extra pulley in the front position on the water pump (WP) or fan.

Also, triple adjustment (AL, PS(VP?) & IP) for the long, front belt is goofy. I'd guess the proper way is to get middle & front belts on, tighten the ALternator, get Power Steering (PS or VP in diagram) level with prybar, then tighten the idler.

Also, I recommended taking the Alternator adjustment bolt OFF for extra room. Getting it back together is a PITA, but the 2 front belts go on a lot easier making it worth it.
 
Joined
Sep 11, 2012
Messages
8
Location
Denver, CO
Jonheld,

The IP pulleys don't look like that on my 3FE and as you can see from my hand-drawn diagram above, my belts do not line up like your FSM diagram. I'm pretty sure they were factory-installed belts before I replaced them so I don't think I did it wrong. The FSM is great, but in this case it just wasn't helpful to me.
 
Joined
Jul 23, 2013
Messages
434
Location
Salt Lake City, UT
Sorry to bring up an old thread but I was hoping someone could clear something up for me. This is for a 92 80 series. I know there are three belts total, but some the sounds of it there are 2 different lengths. The longer ~65" and the other two smaller ones. I am confused on the middle (CK-WP-ALT) belt on mine. My belt was so loose it was no longer turning the WP/Fan, and was stretched to a point where I could no longer add any tension from the alternator. I pulled the belt this morning to find it is significantly shorter than my replacement belts (Goodyear Gatorback 17470) and the rear belt (CK-AC-IP). The belt I took off is NAPA 25-22401. It appears to be the right length for hitting all three of the pulleys (al beit stretched). Am I missing something, or are there in fact 3 belt lengths?

Photo: Goodyear belt on the outside, NAPA belt on the inside.

IMG_0984.jpg
 
Joined
Jun 26, 2013
Messages
296
Location
Charleston SC
FranceJohnson I just did mine not to long ago and to be completely honest I bit the bullet and bought the OEM belts... After reading on the forums from so many folks about belt size mismatch (been there) and belt squealing (done that) from the other brands it was just worth it to buy them. The Dayco and Gates and even one other I tried all had crazy sizes and I needed a bigger or smaller... It was immensely frustrating. You will save your self energy and time and probably spend a little more but this was once a 40k+ vehicle right? Best of luck.
 
Joined
Jul 23, 2013
Messages
434
Location
Salt Lake City, UT
After realizing what a pain in would be to change a broken belt outside of a garage or to do the job again, I have no issue with popping for the OEM ones. Likely not all that much more in price, and if its right, and I don't have to go back in and do it again...100% worth it. Anyone have part numbers for the OEM belts? (I have read NAPA makes the Toyota ones?). I have found plenty of info for the 1FZ-FE belts, but aside from the Dayco part numbers Jcarter listed above, I don't see much in the forums.
 
Joined
May 31, 2005
Messages
7,014
Anyone have part numbers for the OEM belts? (I have read NAPA makes the Toyota ones?). I have found plenty of info for the 1FZ-FE belts, but aside from the Dayco part numbers Jcarter listed above, I don't see much in the forums.

Just order from one of our supporting members and be done with it. :meh:
 
Joined
Oct 22, 2013
Messages
245
If you still need the part #'s I can pull out the belts I have waiting for me to have time to work. The supporting member comment is also good, those guys do awesome, I just go with the local dealership since the owner's son / general manager is a huge TLC fan and they provide a discount for members of the local Land Cruiser club.

Anywho, lemme know.

I agree with going OEM, if for no other reason than that my PO put on aftermarket and they're squealing like crazy. I've read that aftermarket tend to squeal, but my own experience is all I have first hand, and they might just be old. Check that, they are old, and that may be part of or the main cause, as they didn't squeal this bad for the first month I drove it.
 
Joined
Aug 5, 2019
Messages
21
Location
North central florida
Dayco online says 4 belts, which is what I have.
FSM maintenance section refers to tension on 3 belts.
If I only put on 3 belts, I have spare pulleys. Am I supposed to have spare pulleys?

Also, since the crank only has 3 pulleys, the 4th belt must NOT run from the crank.

I broke down the parts as follows:
8 Axles:
  1. AC, 1 pulley, rear position
  2. AC Idler, 1 pulley, rear position
  3. Fan, 2 pulleys, mid & front positions
  4. Alternator, 2 pulleys, mid & front positions
  5. Crank, 3 pulleys: rear, mid & front positions
  6. Idler, 1 pulley, front position
  7. Power Steering, 1 pulley, front position
  8. Air Pump, 1 pulley, front position

I went on Dayco's website and bought 4 belts.
2 for rear & middle position are easy to figure out:
1. REAR: Dayco #17465, AC, AC Idler, & Crank
2. MID: Dayco #22400, Fan, Alternator, & Crank

Last 2 I can't figure out. They have to go in the front possition. Online Dayco says:
3. Dayco #22528, Power Steering & Idler (I assume & Crank wouldn't turn without it), specs are 52-3/4" long.
4. Dayco #22655, Alternator, Power Steering, Air Pump, Idler, specs are 65-1/2" long.

Problem is they have Power Steering twice, but there's only 1 pulley. They have Fan once, but there's 2 pulleys.

I'm going to try and put on the large belt (65-1/2") across the crank, Alternator, Air Pump, Power Steering, & Idler. I'll see if the last belt will fill in the remaining open pulleys.

I'm in it deep, so took pictures with the fan & shroud off.

1st pic: DS - Air Pump (far right, 1 pulley); Alternator (Under Air Pump, 2 pulleys); Fan (left, 2 pulleys)
View attachment 687335

2nd pic: PS - Power Steering (far left, 1 pulley, cut-off in pic); AC (left, 1 pulley, cut-off by Power steering); Idler (1 pulley, only for adjustment, see whole thing); AC Idler (1 pulley, can't really see it, it's new so clean black).
View attachment 687334


Last is good pic of 3 pulley crank.
View attachment 687336

Help please. I've been screwing with this for a few hours now.

Thanks,

Joe
View attachment 687334View attachment 687335View attachment 687336
Here is a good source to see how the belts are routed on land cruisers
 

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