Air Conditioner quit , Video of engine bay noise

[NolaNomad]

2006 LX470: Today was 81⁰F outside. A/C button on touch screen started blinking, no cold air. Says Check A/C in a steady one second blinking but no codes and no CEL or dash lights on. I tried to charge with Freon but hand held gauge was in the red so no coolant would pass ..

The link shows the noise from engine bay- all serpent belt pulleys are spinning.......

 

[NolaNomad]

Anyone know what that sound in the video is? Sounds like a low frequency binding type sound?

 

[Trunk Monkey]

Use a mechanic's stethoscope and (carefully with the belts) pinpoint where the noise is coming from.

 

[kody472]

When mine did this (GX470), the compressor was toast. Sounds like it's trying to spin, but it's seized.

 

[NolaNomad]

Use a mechanic's stethoscope and (carefully with the belts) pinpoint where the noise is coming from.

Oh yeah I did have a chance to do that recently - I noticed the idler pulley sound rough, would that also cause the A/C to fail? All the pullys do still spin?

When mine did this (GX470), the compressor was toast. Sounds like it's trying to spin, but it's seized.

Ah, shucks- what all did you replace on that?

 

[Trunk Monkey]

Multi-quote is a beautiful thing. AC has a clutch, pulley can spin without it engaged. If the compressor is bad you replace the compressor.

 

[kody472]

Oh yeah I did have a chance to do that recently - I noticed the idler pulley sound rough, would that also cause the A/C to fail? All the pullys do still spin?


Ah, shucks- what all did you replace on that?

Compressor, expansion valve, and drier, just in case metal shavings got in there.

 

[Brandon Ryder]

If the compressor failed, it likely needs new condenser, as well at the parts mentioned above. Assuming rear AC, the expansion valves both need to be replaced and possibly the suction hose from the compressor. Then all hoses and lines flushed, including both evaporators. A huge job. And expensive if you have anyone else do it. Just the parts is about 500 if you go aftermarket components and try to save the evaps with flush. A few hundred for minimum tools like AC manifold and vacuum. Then refrigerant, orings, valve cores...

If you're near Colorado Springs, I can help a bit as I'm doing AC on my LC right now.

 

[kody472]

If the compressor failed, it likely needs new condenser, as well at the parts mentioned above. Assuming rear AC, the expansion valves both need to be replaced and possibly the suction hose from the compressor. Then all hoses and lines flushed, including both evaporators. A huge job. And expensive if you have anyone else do it. Just the parts is about 500 if you go aftermarket components and try to save the evaps with flush. A few hundred for minimum tools like AC manifold and vacuum. Then refrigerant, orings, valve cores...

If you're near Colorado Springs, I can help a bit as I'm doing AC on my LC right now.

Good points. I did forget to mention replacing the condenser. I got away with not replacing my rear expansion valve. Got lucky with that.

It can be a very expensive job, especially with OEM parts.

 

[NolaNomad]

Oh gosh, this is a bigger deal than I thought! How do I diagnose this properly and where do y'all source aftermarket parts? Any of this rebuildable? Dang this is becoming a money pit!

If the compressor failed, it likely needs new condenser, as well at the parts mentioned above. Assuming rear AC, the expansion valves both need to be replaced and possibly the suction hose from the compressor. Then all hoses and lines flushed, including both evaporators. A huge job. And expensive if you have anyone else do it. Just the parts is about 500 if you go aftermarket components and try to save the evaps with flush. A few hundred for minimum tools like AC manifold and vacuum. Then refrigerant, orings, valve cores...

If you're near Colorado Springs, I can help a bit as I'm doing AC on my LC right now.

Dude this is a huge job- is there a video about all this somewhere? Can I see a prts list you have? I'm still trying to diagnose this but I'm near Glenwood Springs. I don't mind a bit of a drive to get help cause this is is a bit out of my skill set

 

[ibrahim83]

Sounds like a bad ac compressor clutch or seizing compressor. The flashing AC light means there's an issue with the system.

