86 rear brake wheel cylinder (1 Viewer)

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Upgrading my brothers 86 rear brake system. Adding oversize wheel cylinders off a 1995 Land cruiser. Common upgrade for these trucks along with a dual diaphragm
brake booster and a 1" master cylinder. Got every thing back together, went to put drum back on and the shoes are too wide. I bled W/C, and the adjuster is cranked all the way in.
Still wont go back on. Everything is assembled correctly, per FSM,
ALL suggestions welcome.
Thanks in advance
 
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Hey Toast,
Thanks for the reply, I am right down the road from you in Rocklin.
My brother bought these from Marlin, and I may be wrong here, they sell them as oversize and as the correct ones for the upgrade.
I will check with them today, see what the story is.
Thanks again for taking the time to reply.
 
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Yea, no worries. I have FJ60 wheel cylinders in my rig and they went in no problem. I got mine at Napa I think. Asked for some from a 85. I could probably swing by and take a look at it if you can’t figure it out.
 
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Hey Toast, Thank you for that offer, very nice of you!
I double checked the wheel cylinders, they are in fact 60 series.
I am still not able to get the drum back on, I have taken it all apart, inspected all parts etc.
It is assembled correctly per the FSM.
I look at the FSM, and it says when there is a problem with the brake system being out of adjustment, check the emergency brake.
The only thing I did to the ebrake is adjust the stop screw on the back of the backing plate. I put that back to the original setting and it didn't help.
Could this be a problem with air in the system, not allowing the wheel cylinders to fully collapse?
This is my first time doing drums, and I know they are really simple, but I cant for the life of me figure it out.
Thanks!
 
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Jefferson
The cylinders should compress regardless.
I know these are pretty tight going back together with fresh pads anyway.
Ive been hung by the ebrake cam to crossbar relationship
 
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Shoes weren't changed, they are fairly new.
The only thing changed was the wheel cylinders.
And the shoes are not even close to going back into the drums, which is weird.
I'm stumped.
Thanks for the reply
I'll check the ebrake cam/crossbar deal in the morning.
 
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Interesting. Yea I’m not entirely sure. I’d probably have to look at it. I’ve never had an issue with drum brakes and getting the drums back on. You might have your e-brake adjustments too far out or something. Let me know if you want me to take a peak at it.
 

GRM

Finding new adventures in old jalopies.
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Wrong shoes. 1986 brake shoes are only for that year.

There was a swap to a different style along the way. This swap only works on (I believe) 87 and newer trucks. On my 1986 I swapped the brake shoes with a set out of a 93 4Runner when I put in 2000 4Runner (15/16”) wheel cylinders.

Random trivia: the 1986 rear axle is also narrower than newer models, and holds less gear lube due to a smaller rear half of the housing.
 
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04495-26050 is the part number for shoes and they list for being 86-89. Tried looking up 86 and it comes up as 04495-35090 but also says it’s good through the same year spread. Then came across 04495-35110 which says it’s only for 8/85-7/86. WTF??? I’ve never heard anyone ever drop even a peep of the 86 rear axle being different. So can Republic simply swap out shoes from an 87+ or is there something else that’s different?? Mind blown...
 
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I have to respectfully disagree here. I owned an 86 Runner for ten years. Did several rear brake jobs and swapped at least one rear shaft and never met any mismatch issues.

Also guy did not change shoes.

Wrong shoes. 1986 brake shoes are only for that year.

There was a swap to a different style along the way. This swap only works on (I believe) 87 and newer trucks. On my 1986 I swapped the brake shoes with a set out of a 93 4Runner when I put in 2000 4Runner (15/16”) wheel cylinders.


Random trivia: the 1986 rear axle is also narrower than newer models, and holds less gear lube due to a smaller rear half of the housing.
 

GRM

Finding new adventures in old jalopies.
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REALLY???? I’ve never heard this! How did you come to find this out?? What is the overall width of a 86 housing vs one from an 87+ ?

Well, it all started from trying to put a 2007 FJ Cruiser Elocker in my 1986 Mini. On install I found the bolt on the back of the carrier cap hit the back of the housing. Thats when I started to realize something was up. The housing was shallower than other write ups I had seen online. It also held leas fluid.

Then I had a common elocker issue: my axle shafts didn’t fully engage the side gears. This sent me on a goose chase to find longer shafts. Low and behold, any shaft I grabbed ended up being longer. Most not by much, but the 1993 4Runner shafts I installed were around 5/8” longer.

When I did the shaft swap I decided to also upgrade the wheel cylinders. The 1” FJ60 swap wasn’t common, so I went for a 15/16” wheel cylinder off a 2000 4Runner. When installing the pile of parts, I ran into the same headache as the OP. To try and solve the problem I tried the used 1993 brake shoes that came with my axle shafts. They fit perfect.

So my conclusion is that 86 shoes and wheel cyls are different, but as long as the two match, they will bolt into any 86+ housing.
 
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The housing depth as far as the Elocker goes, is common afaik.
Imo the shaft length with the Elocker thing is also bs.
Are the later shafts marginally longer, yes. Is it enough to be relevant, no.
I am not questioning your experience, it just seems not ike Toyota MO to do "one off" runs. It spits in the face of efficiency.
 

GRM

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My experience is that 86-88 truck/4Runner, then 89-95 truck, then 90-95 4Runner all have different width axles. Yes they are marginally different (1” total width), but still different.

Btw: the shaft engaging the entire length of the splines on the side gear on elockers is not bs. If you only engage the end of the side gears; the side gear breaks with hard wheeling. I hate to say it, but your flat out wrong. Longer axles are necessary to run elockers in older axle housings.
 
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Ok, I so have heard that 90-95 4Runner rear shafts (coil rear axles) are a tad longer (7mm or something like that?) and that they don’t fit all the way into the carrier? I currently have an E-locker from a 4Runner in my 87 axle with the 87 shafts. That back bolt barely hit the housing so I shaved it down a tad along with a good smack on the housing for good measure. So now I’m definitely a tad concerned with my axles not being long enough... just doesn’t make sense that the e-locker carrier would be narrower allowing less spline contact... or are you saying that the reason you want to other shafts is for addition contact due to the added abuse of a locker? Just haven’t heard of anyone having this issue. Any input would be greatly appreciated. Also, sorry to hi-jack your thread republic!
 
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Hey no worries at all Hijack away, I am digging the discussion.
I wanted to update on this thread, after trying everything we could think of, today we went and got FLAPS
wheel cylinders,took the 60 series ones off, and the drums went on perfectly.
I believe they (60's) are too wide and don't compress enough to allow the shoes to retract far enough.
I have an 88 that I will be doing the same upgrades to, so we will find out if maybe there is a difference between years.
His is a 5/86 production date, if that matters.
Thank you, Toast, gnob and GRM for taking the time to answer and give advice.
I will update when I do my truck.
 
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Hey no worries at all Hijack away, I am digging the discussion.
I wanted to update on this thread, after trying everything we could think of, today we went and got FLAPS
wheel cylinders,took the 60 series ones off, and the drums went on perfectly.
I believe they (60's) are too wide and don't compress enough to allow the shoes to retract far enough.
I have an 88 that I will be doing the same upgrades to, so we will find out if maybe there is a difference between years.
His is a 5/86 production date, if that matters.
Thank you, Toast, gnob and GRM for taking the time to answer and give advice.
I will update when I do my truck.
Any update? I'm currently stuck at the same position on my '86. Brake drums won't go back on with the fj60 wheel cylinders. Like it was said before, the cylinder won't compress enough. Am I stuck with the stock wheel cylinders?
 

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