2023 alignment issues

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C

Chronicle

Joined
Jul 26, 2024
Threads
9
Messages
60
Location
East Coast
I've had alignment issues since picking up the vehicle new in 2023. One dealer I took it to said they "tweaked the rear" to help with the alignment. I don't know what that means or what they did specifically.

Yesterday I took it to independent reputable shop with a hunter alignment rack. Attached is the result. They said no matter what they did even on the left side of a crowned road it very slowly will creep right still. When I drove it after getting it back the alignment feels worse pulling harder to the right and holding the steering wheel straight quickly will steer the car to the right.

If the rear is not adjustable why is it not zero? The car as 15k miles on it all highway, never off road and never in an accident.
IMG_0028.webp
 
iwashmycar said:
Your numbers are very close to mine, and I think mine drives fine.

Your toe is a little higher...mine are 0.09 and 0.08 with a total of 0.17, and my rear toe zeros out with -.16 and .16.

What tires you have? What tire pressure?
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CrossClimate 2 on factory wheels. PSI 35-38 cold but all tires set to same pressure always.
 
gnob said:
you need to adjust the rear thrust a bit.
also the ds camber is pushing right.
camber should be zero. caster should be slightly lower ds
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Thrust would be the rear -0.15 left side vs. +0.20 passenger? This should be closer to equal on both sides?
Sorry - what does 'ds' mean?
Steer ahead is 0.00 is that different than making the steering wheel aligned center with the wheels?
 
I had a 2023 with the same issue. I had it aligned at least 4 times, twice by the dealer. All of the adjustments looked perfect on the readout. Had the tires rotated several times then replaced the tires. No one had a solution to the problem. It finally became so tiring to drive on road trips I had enough and sold it.
 
Chronicle said:
Thrust would be the rear -0.15 left side vs. +0.20 passenger? This should be closer to equal on both sides?
Sorry - what does 'ds' mean?
Steer ahead is 0.00 is that different than making the steering wheel aligned center with the wheels?
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driver side. yes my mistake on steering center. plenty of people mistake incorrect center for pull
 
I feel your pain. Paid for an alignment on my now sold 470. Took it back 4x to two different Les Schwab locations (1 near work 1 near home) under the original 30 day purchase warranty before the last tech torqued the LCA adjustment bolts to factory spec. I removed the skid plates for the first alignment and put them on afterward. When I realized the steering was off, I removed the skid plates, checked bolts for proper torque, and left them off until the 4th and final trip. Good luck.
 
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I spoke with the place that did the alignment this morning. They said the negative 0.15 tow on the rear left and the positive 0.20 on the right rear is an area of concern. They are going to talk to a body/frame shop and show them to see what they think and if it's worth me coming in. Again, I bought this right off the showroom floor brand new...
 
Just to be sure, there's no history of the frame being bent?
 
I highly ASSUMED no since it had literally a few miles on it and I bought it new. I never would have thought to even look. Where would I look now?
 
Chronicle said:
I highly ASSUMED no since it had literally a few miles on it and I bought it new. I never would have thought to even look. Where would I look now?
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Probably CarFax. Not sure what else may give a car's history.
 
It's totally possible the rear axle housing is bent/tweaked, or perhaps one of the lower control arms are bent. That could have occurred by hitting something like a pothole at speed, perhaps in just the right way.

The OEM lower control arms on a GX are pretty light-duty steel tubing. You could probably check the LCAs yourself by putting a straightedge on them and seeing if one or both is visually bent (although, a frame shop can certainly do that too). I suppose a worn/trashed LCA bushing could also cause that issue, but a bent LCA seems more likely on a low-mileage GX.

I think it's highly unlikely the actual frame is bent - it's a robust fully-boxed frame with lots of crossmembers. It would take a serious accident to bend it.

If the control arms are bent, they are inexpensive to replace. Less than $100 each for new ones from Toyota and very easy to change. If the rear axle housing is bent, a new one from Lexus is around $1,400. It's less than a day or labor to remove the old axle housing and swap all of your existing parts over to the new one.
 
Rednexus said:
It's totally possible the rear axle housing is bent/tweaked, or perhaps one of the lower control arms are bent. That could have occurred by hitting something like a pothole at speed, perhaps in just the right way.

The OEM lower control arms on a GX are pretty light-duty steel tubing. You could probably check the LCAs yourself by putting a straightedge on them and seeing if one or both is visually bent (although, a frame shop can certainly do that too). I suppose a worn/trashed LCA bushing could also cause that issue, but a bent LCA seems more likely on a low-mileage GX.

I think it's highly unlikely the actual frame is bent - it's a robust fully-boxed frame with lots of crossmembers. It would take a serious accident to bend it.

If the control arms are bent, they are inexpensive to replace. Less than $100 each for new ones from Toyota and very easy to change. If the rear axle housing is bent, a new one from Lexus is around $1,400. It's less than a day or labor to remove the old axle housing and swap all of your existing parts over to the new one.
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Only 15k on the GX and all highway but I will add these things to the list to have looked at. The report shows the left rear wheel is pointing one way and the right rear wheel is pointing the other. I don't know how that is even possible but that's what the report says.

EDIT: I did more reading and it looks like it's just that the axle is shifted pointing right as a whole if I understand it correctly.
 
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Axle position is controlled by rear 2 LCAs (visible easily underneath the vehicle), the panhard bar (bar in-line with the axle and behind it), and the rear 2 UCAs (on top of the axle and very hard to see/get to). The system needs all 5 links to keep the axle put. If any one of those is bent, has a torn/damage bushing, or has a bent link mount on the frame/axle, I can easily see the axle getting out-of-square with the frame. This is from my experience replacing LCAs on my rig as well as the entire housing - once you disconnect a link or two, the rear axle more gets awfully unstable and is honestly a bear to wrestle up into position.

My rig is non-KDSS so I have not messed with it, but I think KDSS is only "up" or "down" and might not be capable of dislocating the axle to one side unless something else is broken.

If the LCAs themselves look fine you can also inspect the LCA link mounts (on the frame and axle). They are relatively thin steel and I could see one getting bent if it is hit right (I actually welded reinforcements on mine for wheeling - but they had not been bent previously). You can inspect the panhard bar too, but it's thick metal and tucked up high - I have a hard time seeing how it could be damaged outside of a serious accident.
 
I went to the frame/body shop today and they brought me into the shop and explained everything they found. Nothing appeared bent. The rear thrust was off the same on their hunter alignment rack as the other shop and they did loosen the bolts on the lower control arms and using a "persuasion" bar were able to move the rear axle enough to get the thrust to 0.00 and then realigned the front since it was now off. This must have been what the one dealer was doing when they "tweaked" the rear.

In our discussions they said there are aftermarket rear LCA's that are adjustable. After a brief look I did see Dobinson's makes ones that are adjustable. I'll probably go this route.
 
These are the two cams from the left front LCA rear point and right front LCA rear point. Is there a valid reason for them to be so different?
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