 

[Brandon Ryder]

Oh gosh, this is a bigger deal than I thought! How do I diagnose this properly and where do y'all source aftermarket parts? Any of this rebuildable? Dang this is becoming a money pit!


Dude this is a huge job- is there a video about all this somewhere? Can I see a prts list you have? I'm still trying to diagnose this but I'm near Glenwood Springs. I don't mind a bit of a drive to get help cause this is is a bit out of my skill set

I've have been researching online about A/C for a couple years, off and on. I know the parts of the system and how it works. It is complicated if you're not familiar with it. Glenwood springs is pretty far. I would price out all the major components on Rock Auto, which is going to be your best prices. In your situation, you could probably just replace every component with new/ aftermarket. And do a basic flush of the hard lines. Get it all put together, then take it to an A/C shop nearby to check for leaks and charge.
I would go for a Denso A/C compressor, then just get four seasons everything else.
Compressor
Compressor suction line (because it can't be flushed)
Condenser (because it can't be flushed) should come with new desiccant already installed.
Front Evaporator
Front Expansion valve (these get clogged with debris)
Rear Evaporator
Rear Expansion valve (get one with the wiring installed)

Get some nylog and use it on all the orings so you'll never have a leak again.
have to put the exact correct amount of oil in the system, which the compressor ships with, but you can't put it all in the compressor , it has to be distributed in the two evaps as well or it can ruin the compressor on first start up.

This involves pulling parts of the dash where the evap is and also the rear paneling where the rear evap resides. Probably the hardest part. There are some threads on mud where guys have been able to get to the front evap easier by cutting 1 piece of plastic under the glove box to gain easier access and not disassembling the whole dash.

Timmy the toolman on Youtube has a video on pulling the compressor without taking everything apart. But he did the compressor only. Not the whole system.
Some guys block off the rear A/C so as to not have to deal with it. involves cutting the lines and capping them off, uses less refrigerant and oil which you have to account for if you do this.
You can't just replace the compressor alone if it has disintegrated because those compressor chips will be in the whole system , clogging tiny orifices and they wont work. It also will ruin the new compressor. If the compressor clutch just went out, or the compressor itself went bad without the black death(black oil) then you can just replace the compressor. Probably take you half a day and then an A/C shop can charge it. Watch Timmy's video.

If this sounds like too much, you're going to be paying someone to do it all and they likely wont have the best component prices. Or sell the vehicle at a huge discount. DIY method will probably cost you 7-800 in parts plus what it costs to charge properly. A shop doing it all with the labor costs. Yikes I wont hazard a guess but more than double that. Probably closer to triple.

 

[Neuner]

A couple of days ago, ours did the exact same thing. Same noise, flashing AC light, etc.

It's the AC Compressor Clutch. Have someone flip on the AC and watch the belt at the compressor pulley / clutch and you'll see.

I'm in the middle of replacing ours right now. Not too bad of a job. I found a video or 2 but I did mine a little different.

Yours is a newer model, ours is '99. I'm installing a Denso 471-1220: Amazon.com: Denso 471-1220 New Compressor with Clutch : Automotive - https://www.amazon.com/dp/B001UCBMJK?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_fed_asin_title

I removed the fan and shroud for easier access since it's not that hard. I did not need to remove the front axle or oil filter to get access to the 3 bolts. Top one from the top was easy, the bottom and rear just took a little finesse with a 14mm socket and a deep socket on the front bottom bolt, nothing special. Those I did from down below around the oil filter. I didn't need the long extensions or swivel heads like Timmy the Toolman.

 

[NE Snowman]

Even as someone who doesn’t use A/C day in and day out, I would NOT cap the rear. It supplies a lot of cold/warm air in the cabin and you don’t need the fronts blasting on full.

