Good afternoon, I need some help/recommendations with cleaning my engine. I am trying to remove the head gasket and will probably try to remove the front timing cover and rear main seal while I am at it. When I took off my valve cover, there seems to be a lot of carbon build up. Any recommendations on how to clean this? Should I replace anything while I’m at it? Should I replace the camshaft timing sprocket too? I plan on getting the head resurfaced too. I am not a new mechanic, but not a professional either. Any guidance would be appreciated. Thanks.
3fe engine help
- Thread starter FJ80Rebuilder
- Start date
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If you're removing it all for head gasket job the machine shop will/can clean all of that for you when they go through the head.
Or pull it all apart (rocker assembly) and soak it yourself to clean. Machine shop will do the head itself.
Or pull it all apart (rocker assembly) and soak it yourself to clean. Machine shop will do the head itself.
The 3F/3FE tends to run a bit hot in the head. The build up you see is just "burnt" oil residue. Not really carbon in the sense that the term is commonly used in the automotive world. You can clean it with pretty much anything from diesel or gasoline to carb or brake cleaner to soap and water. Tossing it in the hot tank works well too. 
No need to replace the cam sprocket just to replace it. I've been working on these engines for too many decades now and I have never seen a timing gear that has any appreciable wear. Even those silly lightweight composite ones in the 3F. I *do* prefer the steel units in the 2F myself if I am gonna replace the gears when doing a full on "build".
Is your rear main seal leaking? They seldom seldom seldom do. The common seeping valve cover gasket and also common seeping side cover gasket or (less common) seeping oil pan gasket will give you oil accumulation in areas that you will swear must be the rear main.
You definitely have something oozing oil pretty bad up high. Sure looks like valve cover gasket. Eliminate that before worrying about rear main.
Mark...
No need to replace the cam sprocket just to replace it. I've been working on these engines for too many decades now and I have never seen a timing gear that has any appreciable wear. Even those silly lightweight composite ones in the 3F. I *do* prefer the steel units in the 2F myself if I am gonna replace the gears when doing a full on "build".
Is your rear main seal leaking? They seldom seldom seldom do. The common seeping valve cover gasket and also common seeping side cover gasket or (less common) seeping oil pan gasket will give you oil accumulation in areas that you will swear must be the rear main.
You definitely have something oozing oil pretty bad up high. Sure looks like valve cover gasket. Eliminate that before worrying about rear main.
Mark...
Looks like a good candidate for a LS swap, dude!
- Thread starter
- #5
I am assuming the rear main seal is leaking also. Attached is a picture what I think may be a rear main seal leak. It seems it’s just leaking just about everywhere I can see. Would you recommend just cleaning, or replacing the valve stems? I bought a gasket kit from cruiser teq and it comes with new valve stem seals. I plan on using the whole kit.The 3F/3FE tends to run a bit hot in the head. The build up you see is just "burnt" oil residue. Not really carbon in the sense that the term is commonly used in the automotive world. You can clean it with pretty much anything from diesel or gasoline to carb or brake cleaner to soap and water. Tossing it in the hot tank works well too.
No need to replace the cam sprocket just to replace it. I've been working on these engines for too many decades now and I have never seen a timing gear that has any appreciable wear. Even those silly lightweight composite ones in the 3F. I *do* prefer the steel units in the 2F myself if I am gonna replace the gears when doing a full on "build".
Is your rear main seal leaking? They seldom seldom seldom do. The common seeping valve cover gasket and also common seeping side cover gasket or (less common) seeping oil pan gasket will give you oil accumulation in areas that you will swear must be the rear main.
You definitely have something oozing oil pretty bad up high. Sure looks like valve cover gasket. Eliminate that before worrying about rear main.
Mark...
Valve stems seals have nothing to do with any of the nastiness that you have going on here. If they are worn and letting oil get by (into the intake and or exhaust tracts) then replace them. If you are doing a valve job then replace them while you are doing that. Makes no sense not too in that case.
