bad earth maybe?

[bad_religion_au]

couldn't get the starter in the 40 to spin at all, bump started it, then drove ok, but if i had the stereo going, as soon as i indicated or put the brake lights on, the stereo would cut out, then i put the headlights on, and the ignition cut out...

is this a bad earth, or where else would you guys start looking

 

[66fj40x2]

Man, I hate electrical gremlins! Start with the ground, or Earth or even Mars (sorry). I look at the voltage regulator, alternator and battery next. The alternator and battery are easy to test. I got rid of my voltage regulater and converted to a Chevy alternator so I'm not sure how do check the regulators.

Good Luck

 

[CruisinGA]

Sounds like nothing is getting a significant amount of current.

Check the battery to frame ground, and the frame to engine. (may need to add a frame to engine).

Then check the wire off the battery that feeds the fusebox.

Sounds to me like its not a charging problem, check grounds and connections first, and if you still have problems, pull alternator, have it tested, and replace the voltage reg. The voltage regs aren't worth testing ($27) and they get more erratic with time. Also have battery tested.

 

[bad_religion_au]

Sounds like nothing is getting a significant amount of current.

Check the battery to frame ground, and the frame to engine. (may need to add a frame to engine).

Then check the wire off the battery that feeds the fusebox.

Sounds to me like its not a charging problem, check grounds and connections first, and if you still have problems, pull alternator, have it tested, and replace the voltage reg. The voltage regs aren't worth testing ($27) and they get more erratic with time. Also have battery tested.

your thoughts are well founded. it appears to be charging quite well, as the battery has been flattened twice in the last week (related problem? no idea) but after a run, the battery is charged up nicely according to my battery tester built into my battery charger.

i only have engine - battery line, no frame line (neither does my 45, thought they all came like that )

am going to run a working, known cable from the -ve terminal to the engine, check problem again, then run good cable from +ve to the wire feeding the fusebox, then think about alternators and stuff

would a bad alternator cause troubles when the engine wasn't running (i.e. a fresh charged battery, and brake lights and cd player won't run together?)

 

[CruisinGA]

your thoughts are well founded. it appears to be charging quite well, as the battery has been flattened twice in the last week (related problem? no idea) but after a run, the battery is charged up nicely according to my battery tester built into my battery charger.

Flattening a battery multiple times can kill it. I would have your battery tested by a parts store tester, ie, a really good one, that charges the battery completely, and then load tests, not just voltage tests.

i only have engine - battery line, no frame line (neither does my 45, thought they all came like that )

All the ones I have worked on stateside only have a battery-frame, no battery-engine. You should add a line either from the engine to the frame or from the battery to the frame. If you look under newer vehicles you will notice a LARGE number of grounding straps all over the place. There is a reason for this.

am going to run a working, known cable from the -ve terminal to the engine, check problem again, then run good cable from +ve to the wire feeding the fusebox, then think about alternators and stuff

It is unlikely that your current cables are bad, it is most likely the mating surface, or corrosion inside the connector on the cable. At David's shop here in Atlanta we make battery cables from double aux marine cable with soldered and sealed connectors. This is the best solution. No place for corrosion.

would a bad alternator cause troubles when the engine wasn't running (i.e. a fresh charged battery, and brake lights and cd player won't run together?)

It would not. If this is the case with your lights and cd player, it is most likely a wiring issue. Either grounding or a bad connection to the fusebox from the (+) of the battery. Check the fusible link (should be inline with the lead from the (+) terminal to fusebox). It could be partially blown.


Honestly, this all points to a bad battery, or bad grounding. There are always other possibilities, but I'll bet my .02 that it is a bad ground or bad battery.

 

[Jman]

It is unlikely that your current cables are bad, it is most likely the mating surface, or corrosion inside the connector on the cable.

I had similar symptoms, turned out one of the battery cables wasn't mating properly to the post--there would be current, but not enough to turn the starter sometimes, and when I hit bumps, sometimes things would cut out (stereo) because the jolt would break the contact.

 

[bad_religion_au]

I had similar symptoms, turned out one of the battery cables wasn't mating properly to the post--there would be current, but not enough to turn the starter sometimes, and when I hit bumps, sometimes things would cut out (stereo) because the jolt would break the contact.

i'm l;eaning this way too, last time it started without roll starting it, it only got juice to the starter after i cracked the sh!ts and slammed a couple of doors and the hood.

 

[theo]

You can buy a cheap tool that will "re-grind" the posts and terminals so they make more complete contact. Mine is 25 years old and still working well.