 

[NolaNomad]

I've have been researching online about A/C for a couple years, off and on. I know the parts of the system and how it works. It is complicated if you're not familiar with it. Glenwood springs is pretty far. I would price out all the major components on Rock Auto, which is going to be your best prices. In your situation, you could probably just replace every component with new/ aftermarket. And do a basic flush of the hard lines. Get it all put together, then take it to an A/C shop nearby to check for leaks and charge.
I would go for a Denso A/C compressor, then just get four seasons everything else.
Compressor
Compressor suction line (because it can't be flushed)
Condenser (because it can't be flushed) should come with new desiccant already installed.
Front Evaporator
Front Expansion valve (these get clogged with debris)
Rear Evaporator
Rear Expansion valve (get one with the wiring installed)

Get some nylog and use it on all the orings so you'll never have a leak again.
have to put the exact correct amount of oil in the system, which the compressor ships with, but you can't put it all in the compressor , it has to be distributed in the two evaps as well or it can ruin the compressor on first start up.

This involves pulling parts of the dash where the evap is and also the rear paneling where the rear evap resides. Probably the hardest part. There are some threads on mud where guys have been able to get to the front evap easier by cutting 1 piece of plastic under the glove box to gain easier access and not disassembling the whole dash.

Timmy the toolman on Youtube has a video on pulling the compressor without taking everything apart. But he did the compressor only. Not the whole system.
Some guys block off the rear A/C so as to not have to deal with it. involves cutting the lines and capping them off, uses less refrigerant and oil which you have to account for if you do this.
You can't just replace the compressor alone if it has disintegrated because those compressor chips will be in the whole system , clogging tiny orifices and they wont work. It also will ruin the new compressor. If the compressor clutch just went out, or the compressor itself went bad without the black death(black oil) then you can just replace the compressor. Probably take you half a day and then an A/C shop can charge it. Watch Timmy's video.

If this sounds like too much, you're going to be paying someone to do it all and they likely wont have the best component prices. Or sell the vehicle at a huge discount. DIY method will probably cost you 7-800 in parts plus what it costs to charge properly. A shop doing it all with the labor costs. Yikes I wont hazard a guess but more than double that. Probably closer to triple.

Holy Smokes this is above my pay grade . Thanks for this info- at least you point me in the right direction. I'll try to get a diagnosis from a local shop to see how deep I'm in.

A couple of days ago, ours did the exact same thing. Same noise, flashing AC light, etc.

It's the AC Compressor Clutch. Have someone flip on the AC and watch the belt at the compressor pulley / clutch and you'll see.

I'm in the middle of replacing ours right now. Not too bad of a job. I found a video or 2 but I did mine a little different.

Yours is a newer model, ours is '99. I'm installing a Denso 471-1220: Amazon.com: Denso 471-1220 New Compressor with Clutch : Automotive - https://www.amazon.com/dp/B001UCBMJK?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_fed_asin_title

I removed the fan and shroud for easier access since it's not that hard. I did not need to remove the front axle or oil filter to get access to the 3 bolts. Top one from the top was easy, the bottom and rear just took a little finesse with a 14mm socket and a deep socket on the front bottom bolt, nothing special. Those I did from down below around the oil filter. I didn't need the long extensions or swivel heads like Timmy the Toolman.

Oh ok - so you have the same noise and message on the screen? I'll look into this fix, I follow Timmy for awhile now and saw him do the compressor is that different than the clutch? What symptoms did you have? When you say you did different is that just what you described in your post?.

Even as someone who doesn’t use A/C day in and day out, I would NOT cap the rear. It supplies a lot of cold/warm air in the cabin and you don’t need the fronts blasting on full.

Copy that

Oh I see- the clutch is attached to the compressor, the head of the pulley so it's all self-contained.

 

[NolaNomad]

A couple of days ago, ours did the exact same thing. Same noise, flashing AC light, etc.

It's the AC Compressor Clutch. Have someone flip on the AC and watch the belt at the compressor pulley / clutch and you'll see.

I'm in the middle of replacing ours right now. Not too bad of a job. I found a video or 2 but I did mine a little different.

