I have a 2013 200 series and it is completely stock with the exception of the OE Toyota front spacers on top of the struts. I installed them recently with brand new front and rear Toyota struts and rear shocks along with new tops and bumpstops. I have performed the KDSS procedure to level everything and try to get it to a neutral position and it only has a very slight lean to the drivers side. My real question is this. Is rear coil spring sag an issue on the 200 series? It seems like it is not sitting high enough in the rear especially when parked next to another stock 200 series. It also seems to hit the bumpstops in the rear fairly easily with normal driving. It becomes real evident with weight in the back or with a trailer. I know these vehicles have a somewhat soft suspension stock but I’m just wondering if there is more to it in my case. I’m also wondering if it could be contributing to the slight lean. Any input is appreciated. Cheers guys.
Rear springs
- Thread starter aks1980
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Definitely, I pulled my 13' stock springs over two years ago and at the time there was noticeable sag, one more than the other (lean), and the truck would bottom out with only internal loads (passengers and gear). Installed 2721 OMEs, all better.
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- #3
Awesome! Thanks for the input!
I’m fairly confident my stock rear 13 coils are sagged too, though with the third row removed you wouldn’t know it from ride height alone. It does tend to wallow around and will tap the stops on dips.
Thing is, I don’t want to go to a significantly higher rate spring in back unless I increase the rate in front as well, to avoid an imbalance. So I’m looking at new OE or maybe Heritage Edition coils to hold me over until I pull the trigger on King 2.5s. They aren’t very expensive.. about $130 per coil.
Thing is, I don’t want to go to a significantly higher rate spring in back unless I increase the rate in front as well, to avoid an imbalance. So I’m looking at new OE or maybe Heritage Edition coils to hold me over until I pull the trigger on King 2.5s. They aren’t very expensive.. about $130 per coil.
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- #5
I am also considering going back with OE springs but there is a part of me that wants to go ahead and put an entire Dobinsons kit on it and go up a few inches and upgrade to heavier duty springs all around. I just hate to have to get rid of brand new struts and springs that have only been installed for a few months.
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- #6
1st world problems I suppose.
my 15 stock springs at 70k miles were saggy and provided an unacceptable ride quality when loaded with my family and normal luggage for a trip. first thing I changed when I bought it.
You’ll get a bit of money for them on here if they are low mileage. Not a huge market for stock suspension but there are some people that would jump at the chance for fresh OE stuff to baseline a high mileage truck while they save for more substantial suspension.
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- #9
That’s a good idea. Now, just have to figure out which direction to go in.
Note that the passenger side spring is longer than the driver's side spring (in the USA). So don't assume just because you are leaning to the driver's side that is the reason. Toyota does this intentionally... I haven't weighed my rig left-to-right (just front and rear axles) but I suspect the PS is slightly heavier, especially when the fuel tank is full, and this different tries to account for that.
Toyota says if your left-to-right lean is within 15mm (a bit over 1/2") it is within spec and there's nothing to worry about. If it's more than that they recommend starting with the KDSS leveling procedure (though I've personally not found it does much, YMMV).
Stock springs are soft, and I found particularly with 3 kids in the middle row and a set of bikes on the trailer hitch I'd routinely hit the bump stops when going at even fairly low speeds over a speed bump. New heavier springs (OEM are 170#/in, whereas OME are 270#/in or more) may result in more rear rake even if you get some which are designed for no additional lift. It's a trade off between ride height, comfort, and handling, and you may find new aftermarket springs end up feeling bouncier if you're not carrying additional loads regularly to compensate. (Think 1 ton F350 with an empty bed vs a small half-ton truck)
Springs will break in and settle a bit over time - I'm still happy with mine but after 35k miles they did settle maybe 1/2" - though OTOH the ride is very nice now when anything in the rear adding a little weight.
Springs can sag over time. Generally speaking, spring sag only effects its load height, i.e. ride height. Steel coil springs won't see appreciable spring rate change over time.
Shocks can and do wear too. Beginning pretty much the moment the vehicle is put on the road. Toyota shocks tend to be tuned with mild low speed compression damping. With wear, reduced low speed compression damping can be a problem.
Much of what's described above with bottomed out, especially if its happening without much load, I would attribute more to the latter. New shocks (rather than springs) should do wonders. Aftermarket shocks can change the feel dramatically too if a tighter handling/damped feel is what your looking for. Almost all of the supple ride comfort and off-road articulation of the stock spring rates, with more control is probably what I'd do. More static weight added would call for more spring rate though.
Spring spacers can address the ride height (and side to side sag) easily and cheaply. There's many sizes available including 5/10/20/30mm and more. The spring spacer heights are usually 1:1, spacer height to ride height. Mix a 5mm with a 10mm on the lower sagging side to compensate for age should do. With the Toyota OE front shock spacer, I'd definitely add at least a rear 10 if not 20mm spacer. More spacer for more added static weight like aux tanks, gear, fridge, etc, to maintain ride heights.
Airbags would be an awesome thing too for rigs seeing hugely different loads like trailering. Keeping unladen ride comfort, while allowing for more load support when its needed.
Shocks can and do wear too. Beginning pretty much the moment the vehicle is put on the road. Toyota shocks tend to be tuned with mild low speed compression damping. With wear, reduced low speed compression damping can be a problem.
Much of what's described above with bottomed out, especially if its happening without much load, I would attribute more to the latter. New shocks (rather than springs) should do wonders. Aftermarket shocks can change the feel dramatically too if a tighter handling/damped feel is what your looking for. Almost all of the supple ride comfort and off-road articulation of the stock spring rates, with more control is probably what I'd do. More static weight added would call for more spring rate though.
Spring spacers can address the ride height (and side to side sag) easily and cheaply. There's many sizes available including 5/10/20/30mm and more. The spring spacer heights are usually 1:1, spacer height to ride height. Mix a 5mm with a 10mm on the lower sagging side to compensate for age should do. With the Toyota OE front shock spacer, I'd definitely add at least a rear 10 if not 20mm spacer. More spacer for more added static weight like aux tanks, gear, fridge, etc, to maintain ride heights.
Airbags would be an awesome thing too for rigs seeing hugely different loads like trailering. Keeping unladen ride comfort, while allowing for more load support when its needed.
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- #12
This is all very good and useful information. Thank you all very much for giving your input!