Here's an example from a quick web search:
battery terminal tool

 

[bad_religion_au]

ok, cleaned up the terminals and it cranked and ran, no light/ignition/cd player/ brake light/ indicator problems, drove it for 30 minutes parked it, battery went flat within a couple of hours (maybe a crap battery too, cause i charged it overnight, left it off the charger, and it's gone flat not connected to anything)

so, it worked again with the 3rd battery i tried (itself going flat in the other car).. time for a couple of new batteries i think.

what causes the chalky white corrosion around the terminals (and in the distributer cap, and on the high tension lead from the coil, and on the rotor button)?

 

[largenfirm]

ok, cleaned up the terminals and it cranked and ran, no light/ignition/cd player/ brake light/ indicator problems, drove it for 30 minutes parked it, battery went flat within a couple of hours (maybe a crap battery too, cause i charged it overnight, left it off the charger, and it's gone flat not connected to anything)

so, it worked again with the 3rd battery i tried (itself going flat in the other car).. time for a couple of new batteries i think.

what causes the chalky white corrosion around the terminals (and in the distributer cap, and on the high tension lead from the coil, and on the rotor button)?

Get an ammeter, and, with everything turned off, start pulling fuses until the draw on the battery goes to zero - whatever was powered by the last fuse pulled is what's drawing your battery down.

The corrosion is caused by the vapors from the battery reacting with the metal. To clean it up, use coca-cola. Seriously. Once it is clean, park somewhere where you won't have to clean up a sugary mess, and coat the battery terminals and exposed metal on the battery cables with Karo Syrup (corn syrup).

Voila! No more corrosion! Can't recommend it for the other areas you mentioned, though

Kirk

 

[IDave]

Now, Koka Kola has Korn syrup in it. So maybe you just leave some on there after the cleanup, eh?

 

[bad_religion_au]

i know i will have current draw due to the cd player (uses it for memory, clock etc), so does anyone know what that should be (i say should because i suspect something is up with the stacker, i hear it cycles disks sometimes with the faceplate removed

 

[largenfirm]

Now, Koka Kola has Korn syrup in it. So maybe you just leave some on there after the cleanup, eh?

Not enough to prevent the corrosion. Besides, the USA is the only place in the world where corn syrup is cheaper than real sugar, thanks to tariffs.

All sodas taste better in Mexico, or the UK, because they are made with genuine sucrose.

BTW, it's the phosphoric acid in the soda that cleans off the white corrosion.

Also, the Karo hardens into a clear shell over the terminals, easily removed with hot water or mechanical action. Try it, it really works!

Kirk

 

[IDave]

I am enlightened! Again!

Isn't phosphoric acid also what they use in Metal Preps, and so forth?



So what is it that you put Karo on to be later removed by mechanical action?

 

[largenfirm]

I am enlightened! Again!

Isn't phosphoric acid also what they use in Metal Preps, and so forth?



So what is it that you put Karo on to be later removed by mechanical action?

Yup, phosphoric is widely used in Metal Preps, Navel Jelly, etc. I use it straight to convert red rust to black (the latter is not self-catalysing). It is very dilute (and thus, safe to use) in soda.

The Karo covers the battery terminals and the battery cable ends, where it hardens and protects the metal from corrosion. You leave it there until you need to loosen the battery terminal clamps.

Or did I misunderstand your last question?

Kirk

 

[IDave]

Oh, it was a subtle play on words (and your screen name--hint hint). My hands aren't my only filthy aspect.

 

[Gumby]

Get an ammeter, and, with everything turned off, start pulling fuses until the draw on the battery goes to zero - whatever was powered by the last fuse pulled is what's drawing your battery down.

I put a test light between the neg cable and the neg terminal with the wire disconnected. Any amp draw above a small level will cause the light to light. It's easier to see while you're pulling fuses than an ammeter.

Don't forget your underhood light, if you have one, or the dome light if the door is open. That will cause a draw that will mask the one you're looking for.

 

[bad_religion_au]

no lights like that so no problem... had my brother pulling fuses, while i looked at the meter

ok got a new battery in one (of two that are buggered) of the cars, tested current between -ve terminal on the battery, and the negative wire going to the battery, started pulling fuses to find the drain on the battery

there is a 0.1 milliamp drain in the taillight circuit

the hard wire circuit that keeps the cd player memory and clock etc draws over 200 milliamps, but that fluctuates down to 4-5 milliamps at times.

i don't know what current draw is alright for automotive sources, is 200 milliamps too high?

is the .1 milliamp draw a huge problem (i.e. could it be causing the battery drain in less than a day?)

 

[Pin_Head]

alright for automotive sources, is 200 milliamps too high?

is the .1 milliamp draw a huge problem (i.e. could it be causing the battery drain in less than a day?)

No.

Most batteries will discharge more than that with just the dirt, grime and acid on the top of the battery.

 

[bad_religion_au]

no for .1, or both?