Yours is a newer model, ours is '99. I'm installing a Denso 471-1220: Amazon.com: Denso 471-1220 New Compressor with Clutch : Automotive - https://www.amazon.com/dp/B001UCBMJK?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_fed_asin_title

I removed the fan and shroud for easier access since it's not that hard. I did not need to remove the front axle or oil filter to get access to the 3 bolts. Top one from the top was easy, the bottom and rear just took a little finesse with a 14mm socket and a deep socket on the front bottom bolt, nothing special. Those I did from down below around the oil filter. I didn't need the long extensions or swivel heads like Timmy the Toolman.

Yes mine sounds just like that- hopeing its just the clutch but how do you know its not the whole system?

 

[Neuner]

Yes mine sounds just like that- hopeing its just the clutch but how do you know its not the whole system?

Not sure what you mean by "whole system".

With the compressor removed, I can spin both the clutch and the pulley independently without issue. If I spin them counter each other, there is a grinding and I can feel it want to bind up.

It may not be the clutch but a bad bearing? We had an occasional bird-chirping noise that I couldn't figure out because it was so random and occurred when we were driving. Replaced pulleys and the brake master cylinder but no resolution. I speculated the AC compressor or pulley but just learned to live with it. After replacing the compressor, the noise has stopped so it must have been a bad bearing or the clutch.

 

[NolaNomad]

Not sure what you mean by "whole system".

With the compressor removed, I can spin both the clutch and the pulley independently without issue. If I spin them counter each other, there is a grinding and I can feel it want to bind up.

It may not be the clutch but a bad bearing? We had an occasional bird-chirping noise that I couldn't figure out because it was so random and occurred when we were driving. Replaced pulleys and the brake master cylinder but no resolution. I speculated the AC compressor or pulley but just learned to live with it. After replacing the compressor, the noise has stopped so it must have been a bad bearing or the clutch.

Not sure what you mean by "whole system".

With the compressor removed, I can spin both the clutch and the pulley independently without issue. If I spin them counter each other, there is a grinding and I can feel it want to bind up.

It may not be the clutch but a bad bearing? We had an occasional bird-chirping noise that I couldn't figure out because it was so random and occurred when we were driving. Replaced pulleys and the brake master cylinder but no resolution. I speculated the AC compressor or pulley but just learned to live with it. After replacing the compressor, the noise has stopped so it must have been a bad bearing or the clutch.

Well I did get a Diag. and work order locally- Did you replace any of the other parts like the Condensor , A/C reciever drier assmbly etc. Did you flush the AC system yourself? Did you use UV dye to detect any leaks from rear expansion valves?

 

[Brandon Ryder]

View attachment 4160109



Well I did get a Diag. and work order locally- Did you replace any of the other parts like the Condensor , A/C reciever drier assmbly etc. Did you flush the AC system yourself? Did you use UV dye to detect any leaks from rear expansion valves?

That estimate assumes the compressor shredded itself on the inside. They are replacing the compressor and the condenser which is necessary if that happened. I think the other poster was saying that if it's just the clutch, the compressor and other components don't need to be changed because it doesn't contaminate the system as it is external. If you were able to pull the compressor, and change only the clutch, you would only have to have the system charged when you put it back together. Way less cost.

Just inspect the compressor oil for black death, or metal bits that would indicate compressor damage. You would have to replace the pag oil in the compressor too, if you pulled it and emptied it.

There is a way to pull the compressor without pulling everything apart. Timmy has a video on it.

 

[NolaNomad]

That estimate assumes the compressor shredded itself on the inside. They are replacing the compressor and the condenser which is necessary if that happened. I think the other poster was saying that if it's just the clutch, the compressor and other components don't need to be changed because it doesn't contaminate the system as it is external. If you were able to pull the compressor, and change only the clutch, you would only have to have the system charged when you put it back together. Way less cost.

Just inspect the compressor oil for black death, or metal bits that would indicate compressor damage. You would have to replace the pag oil in the compressor too, if you pulled it and emptied it.

There is a way to pull the compressor without pulling everything apart. Timmy has a video on it.

Yes, thanks for the detailed reply, Haven't touched anything yet but I'll look for Bdeath. I'll look into seeing if clutch only or both compressor + clutch . If the latter- that would necessitate the R&R of condenser + drier etc?