Your picture shows me a mess. But not a mess that clarifies where it is originating. As I mentioned, oil leaks up high run down all over everything. They can conceal anything coming from the rear main, or simply look like it is the rear main leaking when it is not.
Mark...
Your picture shows me a mess. But not a mess that clarifies where it is originating. As I mentioned, oil leaks up high run down all over everything. They can conceal anything coming from the rear main, or simply look like it is the rear main leaking when it is not.
Mark...
- Thread starter
- #7
Thanks for the insight. This may sound like a dumb question, but would you recommend me taking it off and cleaning the valves one by one?
Can confirm "normal" for higher mile 3FE, mine looks the same and apart from pulling the rockers to clean will remain as a sleeping dog to not be bothered.
Oil pan gaskets like to get loose on these as well, best to use 1 piece OEM gasket.
The only ~while you're in there~ I can think of would be to drill/tap the oil feed in the head that has an aluminum plug in it. When they let go its a bad time.
I agree most likely oil pan gasket main problem. Go ahead and do the head. Also check side cover gasket they are usually leaking too.Great engines ours has 420,000 miles same engine,transmission .Use Toyota when available.
You've already gotten the correct answers to your questions, and you seem like you're going down the right path by replacing EVERY gasket/seal on this motor with OEM.
As already stated, what is often diagnosed as a rear main seal leak is the rear arch seal of the oil pan, which seals to the rear bearing cap of the crank.
If the transmission is separated from the engine, now would be the time to replace the rear main seal.
I will also add that EVERY SINGLE PIECE of rubber on this vehicle is likely 35 years old and doesn't owe you anything more.
Including, but not limited to: Hoses, belts, vacuum lines, brake lines, window runners, door gaskets, etc.
No, machine shop will do this
- Thread starter
- #12
Thanks to everyone giving their input. Can’t wait to work on this on the weekend, so I can get it back on the road again.
Before I even got that far down this path, I'd check and see if the valves *need* cleaning. That is to say, do they have any buildup that is affecting airflow?
If they do, I would then ask myself... do I have any faith in some sort of "miracle in a can" super duper cleaning "STUFF" to solve the problem. Am I comfortable in dripping water into my intake while the engine is running to clean it all out? (*THAT* may not be in a can, but it is miraculous!)
If the answer to both those questions is no, then... how happy will you be tearing this head apart to manually clean the valves... and accomplish nothing else? Have you ever pulled a valve from an F series head. It is in no way any sort of rocket science. But it is a bit of a pain in the ass. 12x.
If you are tearing the engine down this far.... Just to replace seals and "clean"... ???? it makes little sense not to drop the head off with your favorite machinist and get the head checked and the valves ground. There is a very good chance it does not *really really* need a valve job, but by the time you pay for the tear down , hot tank and reassembly... might as well kick in another C note and be good for a LONG LONG LONG time.
BTW, you did not mention that the head gasket was blown... why are you pulling the head in the first place?
Mark...
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You have gotten very solid advice don't overlook getting the oil gally plug replaced at the machine shop there is a write up about it in faq section. I suggest having something to help you lift the head its not light and its long don't wanna drop it either.
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AND.....
I always set a piece of cardboard (the package for an individual head gasket works GREAT) on top of the head gasket as I an setting the head back on. Not the entire gasket front to back, but the back end of the block. Leave it a bit cattywumpass so you can grab it after the head is set down. Lift the head back up at the back end just enough to free up the cardboard to slide it out.
It is too easy to damage the head gasket as you are lowering the head by hand. I always set the back end down first. I managed to let it drop about ... maybe half an inch once. Maybe only a quarter. The edge of the head came down on the fire ring for #6. Crimped/cut it. Trashed the head gasket before I even had the head all the way down.
If you are using an engine hoist of any type to lower the head, then that 90 LBS of iron is not as big a deal to handle.
Mark...
Neat